Anybody buy or sell a 911R recently?
04-18-2018, 03:41 AM
#436
04-18-2018, 08:42 AM
#437
Banned
04-18-2018, 09:05 AM
#438
[QUOTE=Johisco;14950171]So just avbove 200, - but I guess the spec has something to do with it 
https://www.porschefairfield.com/det...-16823295.html
Just (239,000.00 above).
https://www.porschefairfield.com/det...-16823295.html
Just (239,000.00 above).
04-18-2018, 10:59 AM
#439
Rennlist Member
I mean, you can saw the roof off of a sports car to make it a convertible too...doesn't make it a great one...
04-18-2018, 11:37 AM
#440
Race Director
Originally Posted by sechsgang
I mean, you can saw the roof off of a sports car to make it a convertible too...doesn't make it a great one...
04-18-2018, 01:07 PM
#441
Banned
No that's not a good analogy. We're not talking about structural changes.. you can make suspension adjustments to change a car'a behavior. Porsche caters to buyers who want a car setup out of the box with certain characteristics, so they tune a car with minor differences to appeal to different buyers.. but he's saying the buyer can change the behavior of that car quite easily.
04-18-2018, 01:53 PM
#442
Three Wheelin'
As of late any GT car (including Turbo S Exclusive Series) that is Limited and Numbered, will always command premium pricing or ADM.
LINK:
PORSCHE - PTS 997 4.0
Drive safe,
GT3RS-Fan1
LINK:
PORSCHE - PTS 997 4.0
Drive safe,
GT3RS-Fan1
The entire dilemma starts with the trend in the early 2000's. Paddles, semi-automatic gearbox, lap time, etc. When Porsche began development on the 991 GT3 they believed that their customer wanted a faster car. There is no dispute that a PDK is faster, easier to drive and gets better fuel economy than a similar car with a manual transmission. As I stated, only three short years ago one of the largest dealerships in the world told me that they can't sell a MT car. I was also told by a Porsche exec back in (approximately) 2012 that Porsche would end manual transmissions with the 991.2.
Then the economy got better in the U.S. Everybody watched car shows on TV. Everybody became a car collector. Everybody went to "cars and Coffee." Everybody wanted to go to the track. Porsche had no idea that the demand for a MT GT NA 911 would be so strong. They certainly didn't think it would cause a political explosion with their customers. First they were only going to make 600 911 R's. Then, well you guys know. There are people on RL that don't get it either. And rightfully so. The PDK is better than a manual gearbox in every measurable way. But to me, and others it's just no fun. I quit buying and racing the red cars when the gated shifter went away!
Now you have the NA issue. This is a matter of more stringent emissions laws throughout the world. Porsche doesn't have a choice. And that's also true for the decision for the Mission E. If they want to continue to produce sports cars they need to balance their fleet with "0" emission cars.
There was never a scheme or grand plan. The models and sub-models take years of development. And then there's VW. They ultimately control what Porsche does. In some ways that's good. They only care about the money. Limited? There will be a lot of GT3's. There will even be a fair number of GT2's. Even the volume of "numbered" cars will be more than the 911R. Ferrari used to say that they want to make 1 less car than there is demand. Porsche has now gotten very good at implementing this strategy.
Then the economy got better in the U.S. Everybody watched car shows on TV. Everybody became a car collector. Everybody went to "cars and Coffee." Everybody wanted to go to the track. Porsche had no idea that the demand for a MT GT NA 911 would be so strong. They certainly didn't think it would cause a political explosion with their customers. First they were only going to make 600 911 R's. Then, well you guys know. There are people on RL that don't get it either. And rightfully so. The PDK is better than a manual gearbox in every measurable way. But to me, and others it's just no fun. I quit buying and racing the red cars when the gated shifter went away!
Now you have the NA issue. This is a matter of more stringent emissions laws throughout the world. Porsche doesn't have a choice. And that's also true for the decision for the Mission E. If they want to continue to produce sports cars they need to balance their fleet with "0" emission cars.
There was never a scheme or grand plan. The models and sub-models take years of development. And then there's VW. They ultimately control what Porsche does. In some ways that's good. They only care about the money. Limited? There will be a lot of GT3's. There will even be a fair number of GT2's. Even the volume of "numbered" cars will be more than the 911R. Ferrari used to say that they want to make 1 less car than there is demand. Porsche has now gotten very good at implementing this strategy.
04-18-2018, 02:25 PM
#443
Rennlist Member
As of late, yes. But the premium pricing is only because of the economy. Anything that needs to be advertised as limited and/or collectible generally isn’t.
04-18-2018, 03:22 PM
#444
When I got my R allocation I was excited about getting the 991.1 GT3RS motor *with* a manual transmission. Big bonus was all of that in a wingless GT3 body. The carbon fiber and magnesium bits = don't care and the numbered / exclusivity was for me a negative because the way my brain works it meant I'd drive it less and pay a lot more to insure it for full market value which we all knew would be nuts.
Having driven both the R and the new GT3, I like the GT3 motor better, I like the steering better, the tarpan and pepita interior is nice in the R but lots of us add the peptic inserts, the SMF is cool but the new motor revs eagerly, I do like the notch in the R hood and roof, but really, if both of these cars were to launch today and they're both optioned up, I wouldn't choose the R, I don't think many would if it weren't for the R's exclusivity.
All of us make decisions based on various factors and for the collectors its clear which is the "better" car. For those of us who care less or don't care at all about exclusivity I'm not sure what the longing or nostalgia is about.
As for adding R decals, the 991 R is an homage to another historic car and putting decals on the GT3T is the same kind of homage, not sure I understand the point of view that this happening because somebody laments not getting an R. That's not why my GT3T will have side stripes.
Having driven both the R and the new GT3, I like the GT3 motor better, I like the steering better, the tarpan and pepita interior is nice in the R but lots of us add the peptic inserts, the SMF is cool but the new motor revs eagerly, I do like the notch in the R hood and roof, but really, if both of these cars were to launch today and they're both optioned up, I wouldn't choose the R, I don't think many would if it weren't for the R's exclusivity.
All of us make decisions based on various factors and for the collectors its clear which is the "better" car. For those of us who care less or don't care at all about exclusivity I'm not sure what the longing or nostalgia is about.
As for adding R decals, the 991 R is an homage to another historic car and putting decals on the GT3T is the same kind of homage, not sure I understand the point of view that this happening because somebody laments not getting an R. That's not why my GT3T will have side stripes.
04-18-2018, 04:28 PM
#446
When I got my R allocation I was excited about getting the 991.1 GT3RS motor *with* a manual transmission. Big bonus was all of that in a wingless GT3 body. The carbon fiber and magnesium bits = don't care and the numbered / exclusivity was for me a negative because the way my brain works it meant I'd drive it less and pay a lot more to insure it for full market value which we all knew would be nuts.
Having driven both the R and the new GT3, I like the GT3 motor better, I like the steering better, the tarpan and pepita interior is nice in the R but lots of us add the peptic inserts, the SMF is cool but the new motor revs eagerly, I do like the notch in the R hood and roof, but really, if both of these cars were to launch today and they're both optioned up, I wouldn't choose the R, I don't think many would if it weren't for the R's exclusivity.
All of us make decisions based on various factors and for the collectors its clear which is the "better" car. For those of us who care less or don't care at all about exclusivity I'm not sure what the longing or nostalgia is about.
As for adding R decals, the 991 R is an homage to another historic car and putting decals on the GT3T is the same kind of homage, not sure I understand the point of view that this happening because somebody laments not getting an R. That's not why my GT3T will have side stripes.
Having driven both the R and the new GT3, I like the GT3 motor better, I like the steering better, the tarpan and pepita interior is nice in the R but lots of us add the peptic inserts, the SMF is cool but the new motor revs eagerly, I do like the notch in the R hood and roof, but really, if both of these cars were to launch today and they're both optioned up, I wouldn't choose the R, I don't think many would if it weren't for the R's exclusivity.
All of us make decisions based on various factors and for the collectors its clear which is the "better" car. For those of us who care less or don't care at all about exclusivity I'm not sure what the longing or nostalgia is about.
As for adding R decals, the 991 R is an homage to another historic car and putting decals on the GT3T is the same kind of homage, not sure I understand the point of view that this happening because somebody laments not getting an R. That's not why my GT3T will have side stripes.
Just out of interest, how long did you keep R/how many miles?
04-18-2018, 05:29 PM
#447
When I got my R allocation I was excited about getting the 991.1 GT3RS motor *with* a manual transmission. Big bonus was all of that in a wingless GT3 body. The carbon fiber and magnesium bits = don't care and the numbered / exclusivity was for me a negative because the way my brain works it meant I'd drive it less and pay a lot more to insure it for full market value which we all knew would be nuts.
Having driven both the R and the new GT3, I like the GT3 motor better, I like the steering better, the tarpan and pepita interior is nice in the R but lots of us add the peptic inserts, the SMF is cool but the new motor revs eagerly, I do like the notch in the R hood and roof, but really, if both of these cars were to launch today and they're both optioned up, I wouldn't choose the R, I don't think many would if it weren't for the R's exclusivity.
All of us make decisions based on various factors and for the collectors its clear which is the "better" car. For those of us who care less or don't care at all about exclusivity I'm not sure what the longing or nostalgia is about.
As for adding R decals, the 991 R is an homage to another historic car and putting decals on the GT3T is the same kind of homage, not sure I understand the point of view that this happening because somebody laments not getting an R. That's not why my GT3T will have side stripes.
Having driven both the R and the new GT3, I like the GT3 motor better, I like the steering better, the tarpan and pepita interior is nice in the R but lots of us add the peptic inserts, the SMF is cool but the new motor revs eagerly, I do like the notch in the R hood and roof, but really, if both of these cars were to launch today and they're both optioned up, I wouldn't choose the R, I don't think many would if it weren't for the R's exclusivity.
All of us make decisions based on various factors and for the collectors its clear which is the "better" car. For those of us who care less or don't care at all about exclusivity I'm not sure what the longing or nostalgia is about.
As for adding R decals, the 991 R is an homage to another historic car and putting decals on the GT3T is the same kind of homage, not sure I understand the point of view that this happening because somebody laments not getting an R. That's not why my GT3T will have side stripes.
Last edited by GT3; 04-18-2018 at 05:56 PM.
04-18-2018, 06:15 PM
#448
Most all of the cars that we - don't - talk about here ... that are the bread and butter that support the bottom line can be bought new for under MSRP today. When the economy turns we will again be having a discussions about things like manufacturers loading unwanted cars onto dealer lots by force ... (it's already a bit like that truth be told). I think Porsche does understand this and that there are bigger things to worry about than the next limited edition release ... and in this light the Touring makes a lot of sense as a business model as compared to trying to develop, market, sell and support a higher priced limited edition run of 1,000 cars. A singular model platform but with clearly differentiated sub models is a lot more conservative and I think intelligent approach that can allow for a series to sell at or above MSRP - even in a weaker economy - if production volume is properly managed.
04-18-2018, 08:16 PM
#449
Rennlist Member
When all the dust settles, and it’s 10-15 years out, we will see what these cars are really worth. I know my .2 GT3 will not be worth much since I plan to use and enjoy it as it should be. I’m in the same boat as Robmypro.
Have always worked hard for my money and, still, investing in material things seem odd to me. I know I need to invest in real estate, but being free of the burden of the market, flippers, scammers for me is priceless.
Life is short boys and girls. If you are lucky enough to own one of these cars, you are privileged. Enjoy what you have! Many will dream even driving one of these.
Have always worked hard for my money and, still, investing in material things seem odd to me. I know I need to invest in real estate, but being free of the burden of the market, flippers, scammers for me is priceless.
Life is short boys and girls. If you are lucky enough to own one of these cars, you are privileged. Enjoy what you have! Many will dream even driving one of these.
04-18-2018, 08:31 PM
#450
Red Route will likely reply but I am not sure he ever took ownership of an R - I do recall him posting about getting to drive one for an afternoon and I think the steering and SMFW were two of the things he liked most. I think that is the same for the GT3 manual as I believe he bought one and then when Touring came out he wanted that so he gave the GT3 back to dealer for them to sell at delivery (that may have been the case with the R as well) but did mention he got out for a drive in the GT3 one afternoon. He clearly has access to many great cars and you can't argue with his personal preference, everybody has a different set of variables they consider. I expect he will enjoy his Touring - who wouldn't. As for personal preference - I have no issue driving the R and I am not worried about miles or insurance - especially for those who had access to car at MSRP. Its a great car and at the time I bought mine the GT3 manual and Touring edition news was already out. But after a drive in the R it connected with me in a way that made me want to own it and drive it - again YMMV not here to convert or convince anyone.. All of us enjoying the GT3 cars or any flavor should not be worried about noise levels, suspension settings, solid lifters, Wing/No wing, etc... All of them are likely more car than we will ever experience or wring out either on the track or especially on the street. Its funny as those that say there is No Hate are the most active... I personally don’t feel a need to proclaim one flavor as better than another...seems silly. Buy what you like, don't waste time on values and drive it to the best of your ability - very few here will be limited by the car - regardless of GT3 flavor
Last edited by TylerCoupe; 04-18-2018 at 08:48 PM.