New GT3/GT2RS Leads With/Without ADM
03-13-2019, 09:31 PM
#4156
Rennlist Member
You’re confused. Franchise laws FORCE manufactirers to sell through dealers. Capitalism would be if/when anyone was free to sell to whoemever they want or directly to the highest bidder. A dealer getting 10 allocations (below market, at invoice) for himself, then attaching obscene adm’s to them thus creating fake scarcity is not capitalism — it’s crony capitalism at best, and (dealer) socialism at worst.
03-13-2019, 09:41 PM
#4157
Race Car
No, I'm not confused at all. You don't have to buy a Porsche. Plenty of other brands out there if you don't like their games. Just like there are other homebuilders if buyers don't like my games. Tesla is slowly proving the need of dealers. It's impossible to build an in house service set up for everyone everywhere and do it well. My prediction is Tesla caves at some point and will go with dealers too.
03-13-2019, 09:49 PM
#4158
Racer
Buyer looking for a 2RS simply evaluates the various cars available and buys the one he/she likes at a price acceptable to them -- in this case $357k. Regardless of what you call it, the buyer's premium is known in advance and part of that "price". Seller chose to go the auction route, rather than other avenues, and turn over a big chunk to the house. The "market transaction price" was simply shared by the seller and the house. That's how I see it. Others might see it differently.
03-13-2019, 09:54 PM
#4159
Racer
I don't get the point of auctioning current model cars. If that seller had posted the car at $325k firm here on rennlist he probably would have sold at that price within a week or two. What did the buyer and seller achieve by crossing at an auction aside from pissing money away.
03-13-2019, 10:29 PM
#4160
Banned
No, I'm not confused at all. You don't have to buy a Porsche. Plenty of other brands out there if you don't like their games. Just like there are other homebuilders if buyers don't like my games. Tesla is slowly proving the need of dealers. It's impossible to build an in house service set up for everyone everywhere and do it well. My prediction is Tesla caves at some point and will go with dealers too.
03-13-2019, 10:37 PM
#4161
Rennlist Member
You do understand that dealer franchise laws din’t only apply to Porsche, no? The “game” here is that a bunch of dealers have lobbied goons with guns to threaten manufacturers with force if they don’t exclusively sell their product through the dealer cartel. You are confused if you think that this has anything to do with capitalism or free markets.
03-13-2019, 11:20 PM
#4162
03-13-2019, 11:35 PM
#4163
Banned
Why would OEMs let "anyone" who would ruin their brands sell their cars? Why not just let them sell their cars however they want, just like producers of phones, carrots, and shoes do it?
Porsche tried to do just that in the 80's and the dealer lobby stopped it. Maybe Tesla will have better luck.
03-13-2019, 11:45 PM
#4164
Banned
Buyer looking for a 2RS simply evaluates the various cars available and buys the one he/she likes at a price acceptable to them -- in this case $357k. Regardless of what you call it, the buyer's premium is known in advance and part of that "price". Seller chose to go the auction route, rather than other avenues, and turn over a big chunk to the house. The "market transaction price" was simply shared by the seller and the house. That's how I see it. Others might see it differently.
03-14-2019, 12:02 AM
#4165
In the same way, the seller evaluates the various buyers available and sells to the one he likes at the price acceptable to him -- in this case $304k. Why is the price that's acceptable to the buyer more "relevant" than the price that's acceptable to the seller? There are buyers and sellers in a market, one doesn't go without the other.
03-14-2019, 12:03 AM
#4166
In the same way, the seller evaluates the various buyers available and sells to the one he likes at the price acceptable to him -- in this case $304k. Why is the price that's acceptable to the buyer more "relevant" than the price that's acceptable to the seller? There are buyers and sellers in a market, one doesn't go without the other.
03-14-2019, 01:29 AM
#4167
Banned
1. The total price the buyer pays.
2. The net price the seller receives
3. Transaction costs = 1 - 2
Both 1 and 2 are equally relevant as market prices. 1 is acceptable to a buyer and 2 is acceptable to a seller. 2 is a data point reflecting a price at which a seller is willing to sell, just like 1 is a price at which a buyer is willing to buy.
03-14-2019, 01:42 AM
#4168
I know this won't happen, but it'd be cool if Porsche sold cars direct like Tesla and then would deliver the cars to the local dealers (paying the dealers a fee for each delivery) and then the dealer would provide repair/service (it's this dept that pays the bills at dealers anyhow).
Riddle me this, why is it that Ferrari "encourages" their US dealers to sell their cars at MSRP and Porsche can't or won't?
Riddle me this, why is it that Ferrari "encourages" their US dealers to sell their cars at MSRP and Porsche can't or won't?
03-14-2019, 01:51 AM
#4169
I know this won't happen, but it'd be cool if Porsche sold cars direct like Tesla and then would deliver the cars to the local dealers (paying the dealers a fee for each delivery) and then the dealer would provide repair/service (it's this dept that pays the bills at dealers anyhow).
Riddle me this, why is it that Ferrari "encourages" their US dealers to sell their cars at MSRP and Porsche can't or won't?
Riddle me this, why is it that Ferrari "encourages" their US dealers to sell their cars at MSRP and Porsche can't or won't?
03-14-2019, 01:52 AM
#4170
Ferrari dealers play plenty of games - "sponsor our race team", "you must buy cars you don't want, before we allocate you something good". etc.