3 reasons why a choose a Manual over a PDK
03-14-2017, 11:46 AM
#31
This argument reminds me of the claim my 944 wasn't a "real Porsche" nor were any other variants with two cylinders lopped off. Even today with turbo engines that silly argument is still in the discussion. I wonder how many of you are shifting your "not really Porsche cars" lol. For that matter, all of us with liquid cooling have "coolant blood on our hands" are are driving non Porsche cars too!
03-14-2017, 12:19 PM
#32
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Anyone who argues that PDK isn't a good product and isn't in the spirit of Porsche is short sighted.
There's nothing wrong with having a preference for manual or PDK, they're both incredible and each has its benefits and shortcomings. As always, it's great to have the choice and I for one appreciate that Porsche isn't sitting on its laurels while everyone around them passes by. I'm also glad they haven't forgotten those that still like the old school stuff in their modern cars.
There's nothing wrong with having a preference for manual or PDK, they're both incredible and each has its benefits and shortcomings. As always, it's great to have the choice and I for one appreciate that Porsche isn't sitting on its laurels while everyone around them passes by. I'm also glad they haven't forgotten those that still like the old school stuff in their modern cars.
03-14-2017, 01:47 PM
#33
Nordschleife Master
Anyone who argues that PDK isn't a good product and isn't in the spirit of Porsche is short sighted.
There's nothing wrong with having a preference for manual or PDK, they're both incredible and each has its benefits and shortcomings. As always, it's great to have the choice and I for one appreciate that Porsche isn't sitting on its laurels while everyone around them passes by. I'm also glad they haven't forgotten those that still like the old school stuff in their modern cars.
There's nothing wrong with having a preference for manual or PDK, they're both incredible and each has its benefits and shortcomings. As always, it's great to have the choice and I for one appreciate that Porsche isn't sitting on its laurels while everyone around them passes by. I'm also glad they haven't forgotten those that still like the old school stuff in their modern cars.
03-14-2017, 02:23 PM
#34
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Referring to a manual transmission as "old school" is rather myopic. One could argue the same with respect to choosing a 991 over a 981/982. The 981/982 is "clearly" the superior platform from an engineering point of view, yet some of us still prefer the "old school" 911. See how this works? One man's "old school" is another man's life choice...
It's pretty much universally accepted that the PDK is the best/smartest/quickest automatic transmission in the industry. Leave it to Porsche to achieve such performance from an automatic. Bravo, Porsche!
People often rationalize their purchase of a PDK by (rightly) siting it's incredible performance, which is superior to that of any manual transmission. But then, these same people drive around manually, or, more precisely, digitally (as in: using ones fingers) shifting their PDKs. Why do they do this, when Porsche and most professional testers tell all of us that PDK-equipped cars are faster when left in "D" and allowed to shift themselves?
The answer is that these people crave increased involvement in the operation of their vehicles, and they crave this involvement to such an extent that they're even willing to knowingly sacrifice a bit of ultimate speed for the sake of that increased involvement/enjoyment. Simply, they have more fun, and enjoy their cars more, when they shift for themselves.
This is one reason why the rest of us are willing to commit to an actual third pedal. We, too, care more about our enjoyment of our cars than we do about saving a split-second here or there.
Another reason is that some of us are not made of money, so we also take into account both the savings in purchase price (and depreciation) over a PDK, and our ability to maintain our manual transmissions in our own driveways.
The "less weight" argument proffered by many manual devotees is the real-world equivalent to the "shifts faster" argument by many PDK devotees...that is, it is factually true, but only to an extent that's functionally "lost in the noise" for things that will matter out on the highways and back roads of reality.
To each, his own...and thank Porsche that we still have a choice between the two!
It's pretty much universally accepted that the PDK is the best/smartest/quickest automatic transmission in the industry. Leave it to Porsche to achieve such performance from an automatic. Bravo, Porsche!
People often rationalize their purchase of a PDK by (rightly) siting it's incredible performance, which is superior to that of any manual transmission. But then, these same people drive around manually, or, more precisely, digitally (as in: using ones fingers) shifting their PDKs. Why do they do this, when Porsche and most professional testers tell all of us that PDK-equipped cars are faster when left in "D" and allowed to shift themselves?
The answer is that these people crave increased involvement in the operation of their vehicles, and they crave this involvement to such an extent that they're even willing to knowingly sacrifice a bit of ultimate speed for the sake of that increased involvement/enjoyment. Simply, they have more fun, and enjoy their cars more, when they shift for themselves.
This is one reason why the rest of us are willing to commit to an actual third pedal. We, too, care more about our enjoyment of our cars than we do about saving a split-second here or there.
Another reason is that some of us are not made of money, so we also take into account both the savings in purchase price (and depreciation) over a PDK, and our ability to maintain our manual transmissions in our own driveways.
The "less weight" argument proffered by many manual devotees is the real-world equivalent to the "shifts faster" argument by many PDK devotees...that is, it is factually true, but only to an extent that's functionally "lost in the noise" for things that will matter out on the highways and back roads of reality.
To each, his own...and thank Porsche that we still have a choice between the two!
Last edited by 1analguy; 03-16-2017 at 01:17 PM.
03-14-2017, 04:28 PM
#35
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03-15-2017, 08:40 AM
#37
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Referring to a manual transmission as "old school" is rather myopic. One could argue the same with respect to choosing a 991 over a 981/982. The 981/982 is "clearly" the superior platform from an engineering point of view, yet some of us still prefer the "old school" 911. See how this works? One man's "old school" is another man's life choice...
It's pretty much universally accepted that the PDK is the best/smartest/quickest automatic transmission in the industry. Leave it to Porsche to achieve such performance from an automatic. Bravo, Porsche!
People often rationalize their purchase of a PDK by (rightly) siting it's incredible performance, which is superior to that of any manual transmission. But then, these same people drive around manually, or, more precisely, digitally (as in: using ones fingers) shifting their PDKs. Why do they do this, when Porsche and most professional testers tell all of us that PDK-equipped cars are faster when left in "D" and allowed to shift themselves?
The answer is that these people crave increased involvement in the operation of their vehicles, and they crave this involvement to such an extent that they're even willing to knowingly sacrifice a bit of ultimate speed for the sake of that increased involvement/enjoyment. Simply, they have more fun, and enjoy their cars more, when they shift for themselves.
This is one reason why the rest of us are willing to commit to an actual third peddle. We, too, care more about our enjoyment of our cars than we do about saving a split-second here or there.
Another reason is that some of us are not made of money, so we also take into account both the savings in purchase price (and depreciation) over a PDK, and our ability to maintain our manual transmissions in our own driveways.
The "less weight" argument proffered by many manual devotees is the real-world equivalent to the "shifts faster" argument by many PDK devotees...that is, it is factually true, but only to an extent that's functionally "lost in the noise" for things that will matter out on the highways and back roads of reality.
To each, his own...and thank Porsche that we still have a choice between the two!
It's pretty much universally accepted that the PDK is the best/smartest/quickest automatic transmission in the industry. Leave it to Porsche to achieve such performance from an automatic. Bravo, Porsche!
People often rationalize their purchase of a PDK by (rightly) siting it's incredible performance, which is superior to that of any manual transmission. But then, these same people drive around manually, or, more precisely, digitally (as in: using ones fingers) shifting their PDKs. Why do they do this, when Porsche and most professional testers tell all of us that PDK-equipped cars are faster when left in "D" and allowed to shift themselves?
The answer is that these people crave increased involvement in the operation of their vehicles, and they crave this involvement to such an extent that they're even willing to knowingly sacrifice a bit of ultimate speed for the sake of that increased involvement/enjoyment. Simply, they have more fun, and enjoy their cars more, when they shift for themselves.
This is one reason why the rest of us are willing to commit to an actual third peddle. We, too, care more about our enjoyment of our cars than we do about saving a split-second here or there.
Another reason is that some of us are not made of money, so we also take into account both the savings in purchase price (and depreciation) over a PDK, and our ability to maintain our manual transmissions in our own driveways.
The "less weight" argument proffered by many manual devotees is the real-world equivalent to the "shifts faster" argument by many PDK devotees...that is, it is factually true, but only to an extent that's functionally "lost in the noise" for things that will matter out on the highways and back roads of reality.
To each, his own...and thank Porsche that we still have a choice between the two!
03-15-2017, 02:55 PM
#38
Race Car
It fails to amaze me - after all the testimonials and descriptions why people keep referring, more diss'ing, the PDK as an "automatic". It's a double-clutch, manually operated, transmission, that oh yeah - has an "automatic" function. Diss away non-believers all you want. I used to too.
03-15-2017, 06:29 PM
#39
There's a big difference driving a PDK as full auto than as an automated manual. Many of us exclusively drive in manual mode, where it's much closer to a manual. I'd had chosen a manual if 6th @ 3K rpm was good for at least 85 mph, but 72 is just ridiculous, since most of my miles on my toy cars are on trips. Heck, PDK in 6th does 74, and 108 in 7th. The truth is after owning it for a while, even if the manual was good for 85, I'd choose the PDK again. It's great to let my wife and daughters drive the car, and it's a fantastic transmission: it has parking, revmatches very aggressively, instant shifts, paddle neutral, and very nice paddle action. Plus no chance of overrevs, botched shifts, etc. As a hard-core manual guy, I was aprehensive at the beginning, but couldn't be happier now. It's clearly the superior transmission now, equal to any other exotic. The 6-sp manual is not top-dog anymore, with a rubbery shifter that leaves something to be desired. I hear the GT4/Spyder sihfter is improved. I'd definitely go that direction if I owned a manual.
03-16-2017, 01:20 PM
#41
Errrm i assume you watched the video's at the begining of the thread on why the manual is great option... well may be i guess not.
Last edited by michaelscain; 03-16-2017 at 01:40 PM.
03-16-2017, 01:50 PM
#42
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It fails to amaze me - after all the testimonials and descriptions why people keep referring, more diss'ing, the PDK as an "automatic". It's a double-clutch, manually operated, transmission, that oh yeah - has an "automatic" function. Diss away non-believers all you want. I used to too.
Last edited by 1analguy; 03-24-2017 at 10:41 AM.
03-16-2017, 04:15 PM
#43
Race Car
When I was a kid, my dad had a '53 Desoto Firedome with a straight six and "Fluid Drive" transmission. It had a column shifter with P-N-R-D but it had a clutch! To shift from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd, you simply put it in Drive, then when you reached your desired speed/RPM, you depressed the clutch and it shifted to the next highest gear. Was that an automatic or a manual? All I know, it was a mutt and didn't last long before Desoto replaced it with a full automatic. But it was pretty cool!!
03-16-2017, 05:18 PM
#44
I'm used to better manual transmissions, like the Graziano, with rod linkages, not a cable one, like on Porsches. And that the shifter is rubbery is far from just my opinion; most testers have expressed the same opinion (except on GT cars). The good news is it's rubbery, but very precise.
That's absolutely correct. I don't like when people try to defend their choice against reality. The manual tranny is not the best, but my PDK is an automatic, not an 'automated manual', that some folks use to justify it as a manual. Ha ha. It's the best DCT though, since it has a parking pawl, and it's one of the smoothest. But any good DCT has aggressive throttle blipping, plus basically instantaneous shifting up or down, which is very rewarding when driven manually (as opposed to most conventional ones).
That's absolutely correct. I don't like when people try to defend their choice against reality. The manual tranny is not the best, but my PDK is an automatic, not an 'automated manual', that some folks use to justify it as a manual. Ha ha. It's the best DCT though, since it has a parking pawl, and it's one of the smoothest. But any good DCT has aggressive throttle blipping, plus basically instantaneous shifting up or down, which is very rewarding when driven manually (as opposed to most conventional ones).
03-16-2017, 07:37 PM
#45
Rod linkages are still actuating hydraulics, the feel of a clutch that is directly actuated without hydraulics is exceptional in it's grab point feedback. The old school, non hydraulic clutches had the best feel in my humble opinion.