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987.1 some extra metal in the oil filter

 
Old 07-07-2019, 11:50 PM
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NYC993
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Default 987.1 some extra metal in the oil filter

Pulled the filter for the usual oil change and found it a bit extra sparkly (see pics below). I have seen much worse...but usually on engines in non running condition. This engine still runs fine. The filter has 1000 track miles on it. The oil was also sent for the analysis.

Question:
I don't know if I should park it and start the engine tear down or continue tracking and monitor (pull filter after each day). I'd appreciate Jake chiming in or pointing to another thread.
I would like to rebuild or at least tear it down to see the condition and then get an RND motor. But open to other suggestions.

Car history:
Bought it bone stock with 87k miles. It was far from perfect cosmetically, but it didn't smoke at start up and ran great. We replaced pretty much everything on it before taking it to the track (deeps sump, motorsports AOS, 3rd rad, under-drive pulley, PS cooler, Diff cooler and other track mods, basically building it to SPC class car for club racing down the road). I drive in instructor group so I knew I would be pushing the car pretty hard pretty quickly. I only used XP9 oil and changed it every 500 miles (about 2 events). I've put 5k track miles over last year and a half on this car. Not bad for 13 year old toyota, I mean porsche.

The only thing that was "wrong" were occasional misfires usually when engine is cold. We thought it might have to do with absence of SAI, which we removed in order to add MS AOS. Only once misfire CEL came up when car was warmed up. When misfires happened they were across the board on all cylinders. But again, when car was running for a few minutes they were all gone (confirmed with looking at actual values with Durametric)

Pics of the filter:




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Old 07-08-2019, 02:35 PM
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NYC993
That is disappointing! The fact that the pieces are ferrous leans toward bearing material which is worry some. Check Flat 6 you tube channel for the videos on bore scoring, which would be more indicated by aluminum and Silica in the filter and oil. Since it sounds like you are using this as a track car it might be wise to not drive it until you get your UOA results and more information. Misfires could be do to coils which weren't mentioned in all the updates done. Has there been any codes?
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Old 07-08-2019, 06:03 PM
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Looks like it was track prepped properly, but I dont see anything about an IMS retrofit or replacement, so my guess would be that is whats going on.
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Old 07-09-2019, 02:18 AM
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5k TRACK miles in 1.5 years?!! Impressive!!

Is this the first time checked the oil filter since buying the car? How many times has the oil filter been replaced?

My first inclination is it's the original IMS bearing degrading. Was it changed?

I've actually wondered how long the original IMS bearing would last on an M96 that's used for tracking.
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Old 07-11-2019, 05:50 AM
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I’ll purchase car as is for 25k. Then you can track that pretty 993 like the old days.
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:01 AM
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Also “OP couldn't find an apex with 2 hands, a map, and a flashlight.”
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Anthony Romano View Post
NYC993
That is disappointing! The fact that the pieces are ferrous leans toward bearing material which is worry some. Check Flat 6 you tube channel for the videos on bore scoring, which would be more indicated by aluminum and Silica in the filter and oil. Since it sounds like you are using this as a track car it might be wise to not drive it until you get your UOA results and more information. Misfires could be do to coils which weren't mentioned in all the updates done. Has there been any codes?
Yea I've seen various Flat 6 vids. Jake chimed in on FB and thinks the car should not be driven and I'm lucky I caught it early.
I had no other codes (besides misfire codes). Coils and plugs were replaced.
I decided to park it. The copper flakes are concerning, so we'll be rebuilding the engine and will try to document it. The plan is to drop the engine in two weeks and start the tear down.
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Code View Post
Looks like it was track prepped properly, but I dont see anything about an IMS retrofit or replacement, so my guess would be that is whats going on.
Yes it's basically SPC class car for PCA racing without full cage. JRZs, LSD, all cooling and preventive mods. I've been having lots of fun building and driving it over past year and half. More fun to be had!
IMS is less of an issue on M97 and replacement requires taking engine apart. It will get replaced.
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Prelude Guy View Post
5k TRACK miles in 1.5 years?!! Impressive!!

Is this the first time checked the oil filter since buying the car? How many times has the oil filter been replaced?

My first inclination is it's the original IMS bearing degrading. Was it changed?

I've actually wondered how long the original IMS bearing would last on an M96 that's used for tracking.
Lol no, I've done like 10 oil changes and replaced 8 filters since I bought and tracked the car. Hence I freaked out, because other filters were pretty clean previous times. In fact, I saved some of them and was able to compare.

This is M97 not M96 so IMS bearing is less of an issue and not easily replaceable. But these engines are not well designed or made, so I knew this was just matter of time on 90k mile engine.
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Red998 View Post
I’ll purchase car as is for 25k. Then you can track that pretty 993 like the old days.
Originally Posted by Red998 View Post
Also “OP couldn't find an apex with 2 hands, a map, and a flashlight.”
It has 25k in new parts.
I make my own apex and racing line...I don't need no stinky maps or flashlights.
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by NYC993 View Post
It has 25k in new parts.
I make my own apex and racing line...I don't need no stinky maps or flashlights.
In mother Russia Apex finds you!
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:59 PM
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Reminds me of our "Hey, Wait For Me" Racing Team...

Our Motto: "If you spin often enough, sooner or later you'll hit an apex."

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