CaymanSinAR

Having spent a week in a 2015 M4 convertible I'm going to have to side with Archimedes on this one. It's bad. Really bad. Even BMW guys know and admit it is bad.

I'm curious to see how they will handle the de-tuned S55 in the upcoming M2 Competition. I hope they can make it sound good. The current N55 in the M2 sounds leaps and bounds better than the M4. If the M2 Competition sounds like the M4 I'd buy a 2016-2018 M2 over the new one. Which, really, is exactly why I'm driving a 981 instead of a 982.

Wild Weasel

Does it tell you how the engine is working? Or does it sound like it's purring along just perfectly no matter what it's actually doing? You think if you've got a bad spark plug and you're down a cylinder it's going to reflect that in the fake engine noise?

If you just want to know where your revs are at so you can shift, then you need a shift light. Not fake noise. That's a terrible solution to that problem.

CaymanSinAR

I've had a bad plug and been down a cylinder before (in an old truck). I didn't need to hear it to know it!

Curious to know the answer to your question. I'm pretty sure it would reflect in the noise. Not so curious I'm going to pull a plug wire though...

Have you ridden in a BMW with active sound? I suspect it's not the experience you expect. There is very little difference between having active sound enabled/disabled. The cabin is simply quieter; it doesn't sound like a different engine. It's funny because you'll have guys who have been driving BMWs for decades on the forum swearing up and down *their* BMW doesn't have active sound. They'd know if it was enhanced through the speakers! Spoiler alert: They are wrong; and it is.

I can't speak to how Ford, Chevy, Ferrari, or anyone else does it though.

I can tell you I'd love it if the engine noise of my NB2 Miata could be replaced with something coming through the speakers. The ND Miatas have a sound tube to direct noise from the intake to the cabin. The biggest problem is it also picks up and delivers lots of other awful noises. Most folks remove the sound tube.

Wild Weasel

I expect it to be well done and for most people to not even know it was happening. That's kinda the whole point. They want it to sound better than it does and this was a solution. If it was obvious, it wouldn't have been a solution.

I don't think it's got a microphone near the engine though and is just relaying the actual engine sounds. My impression is that it's making up a new engine sound to play through the speakers. So I don't expect a mechanical issue to be reflected in it. I mean... presumably you still hear the ACTUAL engine to some extent so you'd hear the issues from there but I expect it to end up out of sync with the fake sound from the speakers.

I really have no idea though. This is all just speculation on my part.

manifold danger

A shift light? We're not talking about drag racing. Maybe I chose the wrong words previously but you're locking in to the wrong argument and missing the point.

You have to be speaking from a position of ignorance. That's not an attack; ignorance simply means you're not aware, and in this case I refuse to believe that you've driven a car for any sort of joyful purpose and felt that there's no need to have clear aural cues of where the engine is at in the rev range.

A few of us have said it here, and I've read it elsewhere; it's about "aural feedback"... it's not about "sounding good", which is subjective anyway. Whoever said the M4 sounds terrible, and the 718 horse has been beat so bad it's lying in a heap of gore... I don't think the same way so we'll agree to disagree (and I also have a 981 Boxster GTS sitting in my garage right now, so I'm not coming from a position of bias from the 718 perspective)... but more to the point here, as CaymanSinAR suggests, you don't need to hear things inside the cabin to figure out you may have a miss. But it IS helpful to not have to stare down the tach while you're driving, whether you're on track or on a Sunday drive.

I feel like telling you to go drive a Macan; for me, that's the personal experience that's pointed me to the source of WHY a manufacturer would inject a false soundtrack. Trust me, it would be welcome in that vehicle but I can see why Porsche elected not to do it in their SUVs; different target market, different demographic where silence is more appealing than noise, even if the car is pretty capable in its own right. Sports cars are a different story... I guess I'm not doing a good job of articulating it but you just have to experience it. The Macan is the best example I can think of, there has to be other vehicles out there that are capable and encourage you to drive them like you WANT to, but don't give you that feedback and you end up feeling that something significant is missing from the experience. THAT is what we're talking about here.

Hell, just go play Forza or Gran Turismo but turn your sound off, or way down. Not the same, is it?

Where I take issue with all the pundits proclaiming it's "stupid", is that I have yet to hear a legitimate reason they don't like it, aside from the fact they don't like it- because it's artificial. All I hear is a strong case of "back in my day"... which is the wrong reason, to me. Cars aren't built like they were 20 years ago, it's time for people to learn to deal with that.... and be appreciative sports cars are making noise at all. They may not be for much longer.

Interestingly enough, the past 3 cars I've had have had some form of "aural enhancement"; the 2015 STI and my current 981 GTS both have mechanical "acoustic channel" types, and the M4 had electrical assistance. To be honest, the only one that wasn't actually a bit annoying was the M4. The Subaru sounded a bit ridiculous with its whooshing and wheezing from the blow-off valve; after I replaced the intake with a Cobb unit the symposer had to be plugged... but the Cobb intake was far noisier than stock anyway so it was about a push. But it sounded better after the intake was installed and the symposer was plugged is my point... my Boxster it gets downright loud in the cabin- it's cool when I'm blasting around town and having fun, but I have to turn off sport mode on the highway. And it's not like the car is quiet with it turned off either, just takes some of the edge off.

The M4, again to reference CaymanSinAR's earlier post- you didn't notice it. It wasn't like it was a blaring, obnoxious synthetic cacophony like I think most people think it would be... it was super subtle and sounded aggressive without being overbearing. Put it this way; if it was sold as an option I'd consider it a must-have. The "acoustic channels" are overkill IMO.

Wild Weasel

Firstly, I mention the shift light because in another thread I questioned the value of shift lights. I never saw the point because I can hear what my engine is doing and use that to know when to shift. Someone asked whether I'd ever tried to start off in a grid of 20+ race cars. It was a good point. The shift light solves exactly the problem of not being able to hear what the engine is doing. It seems to me that the solution to the problem works whether the engine noise is drowned out or just isn't there in the first place.

Next... you're right in my ignorance of the experience. I've never driven a car with fake engine noise. That said... I don't for a moment doubt that it sounds great. Amazing even. Why wouldn't it? It can sound like whatever they want it to. You're also right though in that I specifically dislike the very idea of it because it's artificial.

You talk about the aural feedback and the joy it brings. Part of that is knowing there's a wonderful engine there making those noises. It's part of the whole experience. By your reasoning, you can play a rumbling V8 soundtrack in a Honda Civic and then check off the "got the sound right" box on the list of things you want from the car. It's not the same. It's virtual reality. Knowing that, it becomes disappointing.

Archimedes

manifold danger

Didn't say anything about the joy it brings, I was just talking about the function. Joy in driving, yes. That's where we start to veer off in different directions. Sound is just one component of the whole experience. It's worth more to some than others. To me, it's worth a lot- that's why I drive a 981, I've said it numerous times. Clearly it's a big deal to you too. But I also appreciate the 718 for the rest of the things it does better than the 981- which is actually a whole heck of a lot. The 718 is a better car to drive, I don't even see too many people disputing that. Which is also why eventually I may end up in one; because cost factored into my decision making as well and my 981 GTS cost 2/3 what a 718 GTS would have. Eventually that may even out... especially with the way people continue to pile on the 718 that all essentially boils down to objectivity. Which at the end of the day, being an enthusiast is about emotion, so I completely understand. Even though I disagree. I just wanted to get to the bottom of it, and it seems like I have.

It does, I said that in my first post. I saw that video, and it's not a good representation. The sound in that video is ****. Here, use this as a reference point-
A 981 GTS, which we all can agree is one of the best sounding cars in the history of the world. Could you really tell from the video though? In fact it sounds synthetic. Go ahead and play this one and the one of the 718 at Monza in separate tabs; they sound almost identical aside from the 981 being a couple octaves higher (and more wind/tire noise from the 981, imagine that). Which sure, that high pitched wail is a definite advantage, but still. Bad sound quality in a video shouldn't lead to forming such a strong opinion.

If you've driven one and you still hold that opinion, ok that's totally fair. I have driven a couple and feel that I have enough data to make an informed decision, and to recognize that Monza video sound is ****. Whether or not you have an open mind is another conversation entirely...

Anyway. This is fun and all but I realize I'm in the minority and can't win an argument over the Internet.

Wild Weasel

I must have watched this video 50 times while waiting for my car to show up. Put on some headphones and turn it up. THIS is what the car sounds like. It's all here.

Archimedes

fast1

We all have our preferences to what a sports car should sound like. As much as I loved my 911s, I never felt that exhaust sound was their strong point. Actually my 981S sounded better, at least to me. I always preferred the sound of a big block V8. I do agree that Porsche should have been able to do more with the exhaust sound on the 718, despite the challenges posed by a turbo 4 cyl. Adding the contrived popping PSE sounds do nothing to improve the sound to me. I never cared for those sounds when I raced in cars with racing cams and the sounds were a byproduct of the cam. So I'm certainly not a fan when they are contrived.
Bottom line is that exhaust sound is not that important to everyone.

manifold danger

Yes, that video is very well done and is a 100% accurate representation of how the 981 GTS sounds.

I told you I have one, right?

Mine isn't carmine red though. I really, REALLY love that color...

Wild Weasel

Yeah, I know. I just posted it for everyone else's benefit and really, because I just love that video.

I'll say it again... I don't hate the sound of the 718. BUT... I challenge anyone to post a video where you will fall in love with it's sound and want to hear it over and over again.

ekam

The issue that I have with the exhaust burble is they're not true burble which only happens in certain gear, RPM and the quick throttle lift, instead you hear it every time you lift throttle. Fun for about 5 mins but after that it's incredibly annoying.

Wild Weasel

I honestly never got tired of it and genuinely miss it in the new car. I especially miss revving up in a low gear and just letting go the throttle. Sometimes it would fire off like a shotgun. That never got old in the 3 years I owned the car. Not even once.

Of course, on the inside, I'm only 8.