Blu RS

Dovecom, very cool installation above!

I'm also interested in the RS30 for my 981 Boxster Spyder. Out of curiosity, I just went and checked on the battery tray supporting the evidently small format Exide lead acid battery to see whether the tray is steel or aluminum. Using a strong magnet confirms that it's aluminum (looks like it's a stamped piece with some small steel fixtures attached), which would make sense in the lightweight oriented Spyder. That's a relief because otherwise I too would be looking for a way to replace that sizable sheet of metal.

Looking forward to hearing more about the installation kit and hopefully a "group buy" somewhere along the line.

Oh, by the way, I now have on order and in transit an Antigravity battery to replace an old lead acid battery in one of my motorcycles. Decided to go with high-tech modern Antigravity this time versus Shorai, which has actually worked pretty well for me in another motorcycle.

lovetoturn

The ATX-30 in my car, resting in the garage as Scott has mentioned, has now lasted for 4 full weeks (28 days) with the voltage only dropping from 13.30 to 13.13 volts. The car has not been driven and no charge was applied to the battery at any time during this test period. The voltage was measured with a regular volt meter and not the one in the car. The car doors were opened each week for a moment to let the car electrics cycle as if you needed to get something out of it in normal use. Last weekend I even had the door open with the lights on for about ten minutes while I fixed a loose passenger kick panel. After returning home this evening from a weekend away and doing the final measurement, the car started instantly. No extra turns or any difference from like it normally would start. As Scott has said, Porsche has apparently figured out the parasitic draw issue. After the last month of my own testing it appears it is no longer an issue at all, at least for Porsche cars 2014 and newer. Hope this helps anyone still contemplating the hardiness of an Antigravity Lithium Battery.

Beyond this long rest in the garage, the car has over a thousand miles on it including 5 track days without a single hitch. Very happy with the product and especially the 42 pound weight loss for my car.

Here is how I mounted it in the car. I simple strap from Amazon, remove the battery bottom plate, loop the strap underneath the plate, add a piece of custom cut kitchen drawer liner underneath the battery, and retighten the bolts with the strap buckle in the right place. Then install the battery and and tighten the strap. You may want to take a few tries adjusting the position of the strap buckle to get it the exact right place, so don't tighten the bolts down all the way until you have that figured out. This is a very simple option for mounting either battery until Scott has the custom mounting plate made for the RS-30. Again 5 track days and nothing has come loose or moved around.

LittleBlueGT

Antigravity

Yes I'm Scott.... and you got my attention,

I believe you are the person who tested the RS-20 Battery in Canada for us last year, correct? I wish you would have been more responsible and mature in your posting. I feel your post is misleading and is insinuating I am providing false information, which is entirely inaccurate. If you had taken the time to actually read this thread you would have seen I was not talking about the OLD RS-20 which is the battery you tested last year.... I've been talking about our NEW RS-30 which is a completely new design with 10 Amp Hours more,an updated new BMS and new Case. Your statements of "it bugs me when I sense false information going out" ---- "I can dig up very detailed emails" ---- "the results were not good" are so misleading and out of context that I'm a bit frustrated. You could have just stated facts such as I tested the RS-20 and these are my results and thoughts... instead you post innuendo and vague statement that lead a reader of this thread to think there was some untruths stated by me. It's not cool at all, and now I have to write a response to set the facts straight.

First, your insinuating I was stating falsehoods because I posted that I have not tested the RS-30 in cold weather... but your angle is that you tested the RS-20 in the extreme cold (true), therefore Scott is lying because he said he hadn't tested the RS in the cold. Well if you read this thread it obvious I am talking about the NEW-RS-30 Battery which I have in fact NOT yet tested long term in the extreme cold. So you have taken my statement about not fully testing the the RS-30 in constantly cold temperatures and applied it to your experience in testing the OLDER RS-20 battery and assumed I was mis-leading people. That is absolutely incorrect. Additionally the battery you tested , the RS-20, is no longer sold, and was the first generation and had a complete re-design to become the new RS-30 which is the battery I have been talking about. But lets make it clear the RS-20 was a fantastic battery in itself.. we only made it better.

Secondly you imply you can "dig-up" emails which tends to lead a reader to believe there is some nefarious information... Let get that straight, all we talked about was testing of the battery for the RS-20, that is it ever. Yes, you tested the RS-20 in the cold weather, but that has nothing to do with me saying I have not tested the RS-30 in cold weather. So I'm actually being honest with the Renn Members while you are trying insinuate I'm not since you did some testing last year. But I see your mistake. You think I'm lying when as your quote of me says I have not done and constant cold weather testing of the RS.. you think I'm talking about the RS-20.... nope talking about the RS-30. Again if you read this thread you can obviously see that.

Thirdly, you then state "sadly the results were not good"... as if the battery failed significantly. Again, lets get this straight and put it into context. The results were awesome from our perspective. We sent a battery to be tested in extreme freezing temperatures. As you told me in our emails that battery was starting the car fine in those freezing temperatures, but then you found the battery cutting-out voltage while driving. So Fact #1 is the car started in successfully in below freezing weather which is an AWESOME result for such a small lithium Car Battery. Fact #2 is we had found the battery voltage cut-off you stated occurred was due to our Thermal Protection circuit cutting off the battery in exceptionally cold temperatures, and that occurred during the drive when the wind-chill factor came into play. So, while it was a issue, it was just a program change on the Circuit Board. But from your statement of the "results were not good" it implied the battery was not good, or wouldn't start your car, or broke. That is not the case at all, they continued working aside from the voltage cut-off issue. Also remember you were given the battery as something to TEST, it was NEVER implied this was a "seasoned" product for the below freezing weather. You did testing that allowed us to find the short comings and improve them for the new RS-30, which we did. But because you made vague comments in your post the Reader might think the battery was failing badly when in fact it was not... it started your car in below freezing temps that a big winner, it didn't break, another winner, then we found our Circuit board needed programing. Those are the FACTS! Not some vague "the results were not good". I wanted to clarify that. Also let be clear, these batteries are intended for Hi Performance Sport Cars where weight savings in important, we have never stated to use them for Freezing Temps. If your driving in Freezing weather this is not the best option, and you probably want the extra weight of a lead acid battery. So where's my falsehoods?

Let's keep this all in perspective.... we sent you a first generation of our Auto battery the RS-20 to see what it would do in 10 degree weather in Canada during the coldest part of winter. That's a fantastic test for Antigravity and shows our dedication to testing and improving our product in real-life extremes. We learned of the cutting-out voltage problem in extreme climates when wind chill factors in and took that data and learned from it and incorporated that data into our new design to help develop the ALL NEW RS-30 battery. Additionally, for your testing we covered all shipping expenses to you and back to us, we gave you a full refund of your Deposit and I thanked you for your testing data which was excellent and very detailed. So where's the UNTRUTH on my side? We've been nothing but great with you and others who are testing our products.

Anyway, I took your post personally and as an affront to what I am trying to do on the forums I post on, which is to speak facts and educate those who aren't familiar with Lithium. Nothing I have posted here or on any of the threads is contrary to that. There alre no false statements as your post implies. You came across as if you were feeling bad there was false statements being made, when the fact is YOUR post was actually the misleading statement.

Regards,
scott-

LittleBlueGT

First off, let's not turn this into a war. I really want this product to work as advertised. And in fact there is a decent chance I might buy one when I take delivery of my CaymanGTS.
Yes, you have been good to me letting me test and paying shipping and refunding. Thank-you.

The issues I am talking about only occured in the RS-20, and only in colder temps, so for many people reading this, they can just skip this whole post. Although at the end I do have some pertinent questions.

No hard feelings, but you did say "I have not shipped out an RS to be tested in super constantly cold environment "

Apparantly I took that to mean any battery in your RS line, which would have included the old RS-20. Yes I did read the whole post, and I didn't find anything to indicate that the battery was any different then the RS-20 except essentially bigger.

I do understand your frustrations, and for that I apologive, but it is just started to look too much like an overactive sales guy that was perhaps making his product out to be better then it actually is.

I respectfully disagree, sorry
I tested two batteries, the 2nd one was actually worse, and the coldest it saw was about 25F (not -25, but +25F), and it had all sorts of crazy voltage spiking issues, and in the end it would activate the low voltage protection every time I turned the car off for more then a small period of time. Yes, after pressing the button it would still start, but it was obvious something was not right. It was almost like the voltage spikes possibly damaged some of the cells? IDK for sure, but that battery was toast afterwards and after charging with a lithium specific charger would not hold much of a charge.

So it was not crazy cold. Cold, yes, but extreme cold? no.

Was some of the test a success? Absolutely. The first battery easily started my car in about -4F temps after sitting for 8 hrs. It didn't need to be warmed up, it was fine. The first battery did that for a bit before it started having weird voltage issues.
Now this was in a low compression STI (2.5L just over 8:1 compression ratio) and the car was plugged in. As far as sizing goes I see no reason why the smaller RS20 wouldn't work just fine starting a high compression GT3 or GT3RS in above freezing temps. Abviously the 50% more capacity of the RS-30 will buy extra storage time (which is typical with that sort of car). But this battery will IMO spin your starter better then the OEM battery, no issues at all.

"Fact #2 is we had found the battery voltage cut-off you stated occurred was due to our Thermal Protection circuit cutting off the battery in exceptionally cold temperatures, and that occurred during the drive when the wind-chill factor came into play." Exceptionally cold, with wind-chill? IMO that was not at all exceptionally cold, and I do have a temp probe in my engine bay, and windchill, yes it would have been a factor, but less so then you seem to think. At least that is my opinion on that. First battery was decent at first into minus F temps, then had issues, 2nd one had issues at +25F temps.

Anyways, that is all in the past it seems as you guys have re-designed stuff, great!

While I apoligize for any hurt or frustration I have caused, I do have a bone to pick. If you redesigned your BMS, why didn't you tell me? I was under the impression that when you had something to resolve the issue I would be notified??? I had no reason to know that your BMS had changed for this issue, that maybe the new RS-30 would have worked for me, etc..... All of this could have been avoided if you had let me know.

But since this is all out there now (and because I want really do want to know), a few questions for you about cold weather:

1. The old RS-20s that I sent back, were the cells damaged afterwards?
2. If the cells were damaged, how confident are you now that the new BMS will work properly in -20 to -30F temps? Has any testing happened to confirm that?

Now some more questions about overcharging? (Yes, I have been doing my research, and have talked with a few manufacturers of aircraft LiFePO4 batteries)

1. One of the big problems with these batteries are the fact that they can accept a charge very quickly (which is also why they can give out soo many CA so quickly from such a small size). The problem with accepting a charge quickly is that the small mass of the battery can easily overheat and destroy things. For example one battery that is often used successfuly in light aircraft (which happens to easily deal with very cold temps) is rated by alternator size. According to their engineer that I talked to (yes I am in the aviation industry) the biggest problem they have is not so much being able to start the engine, but having an alternator that charges it too fast, and then it overheats on re-charge and can destroy cells. If the battery is always at a fairly full charge level it is not a problem, but if it gets low (let's say 50-75% used up) it still easily starts the engine, but then an alternator too big charges it too fast, and.... problems. So, how does your BMS deal with possible overcharging? Your site just says "over-charge". From my limited knowledge that means over-voltage, not over-current. And putting a current limiter in the BMS is very pricey from what I know, probably prohibitively so.
2. What would be the max current that your RS-30 could take safely? (I think that is why Porsche has specific setting for Lithium vs Lead-acid or AGM, and seeing as you have a GT3RS I imagine you should be able to figure that eventually) From what I see many Porsches have 175 AMP alternators which is bigger then my STI at 120. That is a lot of current!

Silver Surfer

Has anyone tried these in a 987.2? I need to replace the battery in my 2011 Boxster Spyder.

dovecom

I have a different, I would say inferior, lithium battery in my .2 and I love it. Having that built in anti-drain disconnect is the best thing about Antigravity. I destroyed a brand new $700 battery because I left something unlatched. That's their achilles heal. They can't be recovered from being drained below about 10V. So what Antigravity has done shows great forethought, keeping customers happy. The savings including my custom pan and attachments was 40lbs. And that weight is up really high. The car starts instantly. Go for it.

dovecom

your strap must ruin the seal under that battery tray. I would try something else. Plus that tray is worth replacing as it is quite heavy.

dovecom

It seems like doing some cold weather testing is vital, and providing detailed data on your site will allay customer concerns. (Just talking as a PR guy). Those temps weren't cold. I lived in northern Alberta, where people use block heaters and temps get lower than -40F. I wouldn't expect it to work that cold alone, but how will it do with a block heater? What about just driving around in that kind of weather? There are many 911 owners that drive their AWD cars all year round. Test it, shoot some fun video, put it up and move past this. Otherwise this issue will cling to your product.