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982 GT4 Spyder?

 
Old 02-04-2018, 02:09 PM
  #91  
Maverick787
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Originally Posted by Marine Blue View Post
Personally I would like to see the next Spyder get more serious about weight loss. Carbon body panels, lightweight exhaust and other weight savings. That and better gearing to match up with the engine would have a huge impact on how the car drives.

We already know the top wonít be changing so no chance of seeing weight loss there.
Ďwith that said price point will be ugly ......carbon fenders on the RS are 14K per fender ..........basically you have a RS hood and fenders over 50k. Letís say you shave 40lbs off the car what would drivers actually do with the car, not sure how many Spyders hit the track if any? If so the GT3 would be the proper machine. Not knocking the thought, but I never followed the massive weight loss for some of these cars that are at 3000lbs or less? The more expensive these cars get less tracking is occurring due to the cost of the consumable parts and track insurance.
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Old 02-04-2018, 02:50 PM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by Maverick787 View Post


Ďwith that said price point will be ugly ......carbon fenders on the RS are 14K per fender ..........basically you have a RS hood and fenders over 50k. Letís say you shave 40lbs off the car what would drivers actually do with the car, not sure how many Spyders hit the track if any? If so the GT3 would be the proper machine. Not knocking the thought, but I never followed the massive weight loss for some of these cars that are at 3000lbs or less? The more expensive these cars get less tracking is occurring due to the cost of the consumable parts and track insurance.
Weight loss has a very big impact on the cars driving dynamics. Primarily less weight means the car can more easily change direction which gives it superior handling. Weight loss also changes the power to weight ratio so instead of chasing more power you can get the same levels of performance with the same power. You also gain better gas mileage which I know isnít as important but perhaps it could result in a smaller fuel tank which again would improve the cars performance.

Since the Spyder isnít tracked I donít see a real downside to the carbon panels other than the initial cost and yes I guess that would be ugly if the fenders truly cost $14k each!

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Old 02-04-2018, 03:47 PM
  #93  
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Originally Posted by Marine Blue View Post


Weight loss has a very big impact on the cars driving dynamics. Primarily less weight means the car can more easily change direction which gives it superior handling. Weight loss also changes the power to weight ratio so instead of chasing more power you can get the same levels of performance with the same power. You also gain better gas mileage which I know isnít as important but perhaps it could result in a smaller fuel tank which again would improve the cars performance.

Since the Spyder isnít tracked I donít see a real downside to the carbon panels other than the initial cost and yes I guess that would be ugly if the fenders truly cost $14k each!

Sorry, should have explained better I get the physics of weight loss and weight distribution. Most Spyders are garage queens, and definitely not tracked. To pay for those items will be expensive and zero benefit on the street. I use to track my RS just didnít have the time, and I see the benefit there but not a dedicated street car. Easier to lose weight vs what you will gain in paying to shave maybe 15 lbs (:
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Old 02-04-2018, 04:06 PM
  #94  
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I really hope they GT the Spyder, but I just don't see it as likely. Even less likely would be doing things like carbon panels, which would increase cost prohibitively. Makes for good forum chatter though.
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Old 02-04-2018, 04:11 PM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by Archimedes View Post
I really hope they GT the Spyder, but I just don't see it as likely. Even less likely would be doing things like carbon panels, which would increase cost prohibitively. Makes for good forum chatter though.
Ďthat it does .....GT boys pretty decisive what they put a GT badge on .....a convertible no way. When do does your GT3 arrive?
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Old 02-04-2018, 05:38 PM
  #96  
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Originally Posted by Maverick787 View Post
Sorry, should have explained better I get the physics of weight loss and weight distribution. Most Spyders are garage queens, and definitely not tracked. To pay for those items will be expensive and zero benefit on the street. I use to track my RS just didn’t have the time, and I see the benefit there but not a dedicated street car. Easier to lose weight vs what you will gain in paying to shave maybe 15 lbs (:
Mav, your post above reminded me of a previous post of yours, below, that I meant to respond to but never did:

Originally Posted by Maverick787 View Post
Guys, the car still weighs less than 2900 lbs. . . . Not knocking anyone I just don’t follow the weight stuff unless you’re working to go save 1/10 off your lap time.
It's the "weight stuff," as you put it, that is mainly responsible for our Spyders feeling as amazing as they do. The car is light weight only because Porsche, more than most, is concerned about the "weight stuff," and thank goodness because weight is so hugely significant (and I know that fact isn't lost on you). You don't need to be on a track chasing 10ths to feel the benefits of light weight -- we experience it every time we hop in our Spyders. (Don't make me have to recount the story of Nico's quads to drive home the importance of shaving a few pounds,
OK? )


When folks dismiss the isolated weight savings for, say, radio delete or cloth door pulls, as insignificant, I scratch my head. It's when you take the pound saved here and the pound saved there and the three pounds saved somewhere else that it all starts to add up. Porsche engineers scrape and claw to shave pounds. It's not easy. When they figured out a way to reduce the weight of the 987 Spyder top by 46 lbs., that was a HUGE deal IMO.

I'm sure many of you guys go to the gym and some of you may lift weights. In the course of my workout I'm constantly handling 45 lb., 25 lb., 10 lb., 5 lb. and 2.5 lb. plates. I thus may be more in touch than some with how much 45 lbs. actually weighs or 10 lbs. or whatever. 45 lbs. is certainly a good chunk of weight, trust me. It's heavy! When I think that the 987 Spyder's roof saved the rough equivalent of one of those plates, I marvel. I think about the burdened 987 Boxster and Boxster S models being saddled with that extra 46 lbs. and I envision those cars dragging one of those plates around behind them like a ball and chain. Talk about a performance squelcher!

I, too, would like to see the 982 Spyder shed pounds -- the more the better -- as I'm on record as being a weight fanatic (apologies for boring you guys by now with my weight rants). Granted, in isolation 2.5 lbs. saved with cloth door pulls can't be felt but it's the cumulative total of all the weight savings measures which, combined, make these Spyders something special. I'll never discount or scoff at a pound saved anywhere because EVERY POUND COUNTS.

And I don't buy the notion that weight savings measures are necessarily hugely expensive. If Alfa can sell a carbon tub 4C for $65K, if Alpine can get their new $50K A110 down to 2,400 lbs., and if Lotus can . . . well . . . do what it has ALWAYS done, then Porsche can reduce the weight of the 982 at premiums we would find acceptable.

We love our Spyders, but if the 982 can shed 100 lbs. and get down to the 987's weight, I'll bet you you will feel the difference on the street and like what you feel!
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Old 02-04-2018, 06:05 PM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by Suicide Jockey View Post
Mav, your post above reminded me of a previous post of yours, below, that I meant to respond to but never did:



It's the "weight stuff," as you put it, that is mainly responsible for our Spyders feeling as amazing as they do. The car is light weight only because Porsche, more than most, is concerned about the "weight stuff," and thank goodness because weight is so hugely significant (and I know that fact isn't lost on you). You don't need to be on a track chasing 10ths to feel the benefits of light weight -- we experience it every time we hop in our Spyders. (Don't make me have to recount the story of Nico's quads to drive home the importance of shaving a few pounds,
OK? )

When folks dismiss the isolated weight savings for, say, radio delete or cloth door pulls, as insignificant, I scratch my head. It's when you take the pound saved here and the pound saved there and the three pounds saved somewhere else that it all starts to add up. Porsche engineers scrape and claw to shave pounds. It's not easy. When they figured out a way to reduce the weight of the 987 Spyder top by 46 lbs., that was a HUGE deal IMO.

I'm sure many of you guys go to the gym and some of you may lift weights. In the course of my workout I'm constantly handling 45 lb., 25 lb., 10 lb., 5 lb. and 2.5 lb. plates. I thus may be more in touch than some with how much 45 lbs. actually weighs or 10 lbs. or whatever. 45 lbs. is certainly a good chunk of weight, trust me. It's heavy! When I think that the 987 Spyder's roof saved the rough equivalent of one of those plates, I marvel. I think about the burdened 987 Boxster and Boxster S models being saddled with that extra 46 lbs. and I envision those cars dragging one of those plates around behind them like a ball and chain. Talk about a performance squelcher!

I, too, would like to see the 982 Spyder shed pounds -- the more the better -- as I'm on record as being a weight fanatic (apologies for boring you guys by now with my weight rants). Granted, in isolation 2.5 lbs. saved with cloth door pulls can't be felt but it's the cumulative total of all the weight savings measures which, combined, make these Spyders something special. I'll never discount or scoff at a pound saved anywhere because EVERY POUND COUNTS.

And I don't buy the notion that weight savings measures are necessarily hugely expensive. If Alfa can sell a carbon tub 4C for $65K, if Alpine can get their new $50K A110 down to 2,400 lbs., and if Lotus can . . . well . . . do what it has ALWAYS done, then Porsche can reduce the weight of the 982 at premiums we would find acceptable.

We love our Spyders, but if the 982 can shed 100 lbs. and get down to the 987's weight, I'll bet you you will feel the difference on the street and like what you feel!
all fair points and I track so I get it. First, anything Porsche does will not be cheap and will push this car will above 110k and compete with the 911 which they will not do for obvious reasons. Do a poll and see how many Spyder have more than 6000 miles vs. polished in the garage(: not going to feel to much weight savings driving to the local mall or car show. (Said in fun) Can we agree just casual driving the majority will not feel the diffence in weight ......prior to being a Porsche freak I tracked all M cars very hard, and you feel the weight typically in entry and high exit speeds which is where you enjoy the lack of weight in low torque cars.

I just don’t see the cost benefit analysis that it will cost to save measurable weight for casual street driving. I’m one for savings, but not the added cost Porsche will charge making the car not obtainable for most. Also you add a 4L motor and weight now you must modify the entire suspension to accomadate the extra power, and upgrade tires along with a wider track. Pulling out weight and more power does not come cheap. Very easy to push this car on the higher end of the Delta, and it will rip a 911 into parts .......not going to happen. Again not debating with you I agree to a point, but truly how many are willing to pay for true weight reduction while enjoying the benefit honestly?
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Old 02-04-2018, 11:49 PM
  #98  
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Mmm... I don't think I would feel a difference of 100 pounds on the street unless it was from the right places. Perhaps some kind of combination of PCCB, CF wheels, lighter engine components, etc. Shaving 100 pounds from shedding weight here and there in the cabin and body panels I think would have less impact, wouldn't it? I'm not an expect here or anything but that would be my assumption.

I'm very happy the 981. I think it will prove challenging for Porsche to release a better Spyder this time around without drastically increasing price, to the point where I'm not sure I would pay the premium to swap.

FWIW, I am closing in on 10k miles. I anticipate I will put about 3k/year on the car... drive it quite a bit considering I have other vehicles.
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Old 02-05-2018, 12:09 AM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by guab View Post
Mmm... I don't think I would feel a difference of 100 pounds on the street unless it was from the right places. Perhaps some kind of combination of PCCB, CF wheels, lighter engine components, etc. Shaving 100 pounds from shedding weight here and there in the cabin and body panels I think would have less impact, wouldn't it? I'm not an expect here or anything but that would be my assumption.

I'm very happy the 981. I think it will prove challenging for Porsche to release a better Spyder this time around without drastically increasing price, to the point where I'm not sure I would pay the premium to swap.

FWIW, I am closing in on 10k miles. I anticipate I will put about 3k/year on the car... drive it quite a bit considering I have other vehicles.
nice miles for all the cars you have ......drive in good health. You can pull weight out of the engine with titanium parts, and yes it will be an expensive car and trounce a 911. Porsche has to keep the 911 platform intact and slowly move that engine forward to get a better CG. Weight is typically felt at high speed in turns and pushing understeer pending where the weight it located. Iím not a great driver but I canít feel 30 to 40 pounds.
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Old 02-05-2018, 02:31 AM
  #100  
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One good way to find out if you can tell the effect of weight is how your car drives when it's almost empty vs. full of gas. With gas being about 6 lbs/gal, pumping 15 gallons adds 90 lbs.
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Old 02-05-2018, 11:15 AM
  #101  
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I track my Spyder so I welcome any performance improvements. This time around though if there is better hardware in the GT4 then I will have to consider jumping ship to the GT4. That is if Porsche allows me to get one!
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Old 02-05-2018, 02:53 PM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by kiznarsh View Post
One good way to find out if you can tell the effect of weight is how your car drives when it's almost empty vs. full of gas. With gas being about 6 lbs/gal, pumping 15 gallons adds 90 lbs.
True!

Personally I definitely notice a distinct difference in the cars responsiveness and how it travels over the road surface when the tank is 1/3 full or less. I donít notice the acceleration difference much but then again Iím not usually using all of the cars power.

Itís also noticeable when a passenger jumps in, that added weight definitely hurts acceleration.

Weight matters and itís unfortunate that we donít see more effort from Porsche considering the pricing of their cars. As noted, if Lotus and Alpha can do it for far less money then Porsche has no excuse other than making their investors happy with larger profit margins.
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Old 02-05-2018, 03:00 PM
  #103  
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Dang I for sure cannot notice if a passenger jumps in to my car lol. Unless I am driving ten tenths!!
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Old 02-05-2018, 04:42 PM
  #104  
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The Lotus Evora is over 3100 lbs
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Old 02-05-2018, 05:07 PM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by Maverick787 View Post
The Lotus Evora is over 3100 lbs
Evora is somewhat of a stray when it comes to Lotus, itís much more of a luxury sports car. The Exige is what I had in mind when referencing Lotus, it currently weights in around 2200 lbs with a 305 horsepower 6 cylinder engine.
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