Zeus993

OK, OK, I know, I know... I can go and dig up past threads etc... but a friend of mine is looking at two Caymans, one base PDK and the other an S with a MT.

A) Base
Agate Grey over Partial Leather Agate Grey and Amber Orange Standard Seats
265 BHP
PDK
19 " Wheels
12,900 Kms (8000 Miles)
Independent Dealer
No CPO
$63,900 CND ($49,154 USDs)

B) S
Guards Red over Black Leather Sport Seats Plus (Hard backs)
325 BHP
MT
PASM
20" Wheels
19,080 Kms (11295 miles)
Porsche Dealership
CPO'd to ?
$72,900 CNDs ($56,000 USD)

The questions he is asking are things like is the power adequate enough in the city with a PDK? (I hear you have to wring out the power in the base which could be fun). Does anyone, a couple years down the line now, wish they had the S?

I've seen both these cars with him, sat in both etc... not driven yet. I think the Agate Grey is the prettier car but what are there short comings?

Thanks in advance. He's close to jumping in! Advice (realizing it will be up to him)... ?

caymannyc

S seems overpriced.

Zeus993

Doesn't a CPO add on $3500 - $5000 to the price? Take that off and the price does seem that high. That drop it into a lease like my buddy is thinking and it's not that much more per month.

Care to comment on the power of your Cayman base?

caymannyc

My thoughts are below, but just in case you haven't read this, here is an article from Motortrend that says "this base Cayman, with a little 2.7-liter engine, is Porsche’s Best Sports Car."

http://www.motortrend.com/cars/porsc...an-first-test/

Now if the above didn't convince you, the below are my thoughts:

I don't know about Canadian prices, but I bought my 981 Base CPO with similar mileage from a dealer for around $46K USD. Maybe Canada is a bit more expensive than the US, but even so, I think a Cayman seriously starts losing its "value proposition" at around the $49-50K range, especially when you can get a very nice 997 for the same price or less. You didn't specify whether the two cars are 981s or 987s, but I think CPO on a 981 is a bit overkill considering factory warranty should also still be active.

Even at 325bhp, the "S" is slow. Slow compared to so many other cars you will routinely run across on the street. Even a used Hyundai Genesis costing $20K comes stock at 350bhp. Paying extra just to be a little "less slow" to me is not really worth spending approximately 10% more of the purchase price. Yes, that's 10% more you're paying, plus the higher tax and insurance costs. And you'll still get smoked by Mustangs and Chargers and 370Zs and many other cars. So why buy a Cayman at all? I really think "speed" should be one of the lowest priority items when you are looking at a Cayman. I'm not sure you ski, but it's really similar to the difference between a 165cm SL ski vs. a 185cm GS ski. The latter you're going a lot faster, but you actually feel like you're going slower, if that makes sense

For me, the appeal of a 981 Cayman is that it is the best looking Porsche (non 918, GT3/GT4, Spyder) out right now (in my opinion), the mid-engine, the amazing sound of the flat-six, impeccable handling and driving a true 2-seater sports car made by Porsche (and being a part of the rich heritage and history of the brand). You will get all that with the Base, so why pay extra for the "S"?

I would just like to caveat that I am lucky enough to have both a 981 and a 997 so I really get the best of both worlds, but I guess if the 981 is going to be your ONLY Porsche, then maybe the "S" may be a better choice. The "S" that you listed is a manual and has 20" wheels. Manual is a huge pain in stop and go traffic and city driving, and 20" wheels are in my opinion awful for everything other than looks. They are slower, harsher, more expensive tires, get flats easier in the city (potholes), and I don't even think they look that good on a Cayman given how small the Cayman is. To be fair, you could probably sell the OEM 20" that come with the car and buy OEM 18s or 19s and make money back. A lot of people would be offering to trade you as well.

As to whether or not I would prefer to have an "S" now, if the cost was exactly the same I "may" take the "S" purely for the higher resale value, but I don't know if it would be more fun. I can routinely LEGALLY go 5000rpm or higher on my Cayman Base which produces an absolutely lovely engine note and makes you feel like you are going faster than you are without blowing past the speed limit. Passengers in my Base still squirm and get scared when I launch the car, and I can still produce wheel spin and that little "chirp" you get at launch (turn the traction control off). Drifting and donuts are also possible on the Base (don't ask me how I know). The Base has I think the perfect powerband for driving in the city. You don't need to ever go full throttle in the city, but you can. If you do decide to press the throttle hard, the PDK will downshift for you automatically to 2nd or 3rd gear and you'll be at 5-6000 RPMs with a glorious engine note as you overtake other cars in the city, AND you will still be within the speed limits. If you want to drive the PDK in manual mode, just hit the Sport button and cruise around switching between 2nd and 4th gear for some real fun and amazing noises all within the speed limits.

However, the Base is clearly "underpowered" and you can feel that in lower torque ranges. The 0-60 time is bad, and sometimes I must confess I do wonder if this really is a Porsche when I see Mustangs routinely pulling away from me. But that same thought would occur in an "S" since the Mustang is still faster than the "S". But at the end of the day, who cares? The Cayman Base just feels SO GOOD everytime you turn the steering wheel, everytime you sit down and you see those lovely fenders through your windshield like the old racecars and everytime you make a simple left or right turn. It feels amazing. And it's still plenty quick, don't get me wrong, this isn't your wife's TDI Audi. In terms of available torque, I would equate the Cayman Base to a new BMW 535i except the Cayman is a heck of lot more fun to drive.

So in conclusion:

-If high HP is your thing, don't buy a Cayman, you will be disappointed either way.
-If 0-60 or 1/4 times are your thing, don't buy a Cayman, you will be disappointed either way.
-If high torque and slammed into the back of your seat acceleration is your thing, don't buy a Cayman, you will be disappointed either way.
-If you care about the opinion of other Porsche and PCA members, buy a 997 instead, some of the 911 crowd won't even acknowledge your presence
-If you care about being faster than a Mustang or Challenger, don't buy a Cayman
-If you care about being faster than a Corvette, don't buy a Porsche

Zeus993

Great write up. Tku. I'll pass it on...

MJBird993

You really gotta drive them both. For me, the S wins every time. Just not enough torque and power around town when it's not feasible to run it up to 6000 RPM on every shift.

And again, my opinion only, a sports car should have a manual transmission.

I don't think that the $7K premium for the CPO S is out of line either.

But the cars are different enough (base/auto/S/manual) that your friend should really drive both and make up his or her own mind.

caymannyc

If a Cayman base does not have enough power to get around town I really do wonder how the vast majority of drivers with 2.0 and diesel engines are managing to get by. 2.7 is also what older 911s were running.

The Cayman base is more than enough to get by. Its got more torque and power than a 3-series. It may not be enough to boost your ego, now thats a different question.

Dont get me wrong S also wins everytine for me. I just dont think its worth the money.

ninjabones

I've owned both PDK and manual versions of the 981 S, several boxsters (both S and base versions), and 12 other porsches through the years. In this particular model (981), in my opinion, the base version does feel a bit anemic for sporty street driving (no offense Caymannyc, your results may vary). Also, at least for the PDK, I'd want sport chrono (which unleashes more aggressive shift mapping/throttle attenuation alogorithms) that dramatically affect the driving experience (somewhat less critical in the manual version). Personally, I prefer the manual (as long as not a daily driver in heavy traffic), and I'd want PASM, sport chrono, sport exhaust, and 18-way sport seats. Just my $0.02.

caymannyc

No offense taken, and I completely agree with everyone who says the "S" is faster and that the "Base" feels anemic. If money was no object, I'd want a GT4, GTS or S (in that order), with PASM and sport chrono and 18" wheels.

But deep down, you just gotta ask yourself why exactly does the "Base" feel anemic to you and me? Is it really and truly because of it being underpowered or is it something more cynical, perhaps a conditioning from Porsche's marketing strategy and product lineup and the peer pressure? Or could it be the super high comfort levels of the 981 interior that dampens your connection to the road, and the fact that the stock exhaust has been quieted down to be more sensible for the neighbors. When my Borla exhaust is screaming at 5000rpms, I think I'm in a proper Le Mans GT car, all 275hp of it

The 981 Base Cayman is faster than basically all production Porsches built up through the 1990s, and faster than almost every other car that was being driven in the 80s or 90s or even 00s. Yet you never heard anyone in the 50s-90s say "WHY IS EVERY CAR SO ANEMIC", but somehow the 981 with the 2.7 engine, which is faster than anything anybody had 25 years ago is considered underpowered. Quite baffling

CarAholic

I personally prefer the base to the S but I am in the minority. Especially if you go the manual route the shorter gearing of the base is much more enjoyable then the little power bump you get with the S.

Phil G.

+1

extanker

pretty much spot on.

Mrg02D

The base is about the same speed as my Lexus is350 with its 3.5 liter v6 engine. It is by no means slow. What has happened is that everyone else is catching up in speed. Try to pass an enlightened Honda v6 in the base 981 and You'll find that they aren't any push over anymore. Now try in the 981 S and your'e back on top.

DaveMann

Perhaps the lowly entry level 320 has less hp/tq but a simple tune will fix that. Being FI it also has much more power under the curve with peak torque at 1500rpm. The 3 series will walk the 981 base in just about every conceivable instance where acceleration is concerned.

This isn't to say the base is bad by any means though. As mentioned there is a certain charm in being able to wind out the motor without exceeding the speed limit.

Phil G.

My wife's 340 is faster than my 981S but that's not why I bought either car. The 340 is a wonderful, quick commuter sedan, and the 981S is a wonderful sports car with great sound and feel. If I want pure speed, I'll buy a Corvette. Um, no thank you.