MidEngineRules

I so despise misinformation. Not from you, but whomever stated sport suspension (X73) is harsh. Firm but never crashes over any bumps. For a firm suspension it's wonderfully compliant and quiet, and with absolutely no ill manners. Also with considerably beefier ARBs it enables the car to really corner much more flat. It's world's better than PASM for spirited driving, or any driving for that matter. Not only did it cost more than PASM, it was the top sport suspension option and the only suspension offered on the 987 Spyder and Cayman R, and 981 Spyder (I owned all 3 of those plus 4 PASM Porsches). PASM on normal is fine. PASM in sport mode is unusable it's so harsh. Best thing about X73 is it's full time--no button to push. With X73 you won't find yourself avoiding bumps or rough pavement. Nuff said.

SpyderSenseOC

What are MTC dollars?

CaymanSinAR

I'm going to side with the YouTube guy on this one. I have the X73 with the 20" 911 Turbo wheels and when the tires are set to factory door spec it will absolutely beat the crap out of you on bad roads (which is pretty much all we have around here). Setting it to Comfort fill pressure (30psi) helps immensely, but it is still a rough ride. Likely why my BGTS has several squeaks and rattles.

To each his own though.

Like I said, I attribute a lot of it to the absolutely AWFUL road conditions around here. Very rare to find a road that isn't full of potholes, cracks, bumps, or severe undulations. I'll suffer those with the X73 for the feeling I get when I'm out of town and on my favorite backroads.

manifold danger

I just went through a similar search; I agree, for that budget (sub 50k), 997.2 C2 and 981S would probably be the best comparison. I didn't include the S on the 997 because it will be a challenge to find one in that budget; the prices are rising dramatically as people are beginning to truly know what they have. Any 991 in that price range is likely to feel very "used"... although as someone earlier pointed out, any 991 in the 50k range is still nearly a steal just based on the market alone. But that said, I looked at a couple 991s and just came to that conclusion- if I'm spending this kind of money on a car, I don't want it to feel so "old"... maybe it was just the one car that fell into the lower end of my budget (my budget was >$70k), but it just felt like it had been more than "just broken in"- and I was trading in a near immaculate, fully loaded 2015 M4. I couldn't justify what felt like a downgrade, even if it was far more fun to drive. If the driving experience was all that I was considering I may very well have went that route... but then I pivoted to start looking at 981s...

The 997.2 is a nearly perfect car... the dimensions are actually pretty close to the Cayman, and aesthetically it's very likely identical to any non-Porsche person to a 991 (really it's pretty much the taillights...). It is still probably considered a GT where the Cayman is pretty much pure sports car, but with the smaller dimensions and more "analog" feel, some would claim it's the ideal water-cooled 911. But what you don't get is a "modern" interior (and likely lack of a rear camera, which is a glaring omission for even 9*1s... but a 911 is VERY easy to see out of, as is probably a Cayman- unlike my Boxster). So I quickly ruled the 997 out too, at least as a daily driver... if I come into any sort of expendable income I would very much like to have a 997.2 as a 3rd car. That 2012 991 is an anomaly and I suppose still worthy of consideration, but comparing it to a nearly brand new 981 is a tough sell. It may still be eligible for a CPO; if that's the case then it's neck and neck. If not, then your buddy better REALLY want a 911 to justify buying an out-of-warranty Porsche. Not that they're unreliable, much to the contrary... but the peace of mind is very important when you're spending this type of scratch.

I ended up with a 981 Boxster GTS, and it's damn near perfect. All the creature comforts I could want (except for that DAMN rear view camera...), reasonably priced all things considered, and I'd almost expect it to even out or even go up in value if the 997s are setting a precedent. And as far as driving experience... oh my God. It's 17 degrees out right now and I'm still trying to find some excuse to drive it. I absolutely adore this car.

TL;DR, it's a good problem to have. They're all wonderful cars that literally will put a smile on your face every time you look at it/start it up/drive it. Tell him to drive a few of them, the right car will probably jump out at him.

Edit- almost forgot; I have the X73 suspension. I was actually pretty apprehensive about it at first, but lo and behold, I would spec this if I were to order a brand new one. It is a firm ride, but I would stop short of calling it harsh, It actually is comparable to my stock M4... which was perfectly reasonable on anything but the ****tiest roads, but had ground clearance issues after I installed the M performance front splitter. The Boxster has no such issues, as long as I'm not an idiot. I do have to take my driveway at an angle but I also had to do that with a 2015 STI that I had. It's really not that big of a deal to live with... and the rewards while driving are definitely worth it.

Also one final thing to consider... what about leasing a 718? I know the 718 is a polarizing car... many (including myself) aren't huge fans of the noise the new 4 cylinder makes... but I drove a base 718 Cayman and it was an amazing car to drive. You really don't need the S from a performance perspective unless you're really obsessed with lap times. Arguably a better driving experience than even my Boxster... but I'm one of those guys who puts a huge emphasis on sound and just became intoxicated by the flat 6. That said, something that is often overlooked (or comes with a fair amount of hyperbole) is that the 718 does NOT SOUND BAD, it just doesn't sound as good as the 981. It actually sounds great! But the 981 is one of the best sounds to ever come out of a tailpipe so it's just an impossible act to follow... FWIW I came within inches of signing a lease for a base Cayman and am positive I would have been very happy with it. Definitely worth considering (and driving).

John Ferguson

X73 is a no go for me. Stock suspension on my 07 Cayman S on 19"s had great feel but was rougher than I like. Agree with manifold danger, "981 Boxster GTS, and it's damn near perfect", ordered mine with PASM. Add some race headers / a flash and perfection is within view.

MidEngineRules

It's all good. I agree with Porsche.

MidEngineRules

My girlfriend has a M4, sitting in my garage right now. I think the M4's suspension is typical of BMW these days in that it crashes over every bump. Even in comfort mode it is loud, semi-jarring and way too stiff for my liking. I consider it and X73 to be very different. I've owned 4 M cars and the only two that I thought had good firm but compilant suspensions were my Z4M Coupe and E92 M3. Both E46 M3s I had were a little crashy. Fun cars though. They were both pre '04 before BMW increased ride height and softened the suspension. I like a taut suspension but I hate it when every bump makes the car feel like it's coming apart. That's BMW. My last 3 Porches have had X73 and I agree with Porsche that it's perfectly dialed in to handle any driving situation. As much as I really am not a fan of the 718's 4 cylinders and muted sound, Porsche actually tried to tune PASM Sport Plus to mimic the X73 feel. If so that's a big plus for the 718.

manifold danger

I have one stretch of road near my house that is absolutely horrid, and another one near the base where my brother lived until a short while ago. Those are my benchmark roads. Them and several places in downtown DC (although it seems to have gotten better in recent years). The one by my house used to damn near rattle my teeth out in the STI I had, but the M4 on comfort dialed it out pretty well (mine had the adjustable dampers, as it appears so does your gf's). The Boxster is just a touch more stiff than the M4 on that road but manageable as long as I'm not trying to break any land speed records.

The one by my brother's house is even worse. I've been driving performance cars my whole life, including several with questionably modified suspension components. I've never really had much of a complaint with my M4, but I've noticed many reviewers and casual observers have so just assumed I'm a bit more acclimated than most.... but that was pretty much laid to rest when I was riding in my brother's 2015 WRX (non-STI). I knew the STI was a ****show with how it rode but I dealt with it ok... the WRX somehow felt worse, to the point where my M4 felt like a damn Rolls Royce in comparison. The Boxster as noted is in the same ballpark as the M4 as far as not being prohibitively undriveable on certain roads... but I've also conceded that I just can't have coffee in the car unless it's in a sealable container. Not really sure if PASM would be much better though, considering the nearly useless cupholders.

dawgcatching

Update: He drove the base Cayman, liked it, thought it a bit underpowered, which it is, based on his recent turbocharged cars. I think he should find a used S to try, but there isn't one that is from a reputable dealer nearby. It would probably be $10k more, and I personally think that 275hp on that car is plenty. It just makes the car more rev-happy without getting into trouble; I know his driving style, and expects stuff to happen at 2k. He had a Panamera Turbo awhile back.

He drove the 911 (I didn't see it) but said he would never have guessed it had that many miles. It looked like a 25,000 mile car, very well cared for, everything was solid and felt great. He is considering it, as it was a nice overall package.

Another car has emerged: a 997.1, 50,000 mile C4S, 2008. It is loaded with options, one owner, and a smidge cheaper at $45,000. I thought that would be more analog than the 991, but it is a much older car as well, and that seems like a lot for a 2008. It is slower than the base 991, much heavier, only a few thousand cheaper, fairly close in mileage. It does have full leather, sport 18-way seats, so that is something, but dang, are older 997's really that close in price to a base 991? I can see a 997.2 being close to a base 991, but a 997.1? The PASM on that car is really dated, and power is the same as a base 997.2. Then again, what do I know. It seems there are a lot of 997.1 models for sale here and I rarely see cars sell. 997.2's priced reasonably sell in a hurry.

gtr

The base 718 is still very fast. I'd go with that since it drives better, newer, full warrantee, and less headaches. Porsche service = $$.

dawgcatching

He is looking at a base 981. Can you get a base 718 for $50k? Probably, as they don't seem to be that popular, but I haven't seen one local used in a manual.

manifold danger

I've seen a few hints in forums that there are serious discounts to be had but I wouldn't think one would fall all the way down to 50k, with the possible exception of a demo car (which wouldn't be a manual anyway)... but might be worth expanding your search options. They're very nice cars.

My thought would be to consider getting into a lease. Some dealers can be fairly creative and Porsche has the best "pull up" lease program I've ever seen... basically if you're two years into a lease, you can kill that lease off if you're getting into another Porsche.

Just a thought.

Benjamin Cherry

A useful perspective from an experienced owner -- thanks for sharing. I guess because ride quality is rather subjective anyway, a number of words could be used to describe the X73. I use the word harsh because a couple of online reviewers also did, and several here have, but I suppose it depends on one's driving style, wheel and tire specifications, and road conditions.

I find the PASM pretty good so far, nice and firm for superior performance and reasonably comfortable for the rest.

I did a lot of research on these cars and drove a few. I agree with your assessment of performance and ride quality. I was turned off by the presence of the IMS (larger bearing from 06-08, less prone to failure in the smaller 3.4L, from what I understand), and also the potential for bore scoring (again, less of an issue on the 3.4). One of the 3.8L I had PPI'd actually did have some moderate scoring and killed the deal for me.

I suppose it's a matter of preference and peace of mind re: rolling the dice on the possibility of bore scoring. Is he going to drive it in cold weather? Is the price and overall experience worth the risk? I can't say.

I can say that I've recently driven the base 2.0L 718 with PDK and yes, it's a fantastic car. Decidedly a better race car than the NA engines, at least from my perspective. I do despise the turbo lag, especially from a full stop. I also deeply, viscerally lament the absence of any distinctive engine noise. As others have said: far too tinny, soft and reminiscent of a Subaru or Honda for my tastes.

If a lease is an option for your friend I'd join the chorus suggesting he try a 718 to see how it feels. The 981/991 and newer interiors are a massive improvement in fit and finish, especially with respect to the electronics.

Good luck. Shopping is fun!

PorscheAddict

I went through the same dilemma and decided on the 981S. I would probably prefer a 991S, but the base 991 is the same speed or slower around a track compared to a 981S, and is heavier and more of a GT car compared to the mid engine platform. I didn't want to pony up $20k extra for the 991S over the 981S, and am very content where I am. He should drive a 981S, which will feel a lot less underpowered than the base 981. 718 is a good choice if he can swing a few more $ (still under $60k) and doesn't mind turbo lag/iffy noise. The torque is nice for sure.

MidEngineRules

Porsche operates on low volume sales, so they aren't going to sell something below what they paid for it. I wouldn't expect big discounts unless you're trading in a car (which is where they'll look to make their money) or year end when they probably get incentives from Porsche. Leasing is always the cheapest option if you can live within the mileage limitation.

When you order a car you can spec it how you want it. These days Porsche is going to have PDK cars sitting on the lot. Let's face it American drivers are a different breed today. They like their auto gearboxes and turbos to minimize effort. I'm not bashing PDK as I like it just fine, but used in manual mode only and changing gears as often as a motorcyclist would.