tlarocque

I am in the market for a 944S2 or 968 that I plan to make into a fun weekend and mild track car. Needs to be street-legal (in CA) and comfortable enough to drive a few hundred miles.

Obviously not much on the market these days. I found a nice-looking Cobalt Blue 968 that is up-to-date on maintenance and looks like it has been taken care of in pics but the car has been re-sprayed. It is far away and I can't eyeball the car but the owner seems like a straight-shooter and calls it and honest "8" and maybe a "9" with a little effort invested. 133k miles, manual, firm at $15k.

Part of me thinks... its going to see the track, who cares? And part of me things... I never keep cars too long and this will really hurt re-sale.

What are people's opinions?

Yogii

Looks nice to me. Try and get a PPI done at a reputable local shop. Include some sort of leak down pressure testing. They could also check the paint depth. See if there is well documented service history.
Just on the respray, depends on color and quality. Some Porsche files insist on original. If a well done respray done in original color, I think not a problem. It wouldn't bother me.

-Yogii
AKA 968 Virgin

Jay Wellwood

Did you ask the reason for the respray? Tired, over polished paint, fix a bazillion rock chips, or was there some collision damage that warranted the respray?

IMHO, there is nothing wrong with a respray, but as pointed out - some of the purists would roll their eyes...

tlarocque

Owner is an ASE-certified mechanic and has done a lot:

"I am an ASE master certified technician and an Automotive Instructor. I have done several maintenance items on this car when I purchased it about four years ago. I installed a new timing belt and balance shaft belt including new tensioner and idler pulleys, cam and crank seals, water pump, and thermostat. I have also replaced the oil pan gasket and valve cover gasket. The engine does not leak a drop. I also replaced the power steering hoses, pump, and the rack and pinion. I replaced the tune up items as well, such as the air filter and spark plugs. I have done regular oil changes with Royal Purple oil and WIX filters. I installed drilled and slotted rotors. I also replaced the radiator with an all-aluminum performance radiator. It still has the original R12 air conditioning system and blows nice and cold. This car is mechanically in excellent condition.
The exterior is in pretty good shape with only a few small blemishes. The car was repainted about 5 years ago just before I purchased it and they did a pretty good job. It is the original color. There are some very small blemishes that you don't notice unless you are looking for them. Other than that, the only significant imperfection on the exterior is a small cut out in the rear bumper where the previous owner had a tow hitch attached. I removed the hitch, but have not repaired the 2 inch cut out. My plan was to make a custom rear diffuser that would cover it and look better than original.
I just bought the Turbo Twist wheels that are currently on the car and had them powder coated this beautiful copper metallic color.
The interior is in excellent shape. I recently just reupholstered the front seats due to some cracking. I bought new factory floor mats which look great. The dash has a couple very small cracks by the defroster vents. Other than that the interior is near perfect. I have also purchased a wood dash trim kit which looks awesome in these cars. I have not installed it yet in case the buyer wants to keep the car original. But it will go with the purchase of the car as well, see the picture."

Car is in the middle of nowhere so I will have to do some research on a shop for PPI. I will see what he can tell me about why the respray was done but it was the previous owner.

tlarocque

Answer: Full repaint but unknown reason. No history on car prior to current ownership. I like Cobalt but I think I keep looking for one that has better documentation.

jsheiry

I think this is a fabulous car at a reasonable price. I talked to him about it a month or so ago and got the sense he sorted many things including putting a semi crack free dash in the car. ( not a fun job) He put new seat covers on and they look fabulous...most people who try this at home have a baggy mess on their hands. Cobalt blue with higher mileage than several Red or Black cars that are out there just under 100K miles and in the 17/18K range. Seems to me the rarer colors are just showing up for sale less and less. If you like Red or Black it seems there are several options that may be better values....but if you want a rare color car then look no further. Must admit Im not a fan of those wheels or color. Put the correct Cup 1's on that car and its eye popping!

I would personally prefer a well taken care of car that had a respray to one that was openly tracked by the owner. Not that the cars cant handle or desire the track treatment but certainly is openly saying we treated it rough on a semi regular basis. At some point there wont be many left that dont have a respray except complete collectible garage queens (concours/not track cars). Every Polar Silver car I have ever seen that has seen the elements for more than 75K needs the fenders and hood/horizontal surfaces resprayed.

I think he told me it was previously a Texas car and the sun had really taken its toll on various items. No relation to seller by the way just IMHO.

Tom R.

If the oil pan was out why werent the rod bearings done? Isn't that a weak spot on the 968 motor like on the 944 motor? Motor mounts? Otherwise looks nice. Old paint gets faded.

jeff968

The good news is that the car was re-sprayed the original color. It is very difficult to do a color change on a 968. That said, there are many ways to do a better paint job on a 968. Did they remove all the painted trim and paint separately and replace all the rubber seals? Did they remove the windshield and seal? the sunroof seal? All of these and many other questions can determine the quality of the respray. I would consider it after I knew the type of job that was done.

Jim C

Short answer - repaint would not bother me if done well.

Long answer - it all depends on what you're looking for... If you want a unique color, and something that appears to have had a lot of the mechanicals taken care of, then this may be a good buy. Of course, there could be other issues as Tom R suggests - like the bearings. Also, what about the pinion bearing? If this is a 6 speed, and the pinion hasn't been done, you may end up having to do it. Also, if you plan on trying to fix the internal cosmetic issues, be forewarned that quite a few of the unique color interior pieces are most likely NLA. Lots still available in black and classic grey, but outside of that, it's slim pickin's! If you're intending to do any track time, does the exterior color really matter? You need something mechanically sorted and safe more than a specific color in my opinion.

This last bit is totally my opinion, but if you're interested in buying a 944 or 968 with the intent of putting more miles on it via daily driving AND looking to AutoX / DE / track it AND not lose on resale if / when you sell it, you're out of your mind!!! I say that with the utmost respect!

At the end of the day - buy the car that fits your budget and puts the biggest smile on your face, and ensure you have a few grand set aside to address the things that will most likely pop up with a 20+yr old high strung 4 cylinder Porsche! I'm a sucker for unique colors - and cobalt is awesome! Wheels are not my cup of tea though!

Good luck with whatever you decide and keep everyone posted!

Paul Waterloo

I love that car and for $15K it seems like a very fair deal. I would pull the trigger on it if you were in the market. I keep looking at it, but I'm not in the market.

tlarocque

"This last bit is totally my opinion, but if you're interested in buying a 944 or 968 with the intent of putting more miles on it via daily driving AND looking to AutoX / DE / track it AND not lose on resale if / when you sell it, you're out of your mind!!! I say that with the utmost respect!"

I made a good chunk of change on a few 4 996 GT3s, a couple GT3 RSs and a 964 RSA a few years ago that were basically dedicated track cars. I know the ship on those cars has since sailed but it can be done and that's why I'm treading carefully as I move from those "special" 911 variants to another platform. I've had the same money in play on A LOT of cars for several years now which is probably mostly responsible for the fact that my wife hasn't left me. It satisfies my ADD.

What's the cost to do the rod bearings? I'm having e46 M3 flashbacks.

Agree 100% that those wheels would have to go. Not even sure there's a market for them... yuck. But I'd be sourcing at least a 2nd set anyway.

Appreciate all the comments.

chudson

Yes, rod bearings are a weak area but typically only on a car that is tracked often with a fast driver. The street driven cars seem to never experience a failure. Also, the write-up states that the "Original R-12 A/C system blows cold" which would make the car a '92. According to Porsche, the '92 and '93 connecting rods have one-time use bolts which means that once loosened, they must be discarded. Porsche does not offer connecting rod bolts and only sells rods in sets the updated version which are already fitted to a "true" '94 and '95. So if Porsche's rules are followed, even removing a connecting rod cap for bearing inspection would create the need for a disassembly of the engine for rod replacements. Has this rule been broken many times with success? Probably, but it's the reason that there are Carrillo's with the re-useable bolts and the Clevite 77 rod bearings going in the engine I'm building for my track car.

As to the re-spray, find a body shop or car dealer with a paint thickness gauge. I own the Elcometer - it's sorta the standard in the industry. If all you find is thick paint and no body filler, and there is no collision repair evidence underneath, buy the car if you like it. Some paints of this era don't hold up well when not garaged and unless you plan to compete in a all original or preservation class in a show, no biggie. I hope this helps.

Cliff

V2Rocket

looking for resale value in a 25 year old car of this type is tilting at windmills, so to say.

if you're that concerned, offer a lower price and just enjoy the thing.

Jim C

Checked out the 'bay listing last night... Interior looks to be in very good condition. Granted the new seat covers do not match the rest of the "patina" in the car, but overall, the interior is very nice. That's a plus in my book.

Still having a hard time with the wheels!

tlarocque

I totally agree on both counts. The seats look like rubber. Think I just need to be patient.