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Valvoline 20w50 VR1

 
Old 06-03-2016, 05:39 PM
  #16  
djantlive
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Did u guys know that high zinc will cause cats to go bad? Modern additives have much better agents to reduce wear that relying on zinc.
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Old 06-03-2016, 05:42 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by LexVan View Post
Yes. Do it. Or run Brad Penn semi synthetic.
I went from Brad Pen partially synthetic oil to Valvoline VR1 and noticed no difference. I keep reading about the dangers of synthetic oil. many on the 944 forum are using dino oil only.
I would like to try the Valvoline full synthetic oil. Has anyone had issues, leaks after switching?
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Old 06-03-2016, 05:51 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by djantlive View Post
Did u guys know that high zinc will cause cats to go bad? Modern additives have much better agents to reduce wear that relying on zinc.
Cats are cheap. Air cooled Porsche engines are NOT. I am not aware of a single cat failure on Rennlist from running Mobil V-Twin. I ran it in my 993 Turbo for +60,000 miles before I sold it to the next guy.
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Old 06-03-2016, 05:54 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by djantlive View Post
Did u guys know that high zinc will cause cats to go bad? Modern additives have much better agents to reduce wear that relying on zinc.
I do not want to destroy my catalytic.

ZDDP additive provides tough anti-wear protection enhanced with friction modifier to improve horsepower.

So is there a fully synthetic oil with ZDDP? I know I am probably making this more difficult than it has to be. I appreciate every ones impute.
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Old 06-03-2016, 05:57 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by LexVan View Post
Cats are cheap. Air cooled Porsche engines are NOT. I am not aware of a single cat failure on Rennlist from running Mobil V-Twin. I ran it in my 993 Turbo for +60,000 miles before I sold it to the next guy.

This is motorcycle oil?
Is there a link, amazon.
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Old 06-03-2016, 06:01 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by cool whip View Post
I do not want to destroy my catalytic.

ZDDP additive provides tough anti-wear protection enhanced with friction modifier to improve horsepower.

So is there a fully synthetic oil with ZDDP? I know I am probably making this more difficult than it has to be. I appreciate every ones impute.
Originally Posted by cool whip View Post
This is motorcycle oil?
Is there a link, amazon.
You are making this too difficult. Use Mobil V-Twin. It's Steve Weiner approved. Don't use any "racing oils". Yes, it's a motorcycle oil. You can buy it at just about every auto parts store, in the motorcycle aisle. Many times throughout the year it's on sale for about $9.00/quart. Normal price is about $12.

ZDDP levels are very good, and similar to the levels of the old days before the gubbermint got involved.
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Old 06-03-2016, 06:08 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by LexVan View Post
You are making this too difficult. Use Mobil V-Twin. It's Steve Weiner approved. Don't use any "racing oils". Yes, it's a motorcycle oil. You can buy it at just about every auto parts store, in the motorcycle aisle. Many times throughout the year it's on sale for about $9.00/quart. Normal price is about $12.

ZDDP levels are very good, and similar to the levels of the old days before the gubbermint got involved.
I already found the product on amazon, looks good. I will use V twin for my next oil change. I appreciate your help!
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Old 06-03-2016, 06:11 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by cool whip View Post
I already found the product on amazon, looks good. I will use V twin for my next oil change. I appreciate your help!
U r welcome. FYI, my colleagues family invented whipped toppings (Cool Whip).
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Old 06-03-2016, 08:01 PM
  #24  
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LexVan, just curious if you're sure that synthetic works. Maybe it's just people's "butt dyno" speaking, but it seems some have had additional oil leakage due to synthetic vs. Dino.
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Old 06-03-2016, 08:10 PM
  #25  
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curious, how much is a cat replacement on a 993/964?

i remember when the cat went on my mezger 997 gt3 it was a couple grand for 1 cat... lucky it was covered on warranty
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Old 06-03-2016, 08:24 PM
  #26  
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I recently discovered my local auto parts stores no longer stock it either. I talked to a manager and he said almost nothing made today uses over a 30wt so they stopped carrying all 50wt and only one 40wt on the shelf.

Funny thought.... our local Farm Supply store Fleet Farm at VR-1 of both blends in stock still.

Originally Posted by djantlive View Post
Did u guys know that high zinc will cause cats to go bad?
There is far more to that study than simply "zinc kills CATS".
There was a lot going on with emissions and gas mileage regulations in the last 90's. Many of these changes put far more oil fumes into the intake tract of these new engines. Look up the oil sludge issues that plagued VW/Audi, SAAB, Toyota etc.....

Our cars have been running high ZDDP oil since day one and there are plenty of 150k+ mile cars with original CATS.

Not to mention it's not like new oils have zero ZDDP. They went from 1100-1200 on average to 600-900...... so it's still in there

On that note. My wife's SAAB is about to turn 200k miles. Original CAT and I've been using high ZDDP oil since purchasing the car with 96k miles on it (so did the previous one owner). So.....exactly when is the CAT supposed to explode?

I'm not going to say ZDDP does no harm to CATS, but I honestly feel it's heavily overblown.

Originally Posted by djantlive View Post
Modern additives have much better agents to reduce wear that relying on zinc.
Zinc is needed in the high pressure area between the camshaft and lifter style in our older engines. This doesn't apply do most modern engines.
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Old 06-03-2016, 08:30 PM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by dhc905 View Post
LexVan, just curious if you're sure that synthetic works. Maybe it's just people's "butt dyno" speaking, but it seems some have had additional oil leakage due to synthetic vs. Dino.
I'm going to ping Steve Weiner to come back and address your question, so you get the best response.
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Old 06-03-2016, 08:46 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by cool whip View Post
So is there a fully synthetic oil with ZDDP?
See my post above, all oils have ZDDP, just newer thinner oils have reduced levels.

Anyway...this discussion is rather moot since I'm not aware of any 15w/20w-50 synthetic with the reduced ZDDP levels.
So few (if any) cars made today call for ticker oils nobody is making a reduced ZDDP oil anymore in 50wt. At least not easily found in the US.

The "scare" started in the early 00's when Mobil 1 dropped the ZDDP level in 15w-50. The current M1 15w-50 has the "old" levels.

Here is the latest PDF from Mobil 1, you can clearly see the ZDDP levels between the different weights:

https://mobiloil.com/~/media/amer/us...guide-2016.pdf


Originally Posted by LexVan View Post
Don't use any "racing oils".
I agree, except the current available VR-1 is not really a racing oil.

At one time there was a third VR-1 on the market that was a true, low detergent motor oil that said right on the front of the bottle: "NOT FOR STREET USE". They started marketing the two listed in this thread under the same name for street cars or street driven track cars. It has all the detergents needed for a street driven vehicle undergoing regular oil change intervals.

My opinion on synthetic vs conventional is based on mileage. I think it's a waste of money to run full synthetic in a car that is not a daily driver and sees less than 4k miles between changes (common on older Porsche's getting an annual oil change).

Just my $.02
YMMV
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Old 06-03-2016, 08:46 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by LexVan View Post
Cats are cheap. Air cooled Porsche engines are NOT. I am not aware of a single cat failure on Rennlist from running Mobil V-Twin. I ran it in my 993 Turbo for +60,000 miles before I sold it to the next guy.
HERE is true wisdom.

Right here.

This mirrors my experience with these cars as I've never, ever replaced a cat due to Zn/P poisoning. I have, however replaced a few cats due to incorrect air/fuel mixtures and/or misfires (a subject for another day).
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Old 06-03-2016, 09:05 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Hacker-Pschorr View Post
See my post above, all oils have ZDDP, just newer thinner oils have reduced levels.
True,......BUT context is absent here.

API SM & API SN rated oils contain insufficient ZDDP to protect engine parts in the air-cooled engines and I've seen FAR more evidence than I care to see anymore.

You need a minimum of 1200ppm of each element to protect these engines. Now, too much of a good thing is possible too, and oil containing ZDDP levels over 1600ppm require a very robust detergent package to prevent piston/ring issues.

This is a VERY complex subject that is poorly addressed on Internet Forums or websites. If you want an education, there are some excellent books available from the SAE library.
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