NeedAJoker

Hey All, I am in the process of trying to buy my first Porsche and have narrowed my search down to a 964. I much prefer C2 vs C4, but I won't let that stop me if a good C4 comes up...which leads me to my current situation.

The Car-There is a C4 for sale in my town, car is in great shape, 81k miles and the dealer listing shows--"This car just received: new clutch, clutch fork shaft kit, flywheel seal, power steering pump drive seal, major service including valve adjust, fuel filter, air filter, new plugs, new valve cover gaskets, oil bridge o-rings, distributor rotors, new belts, lower intake sleeve, new front and rear brake pads and rotors."

Also, the dealer let me know that the car's paint was was a bit off from what he assumes to be rock chip repair repray in the past, but terrible color matching, so he had a partial respray just re-done.

Research and PPI Results-CarFax is clean, and I agreed to getting a deal done if the PPI came back OK.

I took it in for PPI and the results were great, compression all 155-165, and leak down was only 6%. Where I ran into problems is the inspector found a leak of new looking oil, coming from up on top of the motor, and at a pretty good rate of loss, but for the life of him he can't find out where it is coming from. He said it isn't the normal culprit of head gasket(or lack of) leak, or the crank case. He also said if the engine was just out for the clutch, he can't figure out why they wouldn't have addressed the problem at that point.

Overall, he suggested that without knowing where that leak is coming from, he would be too worried there could be a head stud issue, or something else, and wouldn't move ahead with the purchase. We reached out to the dealer, who is a really honest guy, and he stated he did not want to investigate further into this as 964's leak and that it is likely normal.

Decision- The price is in line with what the car should go for, but would the repaint and above average leak with no-known cause be a big enough concern to walk away from this deal? I truly just started looking 6 weeks ago so I am not in a crazy hurry, just don't want to miss out on a car for something that likely isn't a big problem. Curious to your thoughts?

Carrera51

I think the source of the leak needs to be located, then make a decision based on what you find. Where did they find the leak. On top of the upper valve covers, or somewhere under the intakes?

crg53

Could be something as simple as the breather cover gasket, or the o-ring for the oil pressure/temp sender.

ryanowen

I'd ask for definition on "pretty good rate of loss".

NeedAJoker

I am not completely familiar with Porsche engines which is a bit annoying as the tech is likely giving me good hints as to trying to figure out the issue, but I just don't have the knowledge to remotely know what he is referencing. He said usually with a mirror and such he can see, but where this is coming from, the "air displacers" or something like that are blocking his view and he cannot find the source without taking off the very top part of the motor.

What is the likely hood that the compression test and the leak down could come back that positive, yet there be a underlying bigger issue like head studs?

Are head stud issues common on the 964? I know 74-77, but through my searches I see a few 964's with them but not a ton?

I see commonly that Top End rebuilds are done around 100k miles or so, give or take, so if I assume I would need to do that in the next 20k miles, would there be any real other issues beyond the annoyance of a leak until I get to that point?

I guess the other thing I could do is pay for them to take it apart and locate the leak, but they said that would be another $300 on top of the $270 I already paid for the PPI and I am not sure I want to get that much further into it without even having a clue what the chance they actually find the leak is.

Any other suggestions or should I just move on?

vagluv

Is it pouring oil? Most likely it's something simple. I would consider paying the extra money to locate the leak. And those prices sound pretty low.

What is the price on the car? Good enough to just take the chance and maybe need to have the engine apart sooner rather than later??

NeedAJoker

No I certainly wouldn't say pouring oil. Last time I looked at the car at the dealership, it had been sitting at a bare minimum of 15 hours(could have been a week+ for all i know) and there were probably 3-5 pea shaped drips on the ground from both sides of the engine. I have read everything I can find on 964 leaks and fully understand they should be expected in a lot of cases and not something to worry about.

Asking price of the car is $32,500. Here is the listing. http://www.jaremkosportsandclassics...._228334780.veh

I think the price is in line with where a C4 should be, just not in line with a C4 that needs a $10k head stud job.

The Flying Dutchman

I would consider pulling out the engine after pufchase if you buy it.and locate the leak, solve it and reseal what hasn't been resealed yet without having to tear down the complete engine. Then put it back in and enjoy your new ride.

dhc905

Anyone else think the compression numbers seem really low in the 150's?

NeedAJoker

I think this might be beyond what I am looking to do for my first P-car, and honestly, at $32.5k plus however much what you are saying to do would cost ($3k-$5k??) I am in the price range of some nice sorted C2's so I don't think that would be a smart route to go for me. If I could do more myself, perhaps, but this car is supposed to be my fun weekend driver initially, when I want to get confused and my hands greasy, I can go work on the 1958 Jag in the garage I have no clue what I am doing on, lol.

NeedAJoker

I actually thought this maybe as well, as the original listing from the dealer says they are "175,175,180,175,175,175" but the guy doing the PPI said "The engine seems amazing mechanically except for the leak in question.."

dhc905

When I spoke to my mech about my numbers (180-200) I asked him what higher numbers and lower numbers meant and I BELIEVE he said that if he rebuilt an engine and it was coming in at all 150's he'd think something may be off unless he was solving for a low or high compression motor (I assume a track thing).

Someone else who has actually rebuilt a motor can probably say more, but anecdotally that's what I heard.

Flea18

Based on what the listing said was done to the motor, and if the oil drips are roughly symmetrical, you could be looking at a common leak from where the cam chain housings meet the engine casing. If the PPI guy is sure it's coming from the top, though, a distributor seal would explain a wet left side but not the right. These motors are generally a little wet, unless a deliberate reseal or rebuild is done. Many owners accept it as a small price to own such a great car.

The color is beautiful, btw.

tbennett017

The compression numbers seem low. My motor at 200K is at 180 +/- 5 all around...

Also the price seems a little high? I'd love to see that price as it would bolster the value of mine, but my $.02

Also there are leaks, and then there are LEAKS. From what you describe that isn't super bad. I would check the oil pressure sender and other top end mechanical things.

Mixter

Fun? Weekend? Hey....maybe it's a cab you're lookin for.