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Forgive me Rennlisters, for I have sinned
This is my first confession, and I’m afraid it is rather lengthy. Here goes:
At a particularly eventful stage in my life back in 2001, I jacked in my job, started a company with some ex colleagues and (like you do) went shopping for a Porsche. Up until this point I had only ever owned mid-engined cars, having had a mis-spent childhood playing too many Top Trumps games (especially “Sports Cars” which featured a silver SC Targa and a brown (yuk!) Turbo), reading far too many car books and in particular pretty much anything I could read about Porsche (men, company and cars); there was always going to be an air-cooled flat 6 in my future. Hell, I even had the Bruce Anderson book on performance upgrades, the Porter/Morgan renovation book, and a Tamiya 1:24 959 & 1:12 934. Whilst I wanted a 993, they were out of my price range and I eventually settled on a 1993 Slate Grey 964 C2 with pale grey interior from the Aberdeen OPC, that came with reasonably low miles and a warranty. I’d post a picture, but you all know what they look like at a dealership. It even had the mini hoop spoiler and narrow-spoke 92 cup wheels (you know - the ones with the 944 part number that someone here had on their white car painted red). It was quite a step up from the MR2 it replaced and most of my miles were leisure miles; I don’t think I stopped grinning for weeks. Service time came, and I found enough time in my hectic schedule to take the car to my local OPC. As seems to be the norm, on collecting it I inverted my wallet and kept shaking hard until it was well and truly emptied but with the comfort of knowing it had had its premium washer fluid topped up with factory approved hands. Hmmm. At about this point, the company moved and the car became my daily commute – a round trip of about 70 miles. Though the company grew, finances were tight and the directors took the brunt so the next few oil and filter changes were done with my own fair hands. Likewise I located the source of a hydraulic leak in the steering circuit and replaced the offending pipework. To make matters both better and worse I then got married to someone who lived miles from the office and the poor 964 had to brave rain, snow and the horrors of gritted motorways far more regularly than I had intended. Since my dad had trained as an engineer, I knew the basics of a toolset but I neither had the time nor the funds at this point to gather all the information I needed to address the next big job that the car threw at me. The inevitable smoking and apparently increasing loss of full oil pressure showed I had an oil leak that didn't simply go away as I topped up the oil each trip. Removing the undertray revealed that the flexible pipe from filter housing to crankcase was cracked and the oil dripping on to the heat exchangers. So here comes the first significant sin; I thought I knew enough to replace the pipe myself. When it became apparent that the heat exchangers had to come off and that some of the retaining nuts were held on by Bavarian magic, I phoned my mate who managed a trade motor factors branch. A few days later I had a selection of crows foot spanners and long reach allen wrenches with which to attack the Plusgas-soaked nuts. Miraculously, eleven came off fine. The twelfth… well you know what’s coming. “Ping!” went the stud, and the nut - grimly attached to half of it - emerged from my socket. “Oh dear”, I said. Or something like it. Sin number two is, I know, unforgivable. What’s the general advice? “When in a hole, stop digging”? Well instead, I broke out my electric drill and never used stud extractor set. I’d seen the warning section in the Anderson book about bodged stud replacements and how to use a Timesert but still I continued. After all, the car was immobile on stands in front of the house, miles from any expert, unaffordable, Porsche dealer. I could do this. A few minutes later I had a cleanly drilled out stud stump – with a broken, hardened steel extractor stuck in it. At this point, my father turned in his grave and reminded me silently about the value of heating parts that need to be separated. “Oh, bother”, I said repeatedly. Or something like it. So I completed the job somewhat more carefully and fitted the new pipe (thanks Type911 for your reasonable prices and fantastic service). What to do about the stud? Hmm. Well, let’s just bolt the exhaust up for now and see how badly it leaks. Turns out it doesn’t leak but really, that’s no excuse for not shamefacedly taking it around to a grown up and watching them shake their heads and suck through their teeth. Instead, necessity kept me driving it, and though it had a trip to JZ Machtech who got it through an MoT test, the lack of maintenance investment began to tell. When the next harsh winter had it cutting out on the motorway I took 30 seconds to come to the considered expert conclusion that it clearly had an unidentifiable electrical fault somewhere in the fusebox and since the company now had enough to give me a car allowance there was only one thing for it. Oh, and we’d had a baby by this point too. -.- Don’t be daft, I wasn’t going to sell it! I might be guilty but not bonkers. Now not even well enough to move under its own combustion, I towed it down to the garage and hauled it in. Fast forward 6 years to May this year, when my wife said, “It was lovely to drive, that Porsche. Should we get it going again?” What I suspect she meant was, “The garage is a state. Get rid of the car.” Nevertheless: 1) New battery. Check the belts. Some ignition lights, not a sausage from the starter. 2) New DME Relay. All the right clicks, not a sausage from the starter. 3) Better get the starter out then lad. Pump all the tyres (I’m expecting them to be ruined but none seem perished so far. That’s a job that can wait.) Car on stands. Rear wheels off. Engine cover off. Transmission cover off. Drive shafts off (my god, those cap screws were hard work). Clutch slave out (couldn’t believe it when the nuts started to turn. One took the stud with it but hey). Top starter nut… loosened!!! Double check battery disconnected, now let’s get in to the starter. Moments (a few weekends) later and the starter is in my hand. 4) It’s pretty clear what’s up. I should have posted a picture but it won’t take 1000 words to describe a rusty lump. Imagine a rusty lump with a corroded cable between solenoid and brushes. So, a few minutes on t’internet and a couple of phone calls and I have a new brush assembly in the post from Wood Auto Supplies. And some zinc based primer, some satin black tough paint and some wire brushes. And some stainless nuts & bolts to replace the rust monsters encountered so far. 5) One newly refurbished starter on the bench and let’s see how it gets on with the new battery and jump leads. Oh dear. Nothing. Try clamping a big bit of multi strand copper earth wire to the connector. Whizzz!! Yipppee. 6) Starter back in, connectors tight, battery connected, immobiliser disarmed, turn the key. Drdrdrdrdrdrdrdrdrd. Pause. Drdrdrdrdrdrdr. Definitely not the right sounds but my pencil mark on the fan pulley has moved. Slightly. Back to Rennlist, more searches (this really is a lurker's paradise). Ah, of course. The earth. Thought it looked a bit rusty. Shall we have it out and add coppaslip? Ping! Not again! Broken earth bolt 11. For those who know about earth point 11, I don’t need to tell you that it is only accessible with a flexible drive, held at the full extent of your left arm (I’m right handed of course) with your right latching the drill on your left side by crossing over your body and safety glasses on to prevent the hot swarf from making a beeline for your eyeballs. Not a comfortable position. Even less comfortable when the drill bit binds in the whole and destroys the flexible drive all over your chest. Lesson: be very circumspect drilling out bolt stumps with a quill drive. 7) New earth bolt in the newly threaded earthing point and perhaps it’s a smart idea to take out some lower plugs to relieve the compression whilst (hopefully) some oil returns to the mechanical desert that is my crankcase. Disconnect the coils too I think. 8) Battery on, key again. Chugchugchugchugchugchug.chug..chug...chug....chug..drdrdrdrdr. Which means the battery is now struggling so it can sit on charge for a bit. This is beginning to look hopeful. 9) Well-charged battery back on. Turn it over quite a few times. A few times more. Let it rest for a bit to let the fuel evaporate before reconnecting the coils and dropping the (pretty good looking actually) plugs back in. HT leads all back & tight. 10) OK here we go. Turn the key. A little splutter. Turn the key again. “Whoomph! Fire up the willing engine, responding with a roar.” - And we have a project on our hands. So, Rennlisters, I have a million questions for you but don’t feel yet absolved of my obvious sin of owning a 964 and behaving so badly towards it. I’m suitably remorseful and embarrassed about the er “incident” with the exhaust stud and even more so about letting my lovely 911 languish un-loved under a blanket in a non air-conditioned and perhaps just slightly damp and cold British domestic garage with nothing but a few SORN certificates for company. (For the cross-the-ponders, they’re bits of paper you get from the Driver Agency that prove that you are optimistic about the prospects of your wreck seeing the open road once more but not presently able to drive it to the test centre under its own power). I humbly submit myself for chastisement and ritual humiliation. Z |
Hi Z,
Great to read your intro. What are your plans for it? |
Hi VR6-er.
The plan goes something like: 1) Refurb the brakes (in progress) 2) Replace clutch flexi hose 3) Bleed hydraulics 4) Tidy up surface corrosion from rear struts and trailing arms & generally clean up the crank case (see 9 below for thinking). 5) Adjust valve clearances (already struggling to separate cat & manifold: 4 sheared bolts, no movement. Heat perhaps?) 6) Sort out climate control (have some work in progress on the servo motors. Think there's a dud fan in the front somewhere too.) 7) Do air & fuel filters (plugs & dizzy look fine, though I have a belt/vent kit to fit) 8) Take it for an MoT test 9) See what oil leaks need addressing (doesn't seem like many) 10) Oil change (RAC man says synthetic oil doesn't degrade sitting in a tank and there's not much point in changing it until I'm ready to deal with leaks etc) Then tax it, insure it & drive. Seems a little way off. I've no aspirations to do an RS-a-like and I don't think I should be even thinking about performance upgrade until I've dealt with that stud. All suggestions gratefully received - apart from the "Why don't you sell it to me?" variety!! ;) Z |
Wow great intro story. I think I've satisfied my reading needs on RL for the day:bigbye:
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No advice, apart from, yes, heat! Heat is your friend! And if you trash the cat taking it off, a cat bypass is a nice option to be 'forced' to take..
Nice intro, plus excellent use of Rush lyrics! Are you still up near the sheep-worriers, then? |
Originally Posted by Johnny G Pipe
(Post 9815419)
No advice, apart from, yes, heat! Heat is your friend! And if you trash the cat taking it off, a cat bypass is a nice option to be 'forced' to take..
Originally Posted by Johnny G Pipe
(Post 9815419)
Nice intro, plus excellent use of Rush lyrics!
Originally Posted by Johnny G Pipe
(Post 9815419)
Are you still up near the sheep-worriers, then?
Z |
Great story, thanks for sharing it, please keep us updated as the saga unfolds!
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Entertaining intro!!! Please get us some pics ASAP:corn:
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Awesome read. :)
I'm glad my starter does not give me sausage. Andreas |
Thanks chaps. Pics will follow soon - I won't get back to the car until the weekend, although I may be able to take some of my refurbished rear disks. I'm pleased with these, as they now look like they're made from steel again (not rust) and I've sprayed the hats with high temperature paint. They don't look new - but that can wait until they need replacing. :)
I've taken the rear calipers with me whilst I'm away during the week. I've already got the pistons out on one side (used the brake pedal) but the pipe clamp was never going to allow me to do this to the other side so I'm hoping to find a compressed air source to blow them out. The logic behind removing them is that I want to take off and re-seat the stainless plates to ensure that my pads don't bind on them. Oddly enough, though my car was manufactured in late 1992 (according to th VIN) it has the 2 pot rears. I thought I should take out the pistons & seals before heating the plate retaining screws (see what I did then? ;)) to remove the plates. According to my information they're held in with Loctite 270 so ain't coming out until I melt it. Question 1 is: Is it possible to remove the seals without damaging them or alternately to heat the plate retaining screws with the seals in place without melting them? I've not been able to find any posts where this was done with 2 pots... Cheers, Z |
Originally Posted by ZG862
(Post 9815406)
Hi VR6-er.
The plan goes something like: 1) Refurb the brakes (in progress) 2) Replace clutch flexi hose 3) Bleed hydraulics 4) Tidy up surface corrosion from rear struts and trailing arms & generally clean up the crank case (see 9 below for thinking). 5) Adjust valve clearances (already struggling to separate cat & manifold: 4 sheared bolts, no movement. Heat perhaps?) 6) Sort out climate control (have some work in progress on the servo motors. Think there's a dud fan in the front somewhere too.) 7) Do air & fuel filters (plugs & dizzy look fine, though I have a belt/vent kit to fit) 8) Take it for an MoT test 9) See what oil leaks need addressing (doesn't seem like many) 10) Oil change (RAC man says synthetic oil doesn't degrade sitting in a tank and there's not much point in changing it until I'm ready to deal with leaks etc) Then tax it, insure it & drive. Seems a little way off. I've no aspirations to do an RS-a-like and I don't think I should be even thinking about performance upgrade until I've dealt with that stud. All suggestions gratefully received - apart from the "Why don't you sell it to me?" variety!! ;)Z |
Great intro! Welcome - we're all sinners to some extent :biggulp:
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Thanks for the welcome Laker - I think I may have the same 16" wheels as you. Nice.
I really need to get some pics up of those rear calipers. I have the usual rusty looking plate screws and (intriguingly) small white waxy looking deposits in the cylinder - which I thought I'd cleaned out but must remain in the connecting chambers and perhaps thoughout my dormant braking system. Q2: Anyone any ideas from my dodgy description what this might be or how worried about it I should be? Cheers :cheers:, Z |
Hello again.
Slow progress. I've managed to get all calipers and disks off now and am well into stripping down the calipers. Copious heat has helped remove many of the plate retaining button screws though I've a few that have "rounded off" the hex socket that I'm now trying to work an oversize imperial drive into (without much success - all suggestions on this very welcome). I answered my own Q1: The dust seals come out with a little prising from some watchmakers screwdrivers, though those for the larger pistons on the front require the guide plate to be removed first. It seems to be OK to shield them to avoid damage from my gas torch when persuading the button screws. None seemed to have suffered any visible heat damage. However, the front piston dust covers are in worse condition than the rears - a few have splits, though the seals seem to be in OK nick with no evidence of fluid leaking past them. Q3: Should I replace all dust covers/seals or just those with visible damage? Front disks seem to have faired less well than the rears, with some corrosion pitting on the inboard face. (Outboard cleans up pretty well with just a few small pits). So... Q4: Replace the disks or have them skimmed? If the latter, do I just look up "local chap with big lathe" or is there some black art involved? Many thanks in advance for your advice. Z |
Eeeek!
Finally got the cat off, removed the LH tin & distributor caps in preparation for the valve adjustment, only to find broken dizzy drive belt (how long was it like that??) and cracked cat casing. Fortunately I have a new belt, but the job isn't getting smaller... |
Originally Posted by ZG862
(Post 9855708)
Slow progress. I've managed to get all calipers and disks off now and am well into stripping down the calipers. Copious heat has helped remove many of the plate retaining button screws though I've a few that have "rounded off" the hex socket that I'm now trying to work an oversize imperial drive into (without much success - all suggestions on this very welcome).
Also you can dremel a slot in the top and try a chunky screwdrive bit, the heat of the dremel may well free it up a bit too.
Originally Posted by ZG862
(Post 9855708)
I answered my own Q1: The dust seals come out with a little prising from some watchmakers screwdrivers, though those for the larger pistons on the front require the guide plate to be removed first. It seems to be OK to shield them to avoid damage from my gas torch when persuading the button screws. None seemed to have suffered any visible heat damage.
However, the front piston dust covers are in worse condition than the rears - a few have splits, though the seals seem to be in OK nick with no evidence of fluid leaking past them. Q3: Should I replace all dust covers/seals or just those with visible damage? The porsche/brembo replacement comes with a piston which makes it very expensive to do all of them. http://www.biggred.co.uk/ will probably do a full set more cheaply - you may well find someone similar more local to you. BTW Any bubbling in the rubber means the metal ring is rusting under the seal. Anyway these are just dust seals the main hydraulic seal is tucked away 1/4inch into the cylinder so the brakes will work fine without them, infact some earlier applications of the same brembos came without seals, as do many motocycle and race car brakes.
Originally Posted by ZG862
(Post 9855708)
Front disks seem to have faired less well than the rears, with some corrosion pitting on the inboard face. (Outboard cleans up pretty well with just a few small pits). So... Q4: Replace the disks or have them skimmed? If the latter, do I just look up "local chap with big lathe" or is there some black art involved? The factory minimum thickness listed for the discs don't allow for much of a skim on worn discs, and replacements are fairly cheap. So skimming is marginal cost-benifit-wise. You can skim on a lathe, but there are better/more reliable ways, one which acts more like a grinder, and one which is done with the disc still on the car. |
Thanks Alex; your advice is much appreciated. I'll give the tangential chisel technique a go.
Er - "Brake grease" - I realise I've never done this job properly with anything other than hydraulic fluid as lubricant. Will my coppaslip be OK or should I be using a silicone grease? Z |
You're probably fine just using brake fluid, fitting the actual pistons etc. I just like to get something under the dust seal though to keep out the corrosion and crud, just needs the next person who changes the pads to be a bit rough and the dust seals get nicked easy enough.
coppaslip for the nuts and bolts and the backs of the brake pads, but not on the hydraulics or rubber, you want some nice silicone grease for that. |
Originally Posted by alexjc4
(Post 9859695)
coppaslip for the nuts and bolts and the backs of the brake pads, but not on the hydraulics or rubber, you want some nice silicone grease for that.
Miller Oils red rubber grease/Silverhook Ceramic protector/other? Thought I'd try and post some pics too (this may not work): Starter mid service: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps33bbce91.jpg And reinstalled: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...ce/Starter.jpg Rear right disk before: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps0977c367.jpg and after: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l.../RearRight.jpg Before and after on the rear brake guards: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...psc0b83da8.jpg Cheers, Z |
Looks good! I'm jealous, the starter is so much easier to get at on a C2 compared to a C4.
That Millers stuff would be fine, I use some weird green stuff with French writing on, of unknown origin, it's such a lovely emerald green colour though you know its got to be good :) If you've not already fitted them you could paint the backing plates with some barbeque paint or something, I fitted new ones a couple of years back and they are already beginning to rot at the bolt holes - kicking myself slightly now. |
Good work!!
please post some pics of car!! |
Originally Posted by alexjc4
(Post 9867486)
Looks good! I'm jealous, the starter is so much easier to get at on a C2 compared to a C4.
Originally Posted by alexjc4
(Post 9867486)
That Millers stuff would be fine, I use some weird green stuff with French writing on, of unknown origin, it's such a lovely emerald green colour though you know its got to be good :)
Originally Posted by alexjc4
(Post 9867486)
If you've not already fitted them you could paint the backing plates with some barbeque paint or something, I fitted new ones a couple of years back and they are already beginning to rot at the bolt holes - kicking myself slightly now.
The fronts, however are painted steel and I think when I get to strip them I'll discover that they're shot. Replace with RS ones maybe?
Originally Posted by jack.pe
(Post 9867536)
Good work!!
please post some pics of car!! Cheers, Z |
Can I pick your brains chaps?
On my task list was to clean up the trailing arms and rear struts (as there's some unsightly surface rust on the springs and dampers - check out my 3rd pic above) so I've levered off damper to trailing arm bolts (wow - there's some torque!) dropped the struts (all skin now removed from knuckles) and taken my wire cup brush to the trailing arms. So now I want to take off the AR bar so have undone the nuts at the end of the drop link. And tapped at the top of the drop link with my rubber mallett. Then added lots of penetrating fluid. Removed the ARB mounting bushes. Tapped (a bit harder) at the top of the link again. Is heat still my friend or is there a trick to this one? Cheers, Z |
Sorry - more questions.
I'm contemplating having my front brake calipers sandblasted; the plate surfaces are slightly corroded, no amount of carb cleaner will make the visible bits gleam and besides, the decals look grubby. Hell, I may even do the rears too. There's a rubber(?) spacer on the interconnect pipe. Whilst I'm pretty handy fabricating the pipes and have plenty of cunifer left over from the new hose to caliper hard lines I've had to make up, what's the spacer tube made from and where do I get it? Also, any tips on blasting? Obviously I want them to stay WELL clear of the cylinders, dust cover grooves and threaded bits, but are there any other "gotchas"? Thanks!! Z |
Please?
(:atwhore:) |
I can't help on the blasting front but I can't imagine any harm will be done, obviously you need some paint, powdercoat or even plating i guess. Don't forget that the spring plates will lift and pinch the pads if the coating is too thick.
The link pipes are pretty cheap from porsche or type911 and are nice quality, I also have the gear to fab pipes, and I've made up a couple for my car, but given the choice i'd get the factory bits. |
I left all the bleed nipples/pad plates in but just finger tight and put bolts in the holes were the brake pipe goes in & just got him to blast the out side of the Calipers as the inside came up a treat with a scrub...& just replaced the dust seals pistons that looked worn & left the crossover pipe thingy on..
http://i1177.photobucket.com/albums/...4/50a0ebbd.jpg |
Forgot I put new nipples on after as there only a few £££ from a good motor factors...
This guys good for for bits..www.porschecalipers.co.uk |
Chaps, I clearly have no manners - bumping for response then leaving it for so long.
In my defence, I crafted a reply then lost it on posting due to some forum server software problem. Grrr. Anyway, Fuch: Thanks for your pics, comments & suggestions. I'm sure my wife will be delighted when I tell her I need a shiny new set of six nipples. Scaramanga, eat your heart out. Do you have any "after" pics of those calipers so I can see what I should be aiming at? I've been battling for days to remove the last of the plate retaining button screws and finally managed the last two today. This is what the calipers looked like before heading for shot blasting. http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps054947f1.jpg http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps435cefec.jpg As you can see, I ended up removing the cross-feed pipes too (just because). Still looking for some suitable tubing for the centre section of new ones or a may pay a visit to Type911. Whilst I was scratching my head about how to get those blasted screws out, I turned some attention to the lump of rust. This particular LoR will be better know to you as the clutch slave cylinder which I last battled with on my quest to free the starter top mount nut. It's been dangling away there on the end of a perished flexible hose and I knew that one if not both would need replacing. I spend all of 5 minutes trying to separate the 2 in situ before swearing mildly and reaching for the hacksaw. A vice and ring spanner made light(er) work of the job. Whilst I was there I broke loose the other end - this time with more swearing and a flare nut spanner braced against the gearbox. 20 minutes with the wire brush and the LoR started to take on the shape of a slave cylinder. Even the bleed screw thought better of resisting. Coat of etch primer, couple of coats of tough black and tada!: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...pse11ed3c4.jpg Tell me that doesn't look brand new!! I'm a little worried that the tub nut on the hard line may not be moving independently and that this will be a problem when I come to reassemble. I suppose the thing to do is fix the flexible pipe to the hard line 1st then try to get the slave on and in place without introducing a twist. We'll see. So, whilst I wait to get the calipers back then send them off for the stove-enamel treatment its either valve adjustment or sorting out that distributor. How about you choose! (i.e. if you think I'm dumb doing the former before the latter, please tell me!!) Cheers, Z |
I would recomend the VHT caliper paint which gives them an enamel like finish, used the halfords paint on the front which was crap.
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There is a pleasant sense of acheivement when the last screw comes out of those plates :)
Clutch slave looks very smart, I think we had a similar situation a while back when I was helping on Frank's car, the hard pipe end was solid, and as per your plan we bolted up the slave to the soft hose nice and tight and then mounted it to the gbox, the was not much pre load twist on the hose so it looked like it wasnt going to unscrew itself anytime soon. |
I spose you could just split some 3/16 vacume hose and use that on the link pipes...
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Originally Posted by alexjc4
(Post 9911050)
I spose you could just split some 3/16 vacuum hose and use that on the link pipes...
:) (Won't actually need to split it if I put it on before flaring the ends. Will it resist the heat?) |
Comme ca http://www.jjcraceandrally.com/Produ...ilicone%20Hose
You'll find 3,4,5mm with varying wall thicknesses available. Strictly not rated for top brake temps so it will get cooked and harden but it wont burst into flames or anything. |
Muchas gracias!
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I figured that one distributor would be fine to do the valves and then I could worry about doing the belt etc with the more complex job out of the way.
Now I'm sure I'd had the cam covers off before and I don't remember getting a Mobil 1 bath thrown in. Quick mental process went something like "Tank is below the level of the crankcase and I'm sure it wll drip a bit but nothing too serious. Muppet! Carefully took off the nuts securing the lower left cover and saw a bit of a drip forming - nothing unexpected. Gentle tap and off came the cover ... and an accompanying gentle but persistent waterfall of about 3 litres of Mobil's finest. Much scrabbling about searching for more containers and something to deal with the puddle forming under the car. So, number of valves adjusted = 0, amount of time spend cleaning the garage about 2 hours. Can I stress to anyone thinking of adjusting their valves that a good time to do it would be before you refill following an oil change. Don't forget that valve adjustment is supposed to be done with a cold engine so don't get any bright ideas about doing it whilst the oil drains. The postman delivered more tube nuts this morning (having brought caliper decals yesterday), so I may make a start on the cross-feed pipes. Z-the-oily. |
So, I started on the valve adjustment today. Looking at the manual, it seemed that sliding in the feeler gauge should be really simple. No so in my case. The inlet on No.1 sits in a pretty crowded space and I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong. In the end I gave up with this approach and after releasing the lock nut, I wound the adjusting screw back 2 turns until I could tip the rocker back and push the tool in. I then wound the screw back in against the feeler and found the position where I could still just move the feeler (i.e. not clamped by the adjuster) and locked it all back up again.
Can anyone advise me if this sounds OK? The position I get to is almost identical to the original (i.e. virtually no adjustment needed) so either they've held adjustment well, were a bit too tight before or I'm not using the gauge correctly. Only had to catch a couple of eggcups worth of oil when I took the right hand covers off by the way, so the car must be pretty level. I also unplugged the engine from the fusebox to give myself a bit more clearance on the left hand side. Number of valves adjusted = 8. Went to see the chap who is sandblasting the calipers for me. He's not finished yet but showed me how they are coming on. His prime business is heat treatment and he'd popped them in his oven with another job to soften the original paint and ensure he didn't have to be too brutal with the blaster. I hope the seals in the rears can take the cooking; guess I'll find out when the time comes to bleed them. I need to follow up another quote for stove-enamelling them once done. 10cm of high temperature silicone tube arrived in the post (at exorbitant cost for what it is but ho hum) - 5mm inside diameter/10mm outside; looks a good match to the original. Also managed to strip down the rear struts and start cleaning them up - I'll post some pictures up soon. All in all I'm making slow but steady progress and starting to feel suitably penitent. Starting to really look forward to driving out of the garage under power - though there's a long list of jobs to do before that happens. Thanks for looking in, Z |
Quick before and after on the rear struts:
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...psb93f4861.jpg This is the extent of the pitting, and frankly I'm not that worried. If they fail, I'll be forced to replace with a set of Bilsteins (:rockon:): http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...pse59ce4eb.jpg For the sake of completeness, here are the springs part way through stripping the 1st one: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps1f40133c.jpg Not sure I'll be able to remove all the little bits of surface rust but again if they're clean, I figure a coat of etch primer and some black should last until I need to upgrade. Anyone know what the blue splodges of paint indicate? And, because I know how much we all like photos, here's the cross feed pipe development: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps898fb379.jpg As you can see, I've yet to bend the pipes to shape - just pondering how I'll get them as accurate as Brembo do - the smallest pipe bender I have is 15mm so I'll probably just bend around a scrap of dowel. Calipers should be back from blasting this week and I hope to pop down to Type911 & pick up seals tomorrow too. I note that pretty much everybody suggests you replace the plates as a matter of course; whilst mine were filthy and encrusted with accumulated brake dust they polished up like new so I'm going with the old ones. I don't believe that the pads are manufactured so accurately that the few microns I've taken off the surface with the rotary wire brush will be material. Anyone have a tip for preventing the tube nuts seizing against the pipe, by the way? I was just going to smear a little Coppaslip in there, same as the threads. Cheers, Z |
Great writeup.
I would empty the gas tank and look at the gas for any bits of rust or varnish. Was it full when you put it into the garage? Check the fuel pump for any contaminants and buy a new fuel filter-maybe 2. I don't live where rust is an issue, but maybe some RTV to seal out moisture between the nuts and pipe? |
Hi Steve.
The tank was near empty before hibernation. Reading up I understand that the fuel could easily have "gone bad" in the tank over 6 years but it smells OK at the air filter and was seemingly dry enough for the engine to fire up with only one distributor working. Good tip about replacing the fuel filter & checking the pump though. The garage is reasonably dry - all the rust you see is attributable to a couple of harsh winters spent pounding the salted motorways with insufficient attention given to blasting the underside with fresh water as frequently as the poor car deserved. I'm amazed and delighted how well everything is cleaning up; the rear calipers were fine and I'm only really repaining them so that they match the fronts (which were less fine). Amazingly there are no signs of rust in the usual places; windscreen frame looks as good as new. My newly found OCD tendency wants me to take EVERY component out and refurbish it but I'm trying to keep focussed on getting the fundamentals done first and getting a "runner"; there's little point in having Big Reds etc on a car that lives on axle stands. Thanks for stopping by though! Z PS/ RTV = Room Temperature Vulcanising? i.e. puncture repair stuff? |
In this context rtv = silicone sealant.
I've tried a few things to ward of seized brake nuts including red brake grease, coppaslip, waxoil , nothing seems to work especially well. So I'be interested if anyone has any tips. |
Great thread.
Adjusting valves - backing out the adjustment then inserting feeler gauge and tightening down to proper clearance is just fine and faster than trying to wedge the gauge in. Struts - if those are Boge then you might consider just replacing them with Bilstein HDs. The Boges don't last much beyond 40-50k miles. And if you do the Bilsteins then consider also swapping in HR lowering springs (lowers US ride height on order of 1-2 cm or so, probably does less compared to European ride height, but well matched to the Bilstein HDs). Looking forward to the next installment and eventual pictures of the complete car. :) |
Thanks Dave; kind words and very useful info. I have Bilsteins and HRs on my shopping list but they may have to wait for a bit. Based on your advice re the lifespan of the Boges, i'll spend less effort refurbing them and just slap some paint on to protect them briefly.
Didn't make too much progress this weekend but will write up in the next couple of days. Still only 8 valves done. Z |
Can't believe I missed your intro - what a great read with lots of flare.
Pictures are a must. |
Thanks for the kind words Frank. I'm working on the pictures, but having a few problems with the machine I usually use to connect the camera to. I'm loving your engine project by the way - really want to hear that thing rumble.
Down in the garage, progress is slow (hence the general lack of updates). I had a bit of a problem with the brake decals in that I read decals from the ebay ad to mean plural - and the seller meant singular. We got it all sorted in the end and the additional pair arrived yesterday. So, today, I thought I'd finish off assembling the calipers and get them back on the car. Not to be. The carpet monster's big brother has eaten a pair of 36mm pistons. I know they're around somewhere - carefully bagged for cleaning and replacement but I'm damned if I can find them. I searched under the car and found some part finished disassembly - the left hand rear wiring connector and the heater bypass valve, so got distracted and thought they may aswell come out now. I thought myself lucky to get only a couple of grammes of road muck in my eye as they did so. I can now do a "before" and "after" as compared with the right hand bits, which are now KTC (kitchen-table-clean - but don't tell Mrs Z that it's not just a figure of speech). My odyssey to source new rear strut base pivot bolts finally came to an end. I know I could have forked out for the Posrche ones - but after all, they are nothing more than a 10.9 spec 100mm M14 fine thread bolt - and surely my local fastenings specialist could source me a couple of those with no bother? Alas no. It's taken about 6 weeks and has (eventually) involved them cutting down some longer bolts and re-theading them on the lathe (which took 3 weeks). All for the princely sum of £7.93 the pair - I can't see how they'll make a profit, but hey. I've finished reassembling the rear struts too - though I couldn't work out any possible way of torqueing the nuts to spec so went with the "good'n'tight" method advised above. The workshop manual shows a special tool which seems to have a tiny opening through which they presumably grasp the main piston shaft but I can't see how that's going to work. The manual also calls for the use of tyre assembly compound on the upper bracket before fitting it into the mounting point. Hmmm. Do I have a drum of that knocking around in the garage? Do I want one? Time to pay my tyre fitters a visit, with 2 struts in the passenger seat. "Please may I buy 2 brushfulls of assembly compound?" I said, nursing a damper under my arm. The guy grinned and prepared both for me FOC. (National Tyres in case you're interested and they've done all our tyres for a few years now in case anyone is thinking this is an outrageously generous response). He explained that it is really just liquid soap. What with having lathered struts and shiny new pivot bolts, it would have seemed churlish not to put one back in the car (even though they're a bit in the way) so the right one is back in and finger tight. It's going to be really snug to get the torque wrench in at the top so may be another "G&T" setting. I decided to lose patience with the rear A/R bar that didn't want to follow the manual's advice and helpfully drop out when I undid the nut a few weeks back. Penetrating oil didn't help either so I put the nuts back on and gave them a judicious tap with the club hammer. Satisfyingly, I won this battle and now have an A/R bar to clean up. No progress on the valve adjustment which is poor on my part because it means the covers are still off and any over-inquisitive spider might end up in the oil system. I'd done the 1st 4 cylinders but couldn't remember where I was with the crank so have just turned it back to TDC and will advance by 600 degrees to do the next one if/when I can find some time. S'pose I'd better fix the computer next so I can post some progress pictures of my shiny brakes & struts. If anyone has any knowledge of what I did with those other 2 brake pistons I'd be grateful... Z |
A miracle! A miracle!
Sorry chaps - it's been a while but life gets in the way.
Last up I was struggling a bit with my nuts. The one's between manifold and catalyst naturally. The chap servicing my daily runner (who has a 993 Turbo it turns out) suggested that when the combination of heat and corrosion hardens them this much they really need to go in the pillar drill - and this clearly means the exhaust will have to come off. Those of you with long memories will remember that the original sin in this thread involved the poorly advised use of hardened steel stud extractors in the inner stud of No.1 cylinder's exhaust port resulting in a broken extractor wedged into the stud and an "oh well, let's refit the exhaust with 11 nuts and see what happens" approach. So I was reluctant to face the exhaust again. "Let's give it a go and see if they move" I thought. They did move. The ring spanner is perfect for all the nuts and a long socket with a cut down 8mm allen bar made short work of the rest. I needed to remove the primary silencer, the cabin air duct and right hand rear plastic capsule but hey presto, off came the manifolds! Looks like brass nuts and loads of coppaslip was a good idea. The miracle? Take a look at this: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...0420-00014.jpg That's No.1 exhaust port. Cleaned up gingerly with a little bit of wire wool but otherwise unmolested. I looks like the combination of heat and vibration has shaken out the broken extractor and the original stud. Looks to me that I can see right into the end of the original drilling. The only bad bit appears to be that the original thread is well and truly gone. So what next Rennlisters? My ancient Bruce Anderson Performance Handbook says Timesert not helicoil but do you think this can be attempted in situ? I recon I'd need to make up a guide from a bit of steel with holes at the correct centres bolted to the remaining stud but it seems feasible to clean up the hole and tap it for an insert without having to remove the head. Anyone got a recommendation of where to get Timeserts or know the spec I need? Whilst we're there (groan) does anyone spot anything on the pic that I ought to be worried about? Here's a pic of 1 & 2 together: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...0420-00018.jpg Dare I reuse the gaskets or must they be replaced? Finally, here's the reason I'm there. Let's see if they prove any easier out of the car: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...0420-00019.jpg Thanks for reading; any help with the myriad of questions gratefully received. Z |
Anyone? :)
|
Given the environment it will be working in, I'd deffinately use a Timesert. From sat in my chair looking at your pictures :-) I can't see any obvious reason why it couldn't be done in situ.
As this is an area that will experience a large degree of thermal abuse, the tolerances of any drilling/taping required for the insert will be quite critical. Make sure you buy *exacty* the right sized drill they specify and of good quality. You will need to countersink the insert otherwise the flange will stand proud and the exhaust may not seal properly. This will be the tricky bit since you don't want to use a normal drill as it will cut the seat with an angle. Edited to add: Other things you may need to consider: If you do need to drill the hole, is there sufficient material around it that won't cause you to break through the 'step' edge of the exhaust port. You'll probably be ok but in some of the pictures it looks close, as if the port is not central. Also if the height of the timesert flange is less than the thickness of the compressed exhaust gasket, you may be able to get away without countersinking it. You'd also have to enlarge the through hole in the gasket to seat around instead of on-top of the flange. |
Thanks very much for your advice, Rob. Seems then like the next thing for me to do is get my hands on an M8 Timesert and take it from there. I guess I can measure up the spacing from another exhaust port to make up a drill guide so as to ensure the insert is truly perpendicular to the face of the cylinder head.
Still can't get my head around the vanishing stump though. Z |
As you only get one shot at this :-) putting in the extra effort to fabricate a kind of jig/drill guide would certainly be beneficial - You could then lend it out to other rennlisters afterwards :-)
A slow drilling speed is your friend here. |
Is this the video you are looking for?
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There is a thread regarding this sort of drilling guide jig on pelican i think there a couple of people that sell them.
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Here's one version of the jig, with a link to instructions. This can be done in situ.
http://www.stomskiracing.com/products.php?id=8 |
Blimey. All quiet then a flood of REALLY useful information. Thanks very much everyone.
Glad I was sitting down when I followed the Stomski Racing link, Ken. That's exactly what I had sketched on my pad for a guide (though without the multitude of centering discs) but I think I may have a chat with my brother in law and see if he could ask one of the apprentices at his work to do "a little practice piece"... Rob - I'll be happy to lend once done. I'll never need it again, after all. :D V6ER - that's exactly what I was looking for. That phrase has Star Wars overtones. ("These are not the droids we are looking for.") :) Thanks again, Z |
Originally Posted by ZG862
(Post 10411458)
That phrase has Star Wars overtones. ("These are not the droids we are looking for.") :)
Z |
Can anyone confirm the stud spec for me? 999 062 007 02 is described as "Stud BM 8 x 22" in the manual and 999 062 239 02 as "Stud BM 8 x 30". I assume my missing one is the 30mm variant but am I correct in assuming that I need the M8 x 1.25 spec thread?
Is this ( ) the kit I am looking for? :) Z |
To avoid guess work can you not check the thread on one of the existing studs? With a pair of calipers, measure the distance over 10 'peaks' of the the thread. Divide that value by 10 and you'll have the pitch.
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Thanks Rob. Alas I'm presently 5359.948 miles (approx) from my 964 at the moment so wondered if anyone knew? I'm reasonably sure that M8 x 1.25 is the standard metric thread but I reckon someone out there knows for sure whether this is the same as the exhaust studs.
Cheers, Z |
Am I dim or what?
3 Attachment(s)
Well I'm now 5359.948 miles closer to my 964 so work has slowly begun again.
The car hasn't fixed itself it would seem and again I really need your help... Lots of little jobs on the go (I'll post some pictures below rather than type lots) but the killer today was when I tried to reconnect the rear brakes. Remember I had all the callipers stripped and repainted? Whilst they look beautiful, it would seem that the heating the guy did prior to blasting must have cooked the inter-half seals on the rears, as when I connected up the new lines it started raining brake fluid from the lower edge of the calliper. I checked the bleed screw and it is not coming from there; since they are the earlier 2 pot type there is no external pipe running between the cylinders. So what do I do? Can the seals be replaced economically or should I throw them at a wall, weep and seek out some 4 potters? Cheers, Z (Here's just a few pics of stuff I've been working on. No I didn't shear the bolts on the left hand engine tin - that must have been a dealer before my time. No fun trying to fix though.) |
Anyone got a suggestion on the callipers? I'm assuming that it basically a couple of O rings between the halves that have disintegrated.
If I "upgrade" to the 4 pot version am I right in thinking I will also need new discs and proportioning valve? Cheers, Z |
Discs only need replacing if worn. You will need proportioning valve.
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Thanks VR6-er. My initial concern is whether or not the original internal seals can be replaced before I throw them at a wall!! :)
Z |
Hello again. I figure I had nothing to lose by splitting the offending caliper and this is what I found:
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...526_153705.jpg Looks to me light the miniature doughnut is toast, so I'll need 4 of the little blighters. Suggestions as to where I'll find some would be most welcome. I finally got around to getting my guide tool made and it fits like this: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...525_154857.jpg. It turned out to be a fairly simple job to drill out (hole was just a little more oval than I would have liked) then rebate, tap and fit the insert. With a stud test fitted it looks like this: http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/l...525_173452.jpg To my surprise, this turns out to be one of the easier jobs I've attempted. All the reading I have done points towards fitting bog standard mild steel studs and brass nuts smothered in Coppaslip (like I did last time around to the non-broken ones). Does anyone have a different view? Does it make sense to attempt to replace the other "weathered" studs while I'm there or let sleeping studs lie? Thanks for looking in. Z |
Well it took a bit longer than I planned(!), but I drove up to Bigg Red in Worcester yesterday and got me a few 11mm diameter 2mm thick grommets. See? wasn't that hard. A few hours later and I've dropped them into callipers (the 2nd one was a bu**er to split) and they're now on the car, as is the clutch slave cylinder, mostly.
The latest problem has come with the front brakes, where I've tackled the "simple" job of replacing the flexible hoses. Right hand side was slow but straightforward but the left is turning into a REAL nightmare: The hard line upstream of the flexible pipe didn't want to separate. Cue lots of penetrating fluid, swearing and a rounded off tube nut even with my fancy Britool tube nut spanners. It's the usual story; the tube nut corrodes on to the pipe just enough to stop them moving independently. Turn the tube nut and it destroys the pipe. Decided I could sacrifice this pipe as it is just a short loop to the ABS unit and my flaring tool is fun and under-used. More penetrating fluid & swearing until the nut gave up, leaving just the simple job of disconnecting the other end of the loop from the ABS. ... Except it won't move and the current state is that I've cut off the pipe to give better access and left the exceedingly rounded off tube nut sat there overnight to think carefully about its predicament and how much trouble it is in. I'm reluctant to put a gas torch on it given the confined space and proximity to the fuel tank (though there really can't be anything but a couple of petrol molecules left in there). I'll try and get a picture or two posted - after I've invented some more swear words. Grrrr. Z |
Forgive me Rennlisters, for I have sinned
Wow, really took you some time...;)
On the matter of the tube nuts..heat is your friend. I destroyed two tubes on mine trying to get them to move without heat. If you don't mind spending money on another tool you might not need all that often, I've had good results with one of these induction heating coils. Safer than using a gas torch near the fuel tank. Best of luck! |
Thanks Badluck! Appreciate the advice - and heat was indeed the answer.
I gave it a half hearted attempt in situ and then decided I didn't like breathing smoking stonechip with me jammed up in the wheel arch. I promised some pictures. Here's the situation after I'd cut the pipe. The offending tube nut is bottom left: https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...91de8dfa4c.jpg Next, off with the ABS unit cover to reveal some spaghetti: https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...75a5a6538f.jpg And out with the bracket, on to the bench where I could point the gas torch with a little more finesse: https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...749b679b89.jpg ...Then finally a brand spanking new pipe fabricated and in place with a smear of copper grease on the threads. https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...ee45e1f25d.jpg I then dug out the rear ARB from a dusty corner of the garage, set to work at it with the wire wheel and put a coat of etch primer on it. Cleaned up the exhaust stud threads and hung the primaries loosely to get them out of my way and see if everything still lines up. Some internet searching led to Roger Harradine's contact details, and from whom I ordered a pair of GRP front engine "tin" pieces; I'm sick of being showered with small pieces of rust from the originals every time I venture near the gearbox and people seem to say nice things about these replacements. Should arrive in about a week or so. This morning, I shall mostly be putting a coat of black on top of the ARB and adjusting the handbrake. Some pictures of much improved braking system to follow shortly. Thanks for looking in; All comments, suggestions etc. welcome. Z |
Quick question:
I have a nagging feeling that replacing the front engine tin requires the power steering drive casing to come off and this needs a special tool. Is that right? Z |
Well its all moving forward albeit slowly.
I found when preparing to put the rear a/r bar back in that there was a broken bolt. After liberal soakings in Plusgas I'd ordered up a pack of M8 half nuts to see whether I could lock them together and wind the bolt out of the back end but there simply isn't enough thread there to get a good lock. Remembering the mantra that "heat is my friend" I borrowed a aluminium tray from Mrs Z as a heat shield to prevent me torching the fuel lines and put the bolt stub though a couple of cherry red heat cycles. Hey presto, the thing started to move and much as I hate using mole grips, these proved to be just the trick get the thing out. Moments later, a/r bar refitted. Now starting to get the engine tin and plugs back in which has not been as straightforward as I would have liked. I'd taken some of the sealing skirt out of its channel in one of my "let's lose all this oily crud" drives and it seems to have stretched, such that when reinstalled in the channel it is all wavy and won't make clean seal against the tin. One for the future engine drop I reckon; replace the lot. At which point I can attend to the 2 broken tin mounting bolts (not my doing) in the left hand cam housing too... After this I'm going to torque up all the suspension bolts before moving on to re-hanging the exhaust, which will involve a small bit of welding on the Cat and secondary silencer that I'm not looking forward to. Nevertheless, its starting to feel like I'm on a downhill section. Oh - when I went to bleed the hydraulics (I can recommend the Sealey VS08 brake kit btw) I found that there is fluid leaking past the piston seal on one of the rear calipers. Could I have put the seal in backwards I wonder? Z PS/ Any opinions on my previous question about the engine tin? |
Sorry, can't help with your questions. You might search the forum or start a seperate thread.
Nevertheless I'm looking forward to seeing the replacement for the engine tin. Have you ordered the parts yet? Keep going, you have come a long way already. ;) |
Thanks once more Badluck!
I have ordered the forward 2 sections of tin and depending on the quality will probably order the rear section after that. From my nosing around at the weekend, it looks pretty tricky (/impossible) to install the ones I've ordered with the engine in situ, so I've taken the executive decision to hold off on these until I (eventually) drop the engine. Watch this space! :) Z |
Hi again folks. Welcome back to my glacial "return to service".
Many small steps forward, one back. Let's see. Stuck the ARB back on. I know that the drop links are not supposed to be black but I'll probably replace them with new when I do the suspension properly (Phase 2) so as an alternative to rusty they look OK to me: https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...949463f159.jpg The sections of GRP "tin" arrived and look like this: https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...e50630ba86.jpg Whilst they're perhaps not GS America-like, they're well made, represent excellent value for money as compared with the Porsche parts and can't rust. Better still, Roger is the nicest chap to deal with; I can't recommend him highly enough. Shame I can't fit them without dropping the engine: :( I picked up some rather nice 16mm shank 13mm head stainless steel M5 bolts and spire clips from Speedy Fasteners to secure the wheel arch liners. The parts manual says there are 12 per side but I can only find 11 (3 on the front edges, 2 where the 2 halves meet). Anyone have any ideas where the 12th is supposed to be? I stuck a couple on the oil line inspection hatch because I could. https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...057f52fcdb.jpg I thought I'd taken a picture of the result but can't find it so watch out for a future update. Whilst I waited for things to arrive I thought I'd have a go at rennovating the grubbiest bits of carpet. Here's a before/during/after in a single piece, after giving it some elbow grease and (more appropriately) some wool friendly detergent and a nail brush. I'm not that impressed to be honest but I'll keep going. https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...9ef1b4c49f.jpg Things arrived. Firstly was the replacement brake caliper seal. Again, thought I had a picture of the damaged one but it is clear to me that some idiot nicked it whilst pushing in the piston. Determined not to be an idiot twice, this time I left the piston in a plastic bag in the freezer overnight, smeared the ring in brake fluid before assembly and everything went together like a dream. Not much to see now I've bled it all again but here's a picture anyway: https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...6ece20aadf.jpg I know the disks look pants but they're stop gaps (no pun intended). Included in the next haul are some RS engine mounts that I'm quite excited about. https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...83ddddf8a5.jpg And so on to the step back. I thought I'd help the car with its self-lightening process and brush off a little more converted steel (rust) from the area in front of cylinder 6. I was horrified to see a small drip of oil starting to form on the pipe as I realised that the brush had actually punctured it. I grabbed the nearest supplies to hand and made this temporary bandage out of a strip of lead sheet and a hose clip. https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...4f642c88a9.jpg Well I suppose it's better that this happens now then when refilled with new oil. Leave's me in a bit of a dilemma though. I expected to get the car through its MOT test with the oil it has in it and then when I've located any leaks needing attention with some road miles, I'd replace gaskets/seals as required THEN do a full oil change. I can't figure out how I'm going to replace this pipe and retain any oil. Assuming the big nut releases OK (which it may not), I expect to have the crank case and oil tank attempting to flood the garage floor the second it is off. However, I'm instinctively nervous about draining oil and then re-filling the tank with it but can't come up with an alternative. Anyone have any better ideas? Z PS/ Apologies about the picture quality size. I'll see if I can do some edits. |
Frustrating day. CPS got me a pipe at top speed so I drained the oil down and got to work. The big nut was never going to shift with a spanner so I took a hacksaw to the pipe to enable me to stick a socket on it. Then my 1/2" torque wrench and some heat. Nothing. 75cm of scaffold pipe on the end of the wrench and it eventually began to move. As I suspected would happen, the crank case insert decided it was more keen to rotate than the nut but with everything on the bench at least I could clean this up nicely. I don't think it needs Loctite on the crankcase side during assembly but I'll check the manual.
It seemed a good idea to pop off the flattened pipe and clean it up a bit - while I'm there. You've seen the pictures above, just a little bit of surface rust to clean up with a wire wheel and I could re-paint. WRONG! Bit lump of rust just ahead of the hose pipe to the oil tank shifted to leave Pinhole No. 2; No.3 lay in wait on the inboard side near the P-bracket. I made a half-hearted attempt to fill the 1st one with a blob of weld but the remaining metal was paper thin and just needs replacing. Of course it's a bank holiday weekend here in Blighty so no chance of getting one before I have to head away from home/garage to work for a couple of days. So, I took the opportunity to remove the oil tank and check its condition. Every hose clip bar 2 was shot and the dip-stick line had no intention of separating. I'm getting through a lot of butane but it does the trick. I had thought that the dip stick line was metal but it's just had plastic. A bit of heat on the nut and the pipe goes all wobbly and separates. It will have to be a couple of mm shorter when it goes back on but no great shakes. After far too long interrupted only by Spa Qualifying (zzz), the tank finally submitted and came out - though not before I removed the sill cover. All in all a horrible, messy job involving lots of catch trays and oily road grime. Another hour or so was spent wire-wheeling 95% of the paint off the tank. I rather like the SS finish so may just put a coat of high temp lacquer on it rather than repainting black. One of the other builds I've been reading here had his powder coated and pressure tested; do I need to be contemplating this? With my luck, there's another pin-hole now gestating in the nether reaches of the tank waiting for me to reinstall before beginning its weep. Where do you get an oil tank pressure tested anyway? I thought I was quite close to getting back on the ground and engine running but not just yet it seems. It's a shame because I think I'll get quite a lift from driving out of the garage and back in again! :D No pictures because nobody wants to see any more of my rear wheel arches - especially me. I'll take some of the shiny oil tank before it goes back if you like. Z |
Couldn't resist cleaning up the oil tank. Looks pretty good at first:
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...56ab1858d5.jpg The outboard side looks slightly less good. I'm guessing moisture gets trapped between tank and wing: https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...eca82a9813.jpg ...but it is only when you look closely that the trouble starts: https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...174e424ba8.jpg AGGGGHHHH!!! Bla***ed pin holes. This one actually weeps a little oil when the virtually empty tank is out its side and I fear that others may do so under a small amount of pressure. Can this be effectively repaired or am I in for a whole new oil tank???? :( Z |
I am bleeding with you ZG862...but keep plugging away mate..
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Just as long as you're not bleeding as badly as my oil system, 4th!! :D
Appreciate the sentiment though. I'd hoped to get to an engine start over the Bank Holiday and it can be a little soul destroying when the tin worm rears its ugly head. As I'm trying to put some money aside for some Bilsteins, I'm contemplating picking up an old tank from ebay but concerned that if from a UK car could be little better than the one I have. There's also the little matter of it taking about 4 hours to strip it back to bare steel to find out. Nevertheless, thanks for the encouragement! Z |
Still plugging away on this one after a (ahem) bit of a hiatus while life got in the way. If uninterested in my ramblings, please can you skip to the end, where I have a question?
Q: Can anyone tell me the dimensions of the cruise control clutch microswitch (964.613.415.00)? I'm 99.9% sure it's generic and I'm loathed to pay £60 odd quid for a nice Porsche plastic bag when something just as good had be had for £6. I think I just need to know the rectangle and the lever length. Many thanks, Z PS/ I thought I should bleed the clutch whilst doing the brakes. From being "a bit spongy", it's now "foot to the floor dead as a dodo" - but with no traces of a leak to be found at the master or slave cylinder. Could this just be a great big air bubble somewhere or something much worse? What do I do next? |
Found that I already have the clutch microswitch mounting bracket and the hole centres are 17mm. Now I need to find who makes a suitable switch (proving tricky - all microswitches seem to be much smaller nowadays).
Fuel is now all drained, pump & sender back in and buttoned up. Z |
Can’t help you with the micro switch but congratulations on a great thread and amazing resilience to keep going for so long.
I’m plucking up courage to remove the HP immobilizer from my C2 as I’m sure it’s only a matter of time before it lets me down cheers Steve |
Thanks Steve.
The 1st part of the immobiliser removal actually looks reasonably straightforward (famous last words); Aside from the dongle connection, there are 4 identical black wires that are taped to the factory loom up to the ignition barrel connector. 2 go to the yellow wire that is the control wire for the starter solenoid, which has been cut, and of the other 2, one taps into the main red permanent live and one to the black that heads off to the ignition coils on key position 1. My initial guess is that these supply power to the immobiliser control unit, which if presented with an acceptable key reconnects the starter solenoid wire (and others). I don't plan to dick with any of these (electronic engineering term) until I've accounted for all the wires that emerge from the CU. Hope this is useful when you get to yours.... Z PS/ Clutch bleed is a nightmare. More air in the line than at a balloon festival. Pedal still dead. Another bottle of dot 4 on the way. |
Thanks. Will let you know how I get on
Steve |
HP immobilizer
Exactly as you said. If you trace the wires from the unit under the seat you find all the connections and can put it back to how was originally. Nothing too difficult just have to work methodically
HTH Steve |
1. Finally got the clutch bled. Just needed a whole load of fluid in the power bleeder and finally all the air came out.
2. I'm having fun with sourcing the cruise control clutch microswitch. Although the switch body is marked Hartmann, it's not the PTR Hartman GmbH company that comes up on internet searches. They very kindly (and promptly) put me on to Hartmann-Exact (a division of Swoboda) who did indeed make the original switch - which (of course!) is now discontinued. They in turn (super rapidly) put me on to a company called Switchit who apparently make something compatible. Hopefully they'll come back to me with some good news. Failing that, anyone here removed their CC but left the redundant switch in? I can offer a weight-saving opportunity... 3. With the help of a local race prep outfit, I located a proper TiG welder chap! I found him in his workshop, fabricating a dry sump conversion for an extensively modified muscle car. The car wasn't my thing, but his welding looked superb and he wasn't put off by the split in my silencer. Hopefully I can upload a picture of the completed repair shortly. I know we all like pictures. Watch this space. 4. Did I mention I have a 996? Long story, but the relevant bit involves me wanting to upgrade the dash panel to the later one with a glovebox. Alas the only one I could find was in an odd shade of brown that somewhat clashed with the Metropol blue found in my car. I stumbled across an outfit called Northants Leathers who make re-dying kits. I was sceptical but thought I'd try it out and it turns out the products are very good indeed. So... I thought whilst I was waiting for the exhaust, I'd start addressing the ropey handbrake and seat bolsters, so I've sent a couple of parts off for colour matching. They'll also take a look at the suitability of the leatherette for use with their dyes. The matching process is expensive in comparison with the products, but hopefully I'll be able to share the knowledge with anyone else who has Silk Grey + Standard Grey interior. Again, pictures will follow when there's something to see. I'm itching to stick the key in the ignition and turn over the engine and might not be able to wait until the exhaust is on. There's no fuel other than what may have been between the fuel pump and filter so I'm not going to be making any noise. DME relay out, right? Anything else I need to consider? Z |
Nearly there. New battery arrived today and we have signs of life; the interior lights all came on and the wipers went ballistic briefly.. Headlights and tail lights come on and the switch illumination is making an effort. However, disturbing the immobiliser box may have dealt it a mortal wound. I seem to recall a bleep when the dongle is inserted.. I get none & and no cranking of the engine.
DME relay is pulled deliberately but I didn't think that this would prevent the starter from turning the engine over, so it looks like I'll need to break out the wiring diagrams and multi+meter tomorrow.... Z |
The HP immobiliser is actually a doddle to remove. For obvious reasons I won't post the details of where and how many cuts there are but I replaced all of them with crimped bullet connectors since I'd imagine that the replacement will want to immobilise at the same points.
So, moment of truth: Battery terminals connected. DME relay still out. Quick check on the dipstick. Dip the clutch. Key in. Turn... Chugga, chugga, chugga, chugga. The Porsche is (nearly) alive! |
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...04dd1aeeca.jpg
It seems that the last 2% takes 98% of the time. Yet, here we are with a happily idling engine. The DME wasn't dead (and thanks again for the kind offer of a loan to test with @willmip) and nor were either of my DME relays. If anyone can remember way back when this odyssey started, I thought I had mysterious electronic problems and smeared a small amount of copaslip on some of the terminals in an act of mindless vandalism. Don't do this, it's a stupid idea. There is such stuff as conductivity paste, but as long as the connectors are not worn out from repeated action then just make sure it is dry. Once I knew that the fuel pump was good, the next logical test is to verify power at the DME - which is as simple as putting a volt meter between pin 12 of the DME connector and earth (of which there are lots of choices under the left hand seat). This should be permanently live. It was. Next, pin 37 should be tested, with the key in position 2. Now this is switched by the DME relay, which is why there is so much focus on this in all the "no start" advice out there. For anyone who is interested, the +ve current path is: Batt+ - G25 - E35 - E31 - R41/3 - R41/5 - E34 - E44 - F14 - T15/3 - DME Term 1 - DME/37 As I said, I found that the DME wasn't switching so I also traced the current path for this: Term 15 Bus - K14 - Central Locking Plug 1/6 - CL Plug 1/4 - F12 - E42 - E32 - R41/1 I had voltage all the way up to F12 but not at R41/1, so I cleaned everything, disconnected the battery and did a continuity test. All good, connect battery, 12V at R41/1. Plugged in a DME relay and turned the key to see if I could hear it click. Yep. Crank the engine because why not? Cough, cough, WHOOOM! Blimey. Opened the garage door, fired up the unwilling engine, which responded with a load of smoke as the various bits of grease used assembling the exhaust (a small amount of which ended up on the inside) burnt off, and settled into an unhealthy 2500-3000rpm idle. This turned out to be my not seating the throttle cable correctly at the engine bracket. Best way I found (eventually) was to withdraw the cable from the rubber grommet, then install the latter in the bracket and push the cable sleeve back in, which allowed the throttle to close against the idle stop. With the engine running, I could finally extend the spoiler and change the curtain. @Babalouie 's thread gave an excellent set of instructions for fitting this, none of which worked for me. I removed the top element (4 allen bolts) and then fitted the top edge with the aid of washing up liquid (remnants of which are visible in the picture), a hot air gun, a steel straight edge, towel and mallet. Maybe my new curtain had hardened over the years in its bag on top of the car. With the spoiler bolted back in, the lower edge snapped in as per instructions. Time to come down off the axle stands. Fiddly in the confines of the garage but I got it up there so it was always coming down back on to its wheels. Nothing for it but to refit the seats, get in and reverse it out of the garage. A 5 minute photo shoot later and I inched it back into place in the garage, the first drive in 10+ years being entirely uneventful. No signs of fluid leaks but I do have ABS and brake pad warning lights on. The latter I know about as I hadn't bothered connecting the sensors when I did the pads. I've just picked up some front discs as I don't think the ones I have will make it through an MoT test, so I'll do the sensors with the discs and check the ABS sensors at the same time. It's possible that they're simply not connected. After that, I don't really have any excuses why I shouldn't contact Cotswold Porsche and arrange an MoT. Or should I do an oil change first? What do you think? Z PS/ Also, what have I forgotten? |
Originally Posted by ZG862
(Post 18995464)
The HP immobiliser is actually a doddle to remove. For obvious reasons I won't post the details of where and how many cuts there are but I replaced all of them with crimped bullet connectors since I'd imagine that the replacement will want to immobilise at the same points.
So, moment of truth: Battery terminals connected. DME relay still out. Quick check on the dipstick. Dip the clutch. Key in. Turn... Chugga, chugga, chugga, chugga. The Porsche is (nearly) alive! |
Originally Posted by misteralz
(Post 19044006)
Fancy PMing me the details? I'd like to get rid of mine as it feels like a weak link. That, and it's annoying AF.
As far as I can tell, the HP system is actually a very good one (with more circuit cuts than any modern replacement I have yet encountered) but the physical connection of the encryption key dongle is the weak link. Once the connector wires wear, it's increasingly difficult to get it to disarm. If I had the skills to splice in a secure radio transmitter then I'd be tempted to retain it - but I don't so I'm looking for a decent replacement. Z |
Booked in for an MoT test tomorrow, so thought I'd sort out the remaining gremlins:
1. Non working horn: Check. Spade receptacle needed a pinch with the pliers. 2. Non working right side repeater light: Uh oh. Well after about 3 hours, I now know what the problem is. A small nick on the outer of the 2 wire loom (177) behind the wheel well cover is actually a complete break in the wire. Has anyone tried accessing these? World's most frustrating job. I now have it out, but not before taking the off side front wheel off, removing the arch liner, removing the filler panel to the central electric box, removing the luggage compartment lid, straps retaining the oil hard lines at the back of the wheel arch, [the bonnet release catch, carpet panel, informer control box, plastic duct, aluminium duct (which tore, irreparably) - all of which were an unnecessary red herring since the cable remains behind the firewall.] The loom then jammed on the grommets (I can't be sure if they're intended to come out from the outside or inside) but the usual mix of copious swearing, patience and a small screwdriver eventually did the trick. I looked up the price of a replacement wire and the first one came up at about 90 quid (!!!!), so it looks like I'm repairing this one. I have a suspicion that this one has been replaced incorrectly in the past as the route seems both tortuous and too tight to comfortably plug into the main loom. This may be how it got the cut. I'll try and take some snaps as I refit this monster to save others from hell. An old-fashioned wooden screwdriver handle jammed between the oil hard line helps push them apart enough to at least be able to see the hole the cable is supposed to go through. Once this is done, I just need to replace the front orange reflector with a clear one then we'll see what the MoT inspector thinks. Fingers crossed. Z PS/ Then I have to deal with the broken footwell air duct. Grrr. |
Nearly.
Managed to scrape a fail on some pretty trivial things:
It was great driving back from the test though - so, so different to the 996. As you can imagine, I took it VERY gently on the way there in case I'd missed something. Examiner was pretty impressed with the work overall - notwithstanding the "fail" result, that is. I may have to change the thread title to "Redemption" soon. Z https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...4a26f85103.jpg |
Not sure if I can claim redemption just yet: today was my appointment for MoT retest and the result was a story of 2 halves. Thanks to a new washer pump, a mid-tread nail puncture repair, much faffing with the brake light circuit (poor bulb connection), replacement of the horn connector, re-aiming (mid test) of the headlights and some work on the handbrake, the car HAS PASSED.
(Just taking a moment for the enormity of that to sink in.) It's a very thorough check, apparently, the MoT test. Lots of poking around, shining lights on everything critical to safe road usage, measurement of emissions etc etc. Testers take their role very seriously. I was happy enough on the way back to turn on the soon to be replaced Blaupunkt Symphony and enjoy my new speakers, just before "clunk" - and a total loss of drive. Uh-oh. Turns out that it's up to you, the so-called home mechanic, to check that you torqued the driveshafts on BOTH sides of the car. The side that was merely finger tightened half a dozen years ago let go. Mrs Z drove out with a couple of axle stands and I re-fitted the errant shaft in a lay-by, before continuing my journey home, embarrassed. Got an MoT test certificate now though, even if I am an incurable twit. I'm also a proper 964 owner once more. |
Epic! I imagine it might take ou a while to get used to the idea that its not just a project any more! Once you get some more seat time it will be great to hear if it drives as you remembered.
Pete |
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