Chris in WNC

First, thanks so much for all the great information and advice from my previous post.

I just got back from driving a 1990 C2 with 102K on the odometer. My first impression is that the car felt more "up to date" in terms of performance and handling than I would have thought. I still haven't driven a 3.2 but have an idea of how the driving experience will differ. Mechanically, the car drove extremely well. The owner wasn't there - his wife was who has never driven the car - but it seems they have had it about 6 years and have not had to do anything except oil changes. They haven't driven it much - I would guess less that 8K in that time but it could be a lot less - and I spoke to the Porsche mechanic at the shop that has serviced it and he said he has never noticed any issues mechanically with the car though they haven't spent much time with it. I was very impressed with the power of the car and how it pulled through the gears. Brakes, etc. worked well. No unusual noises, shakes, etc. All in all, very enjoyable to drive.

Now some concerns/things I noticed. The a/c didn't blow cold. Called the owner while driving the car and he said it needed to be charged. He said this seemed to be a common issue with these cars. He said it blew cold last year but that he just doesn't drive it much and always with the top down. The collapsible top seemed to be in good shape - the owner has a second top also - and there was some wind noise but nothing too bad. Someone asked if it had to be a targa that I am looking for and it does. I love convertibles and drove my Boxster with the top down 90% of the time as long as the temperature was above 32F - have to love heated seats! I don't want a 964 cab as I don't think convertibles look right unless the top "disappears" - I may look at 1999 convertibles but that is not my first choice. Back to the a/c - any thoughts about whether it just needs a charge or could there be bigger issues with the compressor/dryer/etc.?

The interior of the car appears to be in great shape. The outside is the tricky part. The car is an unusual color - the owner said it is called red velvet - and it seems the paint has faded a good bit judging from the color under the front hood. And it is not one of our 'preferred' colors. In terms of chips, dings, etc. they seem commensurate with the mileage and age of the car. Has anyone ever had a car repainted a different color? Any idea on the cost of this?

The back taillight lens covers and middle 'Porsche' plastic cover are pretty cracked/faded/sundried and the owner acknowledges that he will negotiate price on this issue as well as a driver door lock issue.

He is asking just shy of $18K which seems to be a bit on the high side though I could be off base here. I am also looking at a 1990 C4 with 66K and am told the owners accepted an offer of $18.9 though there is a small oil leak of undetermined origin.

Driving the car was a visceral experience - much rawer than my Boxster - but still refined enough that I could see driving a 964 daily.

I don't believe the owner has much in the way of service/maintenance records - should this be a HUGE flag? Will a PPI catch most things that could present problems?

Thanks once again for reading my ramblings and thoughts on the a/c, price, etc. are greatly appreciated.

Greg964

Seems like every used car that has non-operational a/c "just needs a little gas". I would be highly suspect of this. It could be as simple as a refrigerant top-off but it could also be a bad compressor, leaking condenser, leaking evaporator etc. If it just need a little gas have the seller do this before your next visit.

Lack of service records is not a good sign; it would be nice to know that the car had regular oil changes, and the 15k mile interval major services. Was the clutch changed at some point? A new clutch on a 964 will cost $3000+ at a shop. If you buy the car and there is no proof a major maintenance was done recently (should have been done at 90k miles) plan on spending $2000 for this service.

You really don't want to repaint a Porsche in a different color, to do this properly would entail completely stripping the car down, removing glass etc to paint door jambs, engine compartment and trunk. It will cost a fortune. To do it on the cheap would kill the resale value-plus its a Porsche not a '85 Camaro.

Cracked rear lens, drivers door lock issue, no a/c, bad color, fading paint, lack of records...too many issues and a good PPI will almost certainly uncover others. I would keep looking. Look at and drive a couple of other 964s just to get a feel for them. If your heart is set on a targa it may take awhile to find a nice one, as the targas were the least popular body style.

Good luck!

Jon A.

My leaky condenser cost $2200 to replace so no A/C is highly suspect. Lack of service records usually means neglect. Although a Targa can be nice, I find my c4 coupe with the windows and sunroof open a very satisfying daily driver even though I'm coming from a Boxster. I really don't miss anything from my '84 Targa, least of all the top that didn't fold up and store well. I'd keep looking for "the one", get a quality PPI and not settle, although recently moving to ca from NC, I know how hard it is to find a good PPI in NC.

GT9111

Agree with Jon A. on the leaky condenser. If the a/c simply need to recharge coolant, why didn't the owner do it in the first place before showing his car to potential buyers. I suggest you to continue searching other cars with service records and get a PPI at a reputable Porsche garage.

Megatron-UK

Personally, I really wouldn't be too bothered about service history on a car that is 20 years old. The last 2-3 years and current condition would be more important, in my opinion, than whether someone got a Porsche stamp two decades ago.

If the colour isn't to your liking, then hold out - otherwise you could be kicking yourself when the 'perfect' one comes along!

Chris in WNC

Thanks for the input. I will keep looking and see what else is out there. Right now, there is a 1990 C4 with 66K that is getting a PPI done at a dealer. Supposedly it had the clutch replaced bythe first owner. Current owners are "not typical Porsche owners" according to the person who is representing the owners. He says they changed the oil and installed a battery maintainer since they didn't drive it much - 800 miles in the last two years. Pictures show the car to look great but I am hesitant/reluctant to buy a car without actually seeing and driving it but I live in the middle of nowhere and there aren't a whole lot of Porsches for sale here. We'll see what the PPI shows.

tbennett017

FWIW, the servo motors under the windshield wipers move air flaps within the ducts, causing cold/hot conditions too. Unfortunately some of those motors are becoming very hard to get... so when you run into this, be sure to check the operation of those servos too. This can be done by opening the front hood, and removing the plastic cover along the front of the firewall. You will see a series of small black boxes, connected to levers and pushrods. With the car running, have a helper move the heat from full cold to full hot. You should see two servos move their arms from the outboard to the inboard position as the heat is set to high.

The A/C might surely need repair, but these are also an issue to watch out for.

Bearclaw

How many miles have they put on it in the 6 years? Seems very odd that they would not have ANY service records from at least the period they owned it. These are good cars, but stuff happens to any of them in 6 years. It's rare that someone doesn't keep any receipts. I would hope it's not because they neglected to address things as they came up. Hopefully the mechanic has records. Be that as it may, I've bought cars with no service history and had it work out okay. And, I bought my Porsche without a PPI, just based on the comprehensive service history it had. In my mind, you have pretty goods odds with a good service or a PPI - preferably both, but at least one. A good inspection should tell you most of what you need to know.

Every A/C that doesn't work "just needs a charge", and they all blew cold "last year" The question is, why?
At this age, at the very least seals have started to go, which may cause a slow leak - so you have effective A/C for a little while after a charge, and then you don't. Just as likely though, it's one of the major components and it won't hold a charge at all. Then you're looking at north of $1K if you want it to work. You really don't know until you do a dye test. If it's important to you, negotiate with the owner.

The paint thing is a bummer. There's no way you can really help that. It's just a matter of whether you can live with it. IMO, don't even think about a color change. You can't really do it "right". And it would cost you a fortune, to boot.

His price might be realistic if it were really nice and everything worked correctly. Unless he takes some spin off the ball, I'd say keep looking.

Doug&Julie

Well there you go, you can't buy that. We're about to buy a Red Velvet Metallic C4 and you don't want to be like us!

tbennett017

Awesome color.

Bearclaw

I didn't even know there was such a color. It is luscious.

Richard Curtis

I agree... beautiful color! Also agree with comments above, but the car's problems (minus the paint issue) might be simple repairs, and very strong bargaining chips/points for you on price. If, for example, the seller can't confirm a clutch job, knock $5,000 off the price. You then pay $2,000-$3,000 to get it replaced and you're way ahead. Maybe a detail shop could advise on whether the paint is "recoverable" by polishing. My 964 had lost some of it's a/c cooling ability (was okay when I bought it six years ago), and a simple recharge fixed that. Been okay for two years now. Ditto for my Ranger of 15 years; more R134A fixed it. Taillight lenses can be bought from recyclers (new ones are hard to find and have already turned pink anyhow) for <$100. Door lock problems CAN be minor. Still strongly suggest a PPI on any potential purchase. There are at least a few independent foreign car shops in Western N.C.

Greg964

There is a 91 C4 targa 5 speed manual for sale on pca.org, black w/tan interior, 128k miles but top end rebuild and clutch at 80k miles, 17" cup wheels. Car is in Dayton OH, asking $17k. Ad is from late May. PM me for contact info if interested.

edit: there are 2 other "local" 964 targas on pca.org; 1 in Arlington, VA and another in Anderson, SC (this one looks VERY nice)

Doug&Julie

FYI I think that one just sold on eBay. I can't find the Autotrader on it anymore.

DaveK

Be aware that the faded / cracked tail lights is quite an expensive thing to remedy - replacements are not cheap.

That red colour doesn't look too different from the colour of my turbo - perhaps Porsche colours just go in cycles and they just change the names!