sergiDA

I am in search of a little advise.

I have in my plan an upgrade to RS sway bars.

I am currently using H&R reds dampers and springs, and and i am in search of a faster turn in.

I got the advise from Thomas a few months back to only get the 18 mm rear bars my car would already change a lot and get a much better turn in.

I am about to purchase the bars and want to get the opinion from you once again on what way I should follow.

Thanks
setrgi

joey bagadonuts

If you want to improve turn in, I would first suggest you consider changes to your driving technique. The 964 requires trail braking to enter a corner quickly--less for a fast sweeper and more for tight, slow turns. Also, if you tend to turn in slightly early and are still trying to make the turn after the apex, the car will scrub wide as you accelerate.

If you set up your car to turn in fast, keep in mind that such changes might also create oversteer when you exit. The loss of rear traction wil produce slower lap times, so consider all phases of the corner--entrance, mid-corner and exit--before making changes and optimize geometry for exits.

The RS bar is nice since it will provide options but don't overlook driving technique when trying to improve lap times. More than anything, trail braking and perfect lines will help you get the most out of your 964.

J richard

It used to be the factory rs bars were the only game in town, that's all I've used but they aren't cheap, the H&R adjustables look very nice have the same adjustability for half the price, a nice alternative..

Do you already have the factory M030 bars?

ThomasC2

I agree wiht Joey, and that's why I recommended the RS-bar in the rear. It's a bit softer than stock which gives you more traction out of the corner. Especially if you don't have a LSD. Before I got the LSD I had the rear bar set in the softest position and it made a huge difference for traction compared with the stock bar.

Thomas

sergiDA

Thanks to the 3 of you for the advice.

I will attend one more track day, this saturday 15th in Barcelona GP track.... and will finally decide what to do in this area, but the truth is that I really feel that turn in is slow when compared to 2 Porsches that I have track tested, one 993's c2 and one 996 gt3.. could this be also beacuse my car's suspension is not stiff enough?

Thanks

joey bagadonuts

Turn in or transitions? In transitions, soft shocks will cause your car to float. If you are going through esses, where you are changing directions without braking, you will not be able to do so as quickly as a car with stiffer shocks.

As for turn in, stiffer shocks will also speed up weight transfer. Inputs will be felt immediately, however, you will need to trail brake to maximize front-end grip. Simply lifting off the throttle and turning is not as effective as trail braking.

Again, when detemining suspension adjustments, you will want to prioritize changes based on those which will yield the most improvement. For cornering, you will want the handling to work best as you exit the corner. Specifically, you will want the best handling possible as your car exits on to the most important (longest) straight of the track you're on.

sergiDA

Now that you are mentioning it i think that on transitions this is where i feel the most the slow reaction,s ..by the way what means "trail braking", is this to brake and enter the corner a little sideways like in slow corners?


I will look at stiffing the suspension a litlle bit, I am carrying H&R Red dampers and they can be sliglty teaked..


thanks again Joey.

joey bagadonuts

The link, below, is from a very good book which describes performance driving technique in detail: "Going Faster!" by Carl Lopez

Braking and Entering

Trail braking is not sliding or going sideways into a corner. As you approach a corner, you will do most of your braking in a straight line. To maximize corner entry speeds, however, you should continue to apply light brake pressure after turn in. For fast sweepers, the amount will be less; in sharp, slow turns, you may be braking almost to the apex. The amount depends on the corner and you car's handling characteristics.

The goal is to keep weight on your front tires which will increase grip and maximize entry speeds. Once you transition to the throttle, the car's weight transfer to the rear tires and you will lose front-end grip. Doing all of your braking in a straight line is certainly the safest way to enter a corner but it's not the fastest.

Cupcar#12

when trail braking remember to roll on the throttle (not jump on it) as you make the transition from braking to power to help even out the weight transfer.

also you don't mention tires in your post - the 964 IMHO is sensitive to both size and type of tires. for instance i am running a 225mm front on an 8" wheel and a 265mm on a 9" in the rear. this is for an 18" fittament - in 17's you have a smaller choice or a much larger one (235/275mm) but i am really happy with the 225/265 combo.

my car is basically an RS though with rolled fenders and these may not fit with out some work on your car depending on what it is.
Joey is right on.

i am also assuming you have a C2 and not a C4 which is a different ball game but the same techniques apply.

joey is right on here...