Tobbe Bergsten

My 91 C2 convertible has started to develop a creaky noise in the steering along with jerky steering wheel movement. I don't think it's the power steering pump, since the steering is a lot more heavy if I try to turn the wheel with the engine turned off.

Furthermore, it's kind of intermittent: it'll be creaky and jerky for a couple of days and then it'll slowly go back to close to normal.

Ideas, anyone?

Thanks in advance

/Tobbe B <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

Randall G.

Hey Tobbe,

Check the gaiters (rubber bellows) between the tie-rod and the steering rack. If they're split open, water (e.g., when it rains) can get on the shaft and cause binding on the seals. You'll feel this as jerkiness when you turn the wheel, along with hearing some creaking sounds.

When the shaft dries up (e.g., the rain stops), the noise goes away and your steering returns to normal.

Best of luck!

Tobbe Bergsten

Randall;

You're on to something there! Come to think of it, I washed the car back on Sunday and it was quite apparent Monday. Today, Wednesday, it's solwy subsiding back towards normal again. I'll check the gaiters and let you know what I come up with.

Thanks!

DaveK

Hi,
A word of warning about this. My car is at the garage at the moment to have a few bodywork bits done, and while it was there I asked for the aligment to be done. Before starting this, they check that nothing is worn out.

Unfortunately, my gaiters have spilt - and as a result, one of the oil seals has blown. Porsche don't sell oil seals apparently.... so it's new steering rack time. £500 + fitting + vat if they can get it from the people who make them for Porsche (ZF I think they were) which they usually can, or £900 + fitting + vat if it comes from Porsche. Ouch!

They also found a couple of worn bushes but Porsche don't sell rubber bushes either... so my £150 alignment is going to cost 10 times that because I need 2 rubber bushes and an oil seal.

All I can say is the handling better be pretty fantastic at the end of this!

Dave
90 C4

Rob W.

I issues with adverse wear on my front tyres, and a bit of a 'wander' at speed. This was attributed to worn wishbone bushes that were replaced, followed by a full four-wheel alignment as a matter of course. I got a call from the garage to say that the wishbones/alignment now being correctly set-up had highlighted another problem, which offered exactly the symptoms you are having. It felt as if the steering was 'notchy' especially on roundabouts and slow-speed manouvering, and would not center itself properly. It turns out that the steering rack gaitors had split, allowing water ingress which causes corrosion in the rack.


Remedy........new steering rack. Result.....go-kart!

Rob W.

Dave,

It depends on your preference I suppose, but I got a reconditioned rack for £295+VAT from Design911 and it was £185+VAT for JZ machtech to fit. Apparently, the main maintenance issue is with the gaiters, therefore provided thay are kept tip-top, a recon should last just as long as a new one.

RobW

Rob W.

I issues with adverse wear on my front tyres, and a bit of a 'wander' at speed. This was attributed to worn wishbone bushes that were replaced, followed by a full four-wheel alignment as a matter of course. I got a call from the garage to say that the wishbones/alignment now being correctly set-up had highlighted another problem, which offered exactly the symptoms you are having. It felt as if the steering was 'notchy' especially on roundabouts and slow-speed manouvering, and would not center itself properly. It turns out that the steering rack gaitors had split, allowing water ingress which causes corrosion in the rack.


Remedy........new steering rack. Result.....go-kart!

Randall G.

Hey Dave,

Not sure if you're in a position to look elsewhere, with your car currently in the shop, but .... both Performance Products and Vertex sell rebuilt steering racks at a (relatively speaking) reasonable price--$300 (PP) or $389 (Vertex). To be honest, not certain what their rebuild entails, but the price is certainly attractive--even after paying for shipping to the U.K.

When I found my steering rack gaiters split, I agonized over whether I should replace the rack, or just replace the gaiters and flush--hoping that the rack wasn't permanently damaged. I took a chance, and the original rack has been fine since (some 27k miles, four years ago). Also, at 114k miles, I'm fortunate that I still don't have leaking seals.

There, now I've done it ... my seals will surely start leaking tomorrow.

Edit: Oops .... just noticed that RobW has already listed a more reasonably priced rack, sold in your own country.

DaveK

Hi,
I was told I could get a cheaper rack by the mechanic - although I got the impression that it was more of a pattern part than a rebuilt rack. He didn't really recommend it though - although he said they fit OK, I was told that they have seen some problems with these racks when they've been fitted in the past and that they don't seem to last all that long.
Unfortunately, it's too late to change now - the rack has been ordered.

All I can say is that the car is down to it's last chance. Much as I like my 964, I haven't wanted a 911 all my life so it's not really a dream come true. Given the cost of it over the last 6 months I've lost patience. One more failure in the next few months and I will sell it - there comes a point where the constant drain on my finances begins to wear out the fun of driving it, especially when I'm forced to use my bike while the car is in the garage and I remember how much more fun that is.

Dave
90 C4... but only if it behaves itself

Randall G.

I feel for you Dave. Here are some recent threads in this vein. If it makes you feel any better, the one immediately below was initiated by a 993 owner:

<a href="http://forums.rennlist.com/forums/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=3&t=003023" target="_blank">The Unthinkable</a>

<a href="http://forums.rennlist.com/cgi-bin/rennforums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=28&t=000095&p=" target="_blank">Most Reliable World Class Sportscar?</a>

Any thoughts on what you might replace the 964 with, if you were to sell?

DaveK

Hi,
Interesting thread - particularly the first one because I have wondered whether I'd have had less problems if I'd gone for a 993. Possibly not from some of the comments there!

What would I buy instead if I sold it? That's the problem - there aren't any new cars I want. I've always liked NSXs - but I'd be looking at a similar age to the 911 so could have similar maintenance issues.
Used to own a Supra TT - very quick, fun and reliable. Used to love the styling but now don't, but they have plummeted in price and are an easy way to go very quick in a fairly reliably car (until the turbos go bang).
Somebody who lives close to me has recently traded a TVR in for a Viper. Now I think Vipers are absolutely gorgeous - and quick. Only catch is that they are left hand drive, and probably cost too much anyway.
I think I just have to hope the 964 behaves itself. If not, I'll probably sell it and go without a car for a while. I bought it in September and this is the first time I've had a car day to day - for the past 16 years I've used bikes all the time. Perhaps I'll come to the conclusion that was the best way.

Dave
90 C4

911 2

how do you know your seals have split i the rack are they found behibd the gaitors

Slappy

Am I the only one that waits in atticipation for the changing of Dave's avatar ?

Always nice stuff ... just on the edge.

MARC A. 964 C4

Hey Tobby, had the same symptoms, went to the Porsche Garage near by and sure enough it turned out to be leaking seals that had hardened and split in the Steering Rack that were only evident at mid range RPM’S and not when standing still or ticking over at idle. Turned out to be one of the mega repairs that I made mention to a few weeks ago... A reconditioned, 12 mo. guaranteed ZF/Porsche Steering Rack and misc., pieces came to, €1400,00* plus 6 hours Porsche installation forfeit. Several weeks later the power steering pump was leaking and to replace a then also, hardened and split, €3,00* seal, resulted in having to dismantle and lower the engine for access to the pump, yes... Another €500,00* plus Porsche installation forfeit... Yeah, lots of Euros, but at least I’m reassured when driving on the Autobahn, or Autostrada at 125 mph plus, that all is cool up front...I’d hate to have problems then and in the middle of no where...
Hope everything works out for you,
Marc...

Pls. note:* repairs include 19.60% TVA (tax)

911 2

ok my gaitors are leaking at idle how do i check if it is the seals or split gaitor if the gaitor ois split how do i check if the seals are split where exactly are these seals