Eric-17

Dang you guys! I've been waiting and saving for quite a while hoping to replace my BMW 325I with a 911. After much research and thought, my heart has settled on the 964...Threads like this aren't helping though.

Loving German cars but hating depreciation has meant I have always bought used and have had great luck with my BMW's... Driven daily, doing all maintenance myself including things like brakes and rotors (this weekend) but never anything other than 'maintenance' items. My Bimmers have been rock solid...

Where are the declarations of 'most well-cared for 964's are very reliable'? My impression has been that aside from the normal wear and tear, these puppy's are very reliable...???

As to the Cobra SVT... More power to ya! I personally find them garish and to 'highschool jockish', but that's me. Also, growing up with a father who was a Tool and Die Maker in the US auto industry and his concerns, I am still very wary of their quality.

Weissach

These car are very reliable. Prices have remained about the same for the past five years. So unlike BMWs(wich keep going down in price as the years pass), prices stable out on Porsches.

Only a fool would compare these cars to a Mustang. All they are doing is comparing numbers on a piece of paper, instead of the driving experience...

ian c - u.k

sp error ................ marquee .

i think anybody looking to buy a certain car should seriously consider avoiding internet forums !!!

they are used/run by enthusiasts , and as such , mosts posts are about ....

1 : driving , which will either end nicely , or in most cases the driver has got used to the car , or standard parts are worn ................ hence the need to spend money !!

2 : in the quest to further there knowledge of the car they love , they ask questions about how things work . sooner or later the talk comes to an upgrade .................... hence the neeed to spend money !!

3 : known faults on the car , and how to avoid ................... hence the need to spend money !!

4 : as enthusiast , they like to keep the car pristine , and they post on the work they have just done on the car , and ............. how much it costs !!

just take a look at the posts on page 1 of this forum ........
it's enough to put anybody off !!!

Kahdmus

Ian, interesting ponits, however you state both the good AND the bad here. Seriously I have to differ and suggest that you WILL get a well balanced insight into Porsche ownership on the Rennlist boards (or others for that matter). If the 'enthusiasts' here on Rennlist were permanently wearing rose colored glasses then you'd never see anyone gripe at all.....and that can't be so! And if all that was contained was negative complaining then I doubt it would be the compelling forum that it is and no one would visit!

The bottom line is that these cars ARE expensive to maintain (no avoiding that I'm afraid) however they are also.........'worth it!'

Cheers,

ian c - u.k

i'm not dissing the forum , just generalising about car forums in general !!

just have a read of eric's post at the top of this page !!!!

Eric-17

Well said... Er... Written. I agree about most being 'enthusiasts' on the boards... So am I. I have no qualms about paying for needed parts to keep things working as new... And I'm used to paying plenty for them, hence learning to do most of the work on them myself. I also get a kick out of doing things like brakes, rotors, clutch... It's so satisfying when I am able to overcome all the frustrations that pop up... I then reward myself with the money saved by buying something I want, but don't necessarily need.

Thanks for the reminder... I'm still saving!

Kahdmus

I dont misunderstand your point Ian, I just happen to disagree with it!

I realize you were not 'dissing' the forum - your point was that, in your opinion, car forums are a bad place to get balanced insight into a make/model of car if you are considering a purchase.

I also understand 'why' you think this from the canny observations outlined in your post.

maverick

Just remember these cars were $60K+ when new. They may be old but they are still $60K+ automobiles and the cost of maintainence is in keeping with their original price. New cars have warranties old cars have enthusiasts!

joey bagadonuts

I'd suggest we're talking about different animals, here. I'm not sure which BMW's you've owned, Eric, but I have a friend who was constantly getting in and out of E36 M3's without much depreciation, too--high teens to low 20's for one with decent miles seemed to be a safe bet come resale time.

But let's think about that. High teens? How much lower could they go?

And let's face it, there's just a bigger market for bimmers. The ample back seat and luggage compartment are necessities for most, so we're talking about a fairly liquid asset with broad appeal and consequently, limited downside risk (provided your purchase price was at or below market).

The p-car is a far more risky proposition. It is a true luxury item with limited practicality and appeal. Selling it at a good price will take some time and when times are tough, as they are these days, the depreciation can be significant.

In the end, my buddy bought a '74 Carrera and we'll be headed to Road America tomorrow for a two-day drivers ed with the Chicago PCA Region. While his wife refuses to ride in it and his little girls are actually scared of the beast, he's thrilled to have finally realized his dream of owning a 911. He'll probably end up buying a third car to weather these Midwest winters and spend more money in the process, but to him the extra expense will be worth it.

Feel free to stop by this weekend to see what all the hoopla is all about firsthand and of course, I'd be glad to take you for a test drive in car #964. And before I forget, thanks for the earlier compliment on my choice of accessories--it's much appreciated.

Doug H

I now a few people with new 745s and those things are just an absolute disaster. But what's new, they have always been a disaster. One guy who is in the middle of a lemmon type of lawsuit just had his engine replaced because it grenaded the DAY BEFORE argument on motions against BMW NA. Turns out that this is a pretty common occurrence and after months of fighting they are finally offering him a new 04 745 for his POS 03 745. The X5 I had can only be described as a lemmon. About 1/2 the folks I know who bought new M3s had engine issues and, one must admit that the BMWs of the 80s and 90s weren't much better overall. The maintenance cost of the Bimmers may not be as much item by item, but they got Porsche beat on frequency it would seem.

Ruairidh

Nicely put and so true!

Eric-17

Thanks for the invite Joey, I just may stop by... Only 20 minutes away...

When I mentioned good luck with my Bimmers, I meant relialbility. Even buying used, the depreciation gremlin has reared his ugly head... Just didn's smile quite as broadly as he does when buying new.

Doug:

I have only bought and driven 3 and 5 series Bimmers with their venerable 2.3 and 2.5l sixes. Anyone who knows Bimmers would agree that there have been fairly consistent reliablility issues with their eight and twelve cylinder motors... Hence my refusal to buy my wife the 7 series she wanted a few years ago. My cars have been driven spiritedly and have never left me stranded or dealing with anything other than routine replacement/maintenance. For instance, the '84 323I I drove for years, was sold by me with 235,000 miles on the original motor and tranny to a fellow at work. He beat around in it for a short time and then sold it to a friend of his son. It's still out there looking fairly sharp with over 250,000 miles... Hardly a lemon. I have had similiar experiences with an old Merc 240D and other Bimmers. Only thing I've owned that has matched them was our old (and sorely missed) FJ62 Toyota Landcruiser... Oh well. As with all things: Never buy a newly introduced model, and do lot's of research before buying. It should have suprised no-one that the X5 and 7-series were trouble prone... It's a shame they were sold as they are to begin with...

Have a great weekend!

bikeaddict

Hey, you want reliable? Volvo 240, baby with "My other car ia a Porsche" bumper sticker. The B230F engine is indestructible.

500

Some interesting comments about Porsche quality have been made throughout this forum. This link might provide some food for thought:

Link!

I think Porsche, even today, provide an excellent quality product.

Thanks,

Allan