Front End Rebuild Questions
01-08-2018, 07:32 PM
#1
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Front End Rebuild Questions
My Targa is finally in to have the new Bilstein B6 and H&R Sport Springs installed this week and I asked my tech to take a look at everything else while he’s in there.
During the inspection he found the steering rack is dripping (mildly) so that is going to get replaced. He noted that my strut mounts are in very good shape but the bearings have a small amount of grease seepage. I was on the fence on this but decided to go ahead and change them and keep the old parts as backup or maybe sell later.
Tie Rods are still perfect (surprisingly) and the boots are still in very good shape so they are staying.
I guess my question to the 964 brain trust is should I be changing out any other minor parts/pieces to get the front end up to snuff for another 30 years of canyon driving?
I don’t want to get carried away with upgrades but if there are bushings that could easily be replaced with everything apart I would love to know as I think that will help improve things and insure the front won’t need to come apart again.
During the inspection he found the steering rack is dripping (mildly) so that is going to get replaced. He noted that my strut mounts are in very good shape but the bearings have a small amount of grease seepage. I was on the fence on this but decided to go ahead and change them and keep the old parts as backup or maybe sell later.
Tie Rods are still perfect (surprisingly) and the boots are still in very good shape so they are staying.
I guess my question to the 964 brain trust is should I be changing out any other minor parts/pieces to get the front end up to snuff for another 30 years of canyon driving?
I don’t want to get carried away with upgrades but if there are bushings that could easily be replaced with everything apart I would love to know as I think that will help improve things and insure the front won’t need to come apart again.
01-08-2018, 07:45 PM
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01-08-2018, 07:56 PM
#4
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There wasn’t much worn in my front suspension. Struts and springs plus associated clips and the rubber gasket did it for me. Control arm bushes would be a complementary task.
In the rear suspension it was the same, albeit a fellow kiwi has worn top mounts in his and they are pricey.
01-08-2018, 07:59 PM
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Hmmm so maybe I shouldn’t change them? At $520 for the set they’re not exactly cheap but certainly less costly than taking the shocks out again if they fail.
I failed to mention that the control arm bushings were checked and all but one were in good shape. I decided to replace the bushings anyways to Elephant Racing since everything is apart anyways and not much added labor.
I failed to mention that the control arm bushings were checked and all but one were in good shape. I decided to replace the bushings anyways to Elephant Racing since everything is apart anyways and not much added labor.
01-08-2018, 08:21 PM
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01-08-2018, 09:07 PM
#8
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MB, you not doing rear suspension at the same time?
01-08-2018, 09:13 PM
#9
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Sorry yes I am definitely doing the rear suspension. New Shocks and Springs are going in the rear. My tech checked everything in the back and the top mount looks perfect and the bushings are in good shape. I don’t recall there being anything else in back that would need attention which is why I’m focused on the front.
The big thing is that the steering rack was unexpected as I wasn’t seeing any leaking (under tray caught it all) so the news came as a surprise. The steering rack bushings are also being replaced with new stock.
The big thing is that the steering rack was unexpected as I wasn’t seeing any leaking (under tray caught it all) so the news came as a surprise. The steering rack bushings are also being replaced with new stock.
01-09-2018, 03:16 AM
#10
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Get the rack rebuilt.
Rear has rubber: top of shock, bottom of shock, swing arm, and spring plate. All can wear. And do.
Rear has rubber: top of shock, bottom of shock, swing arm, and spring plate. All can wear. And do.
01-09-2018, 12:07 PM
#11
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...Tie Rods are still perfect (surprisingly) and the boots are still in very good shape so they are staying.
...should I be changing out any other minor parts/pieces to get the front end up to snuff for another 30 years of canyon driving?
I don’t want to get carried away with upgrades but if there are bushings that could easily be replaced with everything apart I would love to know as I think that will help improve things and insure the front won’t need to come apart again.
I don’t want to get carried away with upgrades but if there are bushings that could easily be replaced with everything apart I would love to know as I think that will help improve things and insure the front won’t need to come apart again.
http://www.tarett.com/items/993-964-...rtr-detail.htm
http://www.rothsport.com/Products/Ch...e.htm#bushings
01-09-2018, 12:21 PM
#12
Three Wheelin'
I agree with 911Jetta - I would definitely do the inner tie rods (while in there).
I haven't personally don it but from what I read it's among the best mods you can do to improve steering/ front suspension feel.
I haven't personally don it but from what I read it's among the best mods you can do to improve steering/ front suspension feel.
01-09-2018, 01:55 PM
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I know you said the tie rods looked good, but stock inner tie rods are soft and comfy. Now's the time to upgrade to a solid tie rod design (from Tarrett @ $360, no affiliation).
http://www.tarett.com/items/993-964-...rtr-detail.htm
Replaced with stock rack bushings, or upgraded Kevlar reinforced urethane bushing and steering rack brace?
http://www.rothsport.com/Products/Ch...e.htm#bushings
http://www.tarett.com/items/993-964-...rtr-detail.htm
Replaced with stock rack bushings, or upgraded Kevlar reinforced urethane bushing and steering rack brace?
http://www.rothsport.com/Products/Ch...e.htm#bushings
Are the Tarret Tie rods going to increase the vibration and overall harshness of the front end or is it relatively benign?
I’m going to have the outer tie rods replaced since they’re inexpensive and I guess I need to decide if its worth changing the inner tie rods with stock.
I also debated the steering rack urethane bushings but again I don’t want to get carried away in the name of handling. I guess I should have mentioned this in my original post too.
I guess I need to decide on the inner tie rods....
01-09-2018, 02:28 PM
#14
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I hear your concerns about comfort regarding the solid inner tie rods. No experience here, but it's on my future upgarde list. Would also like to hear more from people who've made the upgrade.
Regarding the steering rack bushing upgrade/brace. I did that months ago and only notices a subtle difference in feel and with no additional noise or harshness. Just feels slightly heavier and more direct. Very subtle.
Regarding the steering rack bushing upgrade/brace. I did that months ago and only notices a subtle difference in feel and with no additional noise or harshness. Just feels slightly heavier and more direct. Very subtle.
01-09-2018, 02:54 PM
#15
Three Wheelin'
Edit in response to above:
Very little additional vibration from either the poly steering rack mounts or from solid inner tie rods. Solid inners have been a common g-body upgrade since the dawn of time. As 911Jetta says, just a more direct steering feel. Don't replace the outer tie rods just because they're old. That approach will get you into trouble quick!
How much of your money would you like us to spend?
There are lots of options and lots of threads on them.
- A leaking steering rack isn't uncommon and a seal-only rebuild will fix it. Seal kits are available and any competent shop should be able to rebuild it in an hour +r&r time. I'd recommend rebuild yours versus buying a rebuilt rack with unknown history.
- Front top strut mounts only really need replaced if the bearing doesn't rotate smoothly. You'll definitely feel that difference in the steering. Slight age cracks in the top mounts, oddly, don't have much effect on the street in my experience. The "grease seepage" diagnosis is odd, and kind of suspicious. The remaining rear rubber is also stout and rarely an issue.
- The inner and outer tie rods both have a really long service life. The trouble is that the inners are squishy by design making aftermarket solid versions a nice upgrade to consider.
- Save a couple dollars by avoiding middle-men. For instance- https://www.ebay.com/itm/Fits-Porsche-993-964-Turbo-1989-98-Steering-Rack-Mount-Bushing-Polyurethane/122846403749?hash=item1c9a375ca5:g:U1sAAOxy0QBSTI-6&vxp=mtr
- I would suggest Euro ride height for the Bilstein/H&R combo. Very low heights get into front compression travel issues.
- Last, consider running RS camber specs when they put it on the alignment rack. They're still mild specs but will give a little extra grip in the turns and won't add any appreciable tire wear.
Enjoy!
Very little additional vibration from either the poly steering rack mounts or from solid inner tie rods. Solid inners have been a common g-body upgrade since the dawn of time. As 911Jetta says, just a more direct steering feel. Don't replace the outer tie rods just because they're old. That approach will get you into trouble quick!
How much of your money would you like us to spend?
There are lots of options and lots of threads on them.- A leaking steering rack isn't uncommon and a seal-only rebuild will fix it. Seal kits are available and any competent shop should be able to rebuild it in an hour +r&r time. I'd recommend rebuild yours versus buying a rebuilt rack with unknown history.
- Front top strut mounts only really need replaced if the bearing doesn't rotate smoothly. You'll definitely feel that difference in the steering. Slight age cracks in the top mounts, oddly, don't have much effect on the street in my experience. The "grease seepage" diagnosis is odd, and kind of suspicious. The remaining rear rubber is also stout and rarely an issue.
- The inner and outer tie rods both have a really long service life. The trouble is that the inners are squishy by design making aftermarket solid versions a nice upgrade to consider.
- Save a couple dollars by avoiding middle-men. For instance- https://www.ebay.com/itm/Fits-Porsche-993-964-Turbo-1989-98-Steering-Rack-Mount-Bushing-Polyurethane/122846403749?hash=item1c9a375ca5:g:U1sAAOxy0QBSTI-6&vxp=mtr
- I would suggest Euro ride height for the Bilstein/H&R combo. Very low heights get into front compression travel issues.
- Last, consider running RS camber specs when they put it on the alignment rack. They're still mild specs but will give a little extra grip in the turns and won't add any appreciable tire wear.
Enjoy!