The LS1 swap has begun
11-29-2011, 01:06 PM
#856
Rennlist Junkie Forever
I have Stoptech ST60s (6 piston) on the front of my car, the calipers originally came from a 350Z kit I had. 355mm rotors and I used 964 Stoptech hats for correct offset. I like Stoptech because you can easily buy all the caliper rebuild parts, rotors and hats individually from places like Zeckhausen. Apart from a simple one inch block spacer bolted to the M030 hubs nothing is fabricated. They work brilliantly for me with DTC 70 pads. Two years of hard racing with no issues. Can't imagine any better result from GT3 hardware.
Interesting....
Can you clarify exactly which rotors you used? And you used a 964 hat vs a 965 hat to align properly with your M030 hubs?
I ask because I'm going to bigger brakes and I'm trying to decide which route to go.
Thanks,
TonyG
11-29-2011, 01:12 PM
#857
Rennlist Junkie Forever
Hey..
Two things. Just to clarify...
You mention 964 hats, but the 911 turbo (C2 turbo) was designated a 965. The 964 was the N/A 911.
So was it a 964 hat or a 965 hat?
Do you have the part numbers for the disks, hats, and calipers?
Also, could you take off your wheel and measure the total overall diameter from the furthest point on top of the caliper to the other side of the rotor? Trying to see if these will fit my wheels.
Sorry for all the questions... but I'm in a hurry to get some big brakes installed.
Thanks,
TonyG
Two things. Just to clarify...
You mention 964 hats, but the 911 turbo (C2 turbo) was designated a 965. The 964 was the N/A 911.
So was it a 964 hat or a 965 hat?
Do you have the part numbers for the disks, hats, and calipers?
Also, could you take off your wheel and measure the total overall diameter from the furthest point on top of the caliper to the other side of the rotor? Trying to see if these will fit my wheels.
Sorry for all the questions... but I'm in a hurry to get some big brakes installed.
Thanks,
TonyG
The radial mounts on the M030 hubs are a problem to adapt to a lot of bigger calipers including modern Porsche monoblock 6 piston (which I also have a set) because of the fact that the wide hole spacing on the hub doesn't quite line up with the caliper mounting holes, but does slightly overlap. You can't use two set of holes because the holes would overlap and you wouldn't be able to have two seperate sets of bolt mounts.
Thats where the ST60 calipers worked perfectly because the mounting hole spacing on the caliper is much wider than the hub hole spacing so you can bolt a block to the hubs, then bolt the calipers to the block seperately. The picture below shows the adapter block used.
This is only a problem on the M030 hubs and on standard hubs any of the bigger calipers can be attached with a conventional adapter.
The use of 964 hats was more a case of buying the hats, fitting the rotors, then adapting the caliper adapter to suit the offset, so most Stoptech Porsche hats could be made to work. I used the templates on the Stoptech website to pick a hat that had similar spacing to the original discs. Dave Zeckhausen then helped me figure out that 911 Carrera S and 4S (993) 1995-1998 and the 1991-1994 911 Turbo (964) Stoptech hat part number fitted the bill.
I should note that Stoptech themselves weren't very helpful in figuring out a solution and actually told me it couldn't be done
Thats where the ST60 calipers worked perfectly because the mounting hole spacing on the caliper is much wider than the hub hole spacing so you can bolt a block to the hubs, then bolt the calipers to the block seperately. The picture below shows the adapter block used.
This is only a problem on the M030 hubs and on standard hubs any of the bigger calipers can be attached with a conventional adapter.
The use of 964 hats was more a case of buying the hats, fitting the rotors, then adapting the caliper adapter to suit the offset, so most Stoptech Porsche hats could be made to work. I used the templates on the Stoptech website to pick a hat that had similar spacing to the original discs. Dave Zeckhausen then helped me figure out that 911 Carrera S and 4S (993) 1995-1998 and the 1991-1994 911 Turbo (964) Stoptech hat part number fitted the bill.
I should note that Stoptech themselves weren't very helpful in figuring out a solution and actually told me it couldn't be done
11-29-2011, 01:49 PM
#858
Rennlist Member
Tony,
Rotors are slotted as listed on this page as part number 31.737.1101/1102 (left and right have different numbers)
http://zeckhausen.com/StopTech/consumables.htm#Rotors
Hats are these Stoptech parts 37.780.7413 and 7414 on this page
http://store.zeckhausen.com/catalog/...ords=37.780.74
Calipers unfortunately I don't have a seperate part number for. I didn't buy the calipers as seperate parts because I took them from a Stoptech kit I had previously installed on my 350Z. They are ST60s from the standard 350Z Stoptech kit, so I assume it would be easy enough to find out from Stoptech or Zeckhausen a part number.
I can tell you the piston sizes are 34mm, 30mm and 28mm because I rebuilt them prior to putting them on the Porsche.
It is important to get St60s with the right piston sizes as they vary. The 350Z specced calipers are an ideal match because the total piston area happened to be near identical to the Porsche M030 calipers so they don't screw up the bias.
Would be happy to measure the clearance, but unfortunately the car just arrived back in Australia and I am back in Dubai right now. I won't get near the car till February. I can tell you that ST60s and 355mm rotors fit ok with my 18 inch rims, but not sure about 17s. Maybe check with Stoptech for wheel rim limtations with those sizes.
Hope that helps.
Rotors are slotted as listed on this page as part number 31.737.1101/1102 (left and right have different numbers)
http://zeckhausen.com/StopTech/consumables.htm#Rotors
Hats are these Stoptech parts 37.780.7413 and 7414 on this page
http://store.zeckhausen.com/catalog/...ords=37.780.74
Calipers unfortunately I don't have a seperate part number for. I didn't buy the calipers as seperate parts because I took them from a Stoptech kit I had previously installed on my 350Z. They are ST60s from the standard 350Z Stoptech kit, so I assume it would be easy enough to find out from Stoptech or Zeckhausen a part number.
I can tell you the piston sizes are 34mm, 30mm and 28mm because I rebuilt them prior to putting them on the Porsche.
It is important to get St60s with the right piston sizes as they vary. The 350Z specced calipers are an ideal match because the total piston area happened to be near identical to the Porsche M030 calipers so they don't screw up the bias.
Would be happy to measure the clearance, but unfortunately the car just arrived back in Australia and I am back in Dubai right now. I won't get near the car till February. I can tell you that ST60s and 355mm rotors fit ok with my 18 inch rims, but not sure about 17s. Maybe check with Stoptech for wheel rim limtations with those sizes.
Hope that helps.
11-29-2011, 04:05 PM
#859
Rennlist Member
More info for those interested in the Stoptech setup - I am still using the booster, original master cylinder size and factory ABS. I use the standard M030 rear brake calipers and rotors. I use a 5/33 bias valve.
I don't know how the setup would feel with a different booster or master cylinder setup like some of the V8 guys will have, but on my car this is a wicked setup, no one outbrakes me...lol
I don't know how the setup would feel with a different booster or master cylinder setup like some of the V8 guys will have, but on my car this is a wicked setup, no one outbrakes me...lol
11-29-2011, 07:12 PM
#860
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GT3 = 28/32/38
Piston Area (Front & Rear)
944T = 3474.61
944 Turbo S (Mo30) = 3861.03
GT3/944T = 3876.73
ST60/944t = 3553.15
It is a pretty good feeling out braking cars that cost 4 or 5 times more that the bucket that's closing in from the rear
Marc
_________________________
'00 Audi TT
'99 996 (Wife's ride)
'86 951 LS1 (C-2)
'77 911 3.2 (C-1) Gone but not forgotten.
3.2 Conversion and 915 Rebuild Home Page
The 958 Conversion
958 Track Video
PCA National Registry of Instructors
11-29-2011, 07:31 PM
#861
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Tony,
I assume that you have the Mo30 spindles . . . . if not look here: https://rennlist.com/forums/944-turb...e-upgrade.html
Marc
_________________________
00 Audi TT
'99 996 (Wife's ride)
'86 951 LS1 (C-2)
'77 911 3.2 (C-1) Gone but not forgotten.
3.2 Conversion and 915 Rebuild Home Page
The 958 Conversion
958 Track Video
PCA National Registry of Instructors
I assume that you have the Mo30 spindles . . . . if not look here: https://rennlist.com/forums/944-turb...e-upgrade.html
Marc
_________________________
00 Audi TT
'99 996 (Wife's ride)
'86 951 LS1 (C-2)
'77 911 3.2 (C-1) Gone but not forgotten.
3.2 Conversion and 915 Rebuild Home Page
The 958 Conversion
958 Track Video
PCA National Registry of Instructors
11-29-2011, 07:32 PM
#862
Nordschleife Master
I printed out the ST60 template from the Stoptech website. They don't have one for the 944, so I used one for the 996 C2. I use a 25mm spacer on my front wheels, with that in place, it is very close to fitting. I need to glue the template on to something solid and check again.
11-30-2011, 08:25 PM
#864
Burning Brakes
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Tony, Do you have M030 hubs and spindles?
Hey..
Two things. Just to clarify...
You mention 964 hats, but the 911 turbo (C2 turbo) was designated a 965. The 964 was the N/A 911.
So was it a 964 hat or a 965 hat?
Do you have the part numbers for the disks, hats, and calipers?
Also, could you take off your wheel and measure the total overall diameter from the furthest point on top of the caliper to the other side of the rotor? Trying to see if these will fit my wheels.
Sorry for all the questions... but I'm in a hurry to get some big brakes installed.
Thanks,
TonyG
Two things. Just to clarify...
You mention 964 hats, but the 911 turbo (C2 turbo) was designated a 965. The 964 was the N/A 911.
So was it a 964 hat or a 965 hat?
Do you have the part numbers for the disks, hats, and calipers?
Also, could you take off your wheel and measure the total overall diameter from the furthest point on top of the caliper to the other side of the rotor? Trying to see if these will fit my wheels.
Sorry for all the questions... but I'm in a hurry to get some big brakes installed.
Thanks,
TonyG
11-30-2011, 08:27 PM
#865
Burning Brakes
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11-30-2011, 10:40 PM
#868
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Both AP racing and Performance Friction make universal application knock back springs. AP has three weights, can't remember them though. PF has 7lb springs.