SoloRacer

How does he determine if you are ready to buy? Does he make you give a none refundable deposit? If you are keen for the specs wouldn't you want to know before you buy? Do you have to sign a non disclosure agreement? It doesn't make sense to me to say "I like knowing the specs but I won't get the real important ones until after I buy" It's sort of like saying "GM will build me a car but won't tell me the specs until after I gave them my deposit". A better approach would be "Here is a Corvette - it does 0-60 in 5 seconds and gets 35 mpg." At least then you are basing it on the results - not the specifications. I wouldn't care if the car had a V8 or a supercharged V6. It's the performance that matters. The only real point in knowing all the specifications would be so that you can purchase a turbo from another vendor for less money and that is why you won't tell us what Vic is doing. Again I have no problem with that as it is his livelyhood. I just find it a bit hypocritical to be demanding someone tell you all the specs of one product and then defend not telling all the specs of another. Just my point of view I guess.

As for John's different configurations I guess you could say they are Stage 2, 3, 4 & 5 which is basically what you are saying you can do with Pauer by changing the wheel trims and housing sizes. Perhaps the Pauer model allows for larger variations in performance however I would suspect that if he was selling a tuned bolt-on package he would have to stay with certain known configurations to keep everything safe and predictable. Not everyone is going to have the ability or system in place (EMS) to actively tune an engine.

Again I'm not trying to be insulting. I'm just trying to make sure we are looking at things fairly. I really do look forward to seeing your results. Are you planning to make the maps from your Wolf available for other guys here who might want to follow in your footsteps?

TRP951

And I beleive if you are talking about Tedwrights car that you bought from him that thing had quite a bit of power

User 41221

Nope. I didn't buy Ted's car. You must be thinking of someone else.

Regards,

A.Wayne

Power numbers please . this would be a better comparision tool than PSI ,
could you post you dyno sheet at 23 PSI ....

SoloRacer

I just had an interesting thought. Does anyone ever publish the specs on superchargers? I just bought a 93 NSX with a Comptech supercharger. Now I know that the supercharger is a Whipple blower and I know that it has the smaller (low boost) pulley but I can't say that I have ever heard of anyone saying what the exact specifications are for the internals of the blower. Is this because there are no specifications (lack of variety that you have in turbo selection) or is this because in the supercharger world nobody cares and all they want to know is how it performs? Just wondering.

SoloRacer

I would also like to know the conditions involved in getting the dyno sheet numbers (pump gas, exhaust, head work, etc.)

User 41221

I'm running a widefire with a stock shortblock on pump gas, so no 23psi runs for me, but I will give you an honest 17 psi run in the next several days, as long as I get a chance to break away from my day job.

Regards,

nize

i'd be interested in a before/after dyno with the same tune, the only difference being the turbo swap. can you provide that? that is the only true and fair turbo comparison.

nevertheless, i'm still curious to see your dyno. i don't understand why, when we're all 951 owners, enthusiasts, and customers, we have to be so secretive towards each other. where's the brotherhood? we should be helping each other, not bickering about magical mystery products.

nize

yes. i'll point out once again that the only difference in my turbo comparison is the turbo alone. nothing else changes.

nize

i guess the 'ready to buy' is gut feeling. hell i was ready to buy a vitesse turbo if i had just known the specs. the most important aspect of a turbo upgrade for me was that i wanted to make sure i got a dual ball bearing turbo.

as for the specs, i've already told you and everybody else the specs that matter the most. why don't you be fair and tell us the specs of a vitesse stage2? or do you not even know what the specs are of the turbo you have? do you know how many cylinders and displacement your motor is? maybe you don't care, but this type of information is critical to tuners.

what is a stage2? what is a stage3, 4, &5 ? without specifications you may as well call them voodoo2, pixiedust3, and blackmagic4.

again, i'm not comparing tunes. i'm only comparing turbos.

how much more 'fairly' can you look at something other than two turbos on the same car with identical mods and tunes?

of course. hell, i'll even help them fine-tune their wolf3d systems and tell them the exact specs of my turbo. will you?

nize

who knows? who cares? we're not comparing superchargers here. we're comparing turbos.

nize

do you have such a dyno sheet for your car(s)? where is it?

nize

i would if i had the mods in place to support 23psi. unfortunately, i dont.

333pg333

Ok then based on this we can at least see where the turbo itself will make the differences. Which is about the most that can be claimed from this post. I'm not denigrating or belittling anyone and I think ultimately it's a good thread.

p.s. Changing to the S2 cw&p is a great modification provided you don't need to travel at 275+kmh. It just gives so much better response and probably lets you run a larger turbo while retaining good response all through the rev range.

KuHL 951

I'm not sure what the statement about 'ready to buy' is? I've been talking to Vic for over 3 months knowing he was coming out with this line of turbos. Never once did he try to hide any specifics about the new Garrett units or what wheels, center sections, and components that go into them...at least with me. We discussed what I was looking for in performance, my intended use, my budget, future chip options, and he answered all my questions long before I bought the new Garrett. Vic has been nothing but honest and willing to talk shop and I respect that. I could have bought a standard journal Turbonetics but waited for the Garrett project to fully develop. I didn't have to sign any code of secrecy, learn a secret handshake, place a deposit, or swear allegiance to his products only. I bought the same Garrett unit as Nize a few weeks ago because I felt it will deliver solid performance on the 2.5L and he will back up any problems that might arise. Last year I bought my Tial 38 w/ SS adapter plates and safety wired hardware because his product cost less and offered more than others were at the time. Sure I know the turbo specs, am I going to disassemble it and measure everything and post it? Hell no. I feel that Vic has done a great job in educating me on the pros and cons of the many options I had. He never once badmouthed any other vendor in the many hours I've talked with him.

I just can't see why many of you seem somewhat concerned about someone trying an alternate source for turbos. Vitesse, Lindsey, SFR; they are all good companies that support the 951. Pauer Tuning to me is no different, another good company, a smaller product line maybe, but with a few well thought out products none the less.