Standalone EMS...?
02-20-2007, 02:38 AM
#5
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Originally Posted by Camaro_Muncher
Better diagnostics.
For the VAST majority the answer is no, imo.
Rogue
02-20-2007, 02:54 AM
#6
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Don't want to hijack or argue a point here, but I will say that I cannot compare the Maxtronic and MaxTune to a stand alone system. Since I'm still using the factory DME, there will be limitations. Modern day EMS systems provide a lot more functionality. But to use one you've either got to be an engineer or have someone do it for you. That's why Chris makes the big bucks! 
In the NY area Chris is considered THE Tec3 expert, bar none. I know this from many conversations with friends and associates that are his customers.
my $0.02...
In the NY area Chris is considered THE Tec3 expert, bar none. I know this from many conversations with friends and associates that are his customers. my $0.02...
02-20-2007, 03:13 AM
#7
Three Wheelin'
C'mon! How one can compare 20 year old stock DME to modern and high-resolution engine management?!?
You can look at the install in two diferent ways: one is usual hassle and headache, second is the way to have a NEW and perfectly working engine wiring harness in your car not hardened, oili and ugly 20year old wires.
Not to mention the possibility to go distributorless or COP igniton that makes the engine compartment much cleaner looking.
But, on topic. If you have plenty of cash, go with the Autronic or Motec. If not, consider VEMS. These options are valid in case you have a clue of what you are doing and are one of the best in versatility, power and features but I'm not familiar with the support in US.
If not, go with the one that has the best support you can get.
You can look at the install in two diferent ways: one is usual hassle and headache, second is the way to have a NEW and perfectly working engine wiring harness in your car not hardened, oili and ugly 20year old wires.
Not to mention the possibility to go distributorless or COP igniton that makes the engine compartment much cleaner looking.
But, on topic. If you have plenty of cash, go with the Autronic or Motec. If not, consider VEMS. These options are valid in case you have a clue of what you are doing and are one of the best in versatility, power and features but I'm not familiar with the support in US.
If not, go with the one that has the best support you can get.
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02-20-2007, 03:21 AM
#8
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Originally Posted by Raceboy
C'mon! How one can compare 20 year old stock DME to modern and high-resolution engine management?!?
You can look at the install in two diferent ways: one is usual hassle and headache, second is the way to have a NEW and perfectly working engine wiring harness in your car not hardened, oili and ugly 20year old wires.
Not to mention the possibility to go distributorless or COP igniton that makes the engine compartment much cleaner looking.
But, on topic. If you have plenty of cash, go with the Autronic or Motec. If not, consider VEMS. These options are valid in case you have a clue of what you are doing and are one of the best in versatility, power and features but I'm not familiar with the support in US.
If not, go with the one that has the best support you can get.
You can look at the install in two diferent ways: one is usual hassle and headache, second is the way to have a NEW and perfectly working engine wiring harness in your car not hardened, oili and ugly 20year old wires.
Not to mention the possibility to go distributorless or COP igniton that makes the engine compartment much cleaner looking.
But, on topic. If you have plenty of cash, go with the Autronic or Motec. If not, consider VEMS. These options are valid in case you have a clue of what you are doing and are one of the best in versatility, power and features but I'm not familiar with the support in US.
If not, go with the one that has the best support you can get.
Rogue
02-20-2007, 03:42 AM
#9
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I have a Wolf3D in my 951, and it is a really powerful and flexible system.
Its quite inexpensive over here in Australia ... but looks expensive overseas, which would be the sticking point I would imagine.
Its quite inexpensive over here in Australia ... but looks expensive overseas, which would be the sticking point I would imagine.
02-20-2007, 04:06 AM
#10
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The most attractive thing to me about the Tec3 or any standalone EMS is the new wiring harness etc, but the support is what will make or break the deal. Also don't have any run of the mill shop install it or you'll get into a cost so high...just get an expert to do it.
02-20-2007, 04:32 AM
#11
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a system from the 80's DOES have limitations and can't really be compared
a good ems is also typicly something that is both good hardware wise, but also someting you can get support and help with. plenty of good systems out there.
and yes, most people don't need it. but if your building a 3 liter, changeing turbos, injectors, etc you might wanna go there. I will also have a new cdi unit and loose the distributor.
to mention some goodies i can have enabled, als, launch, water injection control. nitrous control, boost control etc. I can also switch maps for E85 easy and a lot of other cool stuff. but if you just want more power it's way overkill. and I also get wb02 and EGT monitoring on a small LCD and a log of it all.
to raceboy, is it your car I see in vems wiki from estonia?
a good ems is also typicly something that is both good hardware wise, but also someting you can get support and help with. plenty of good systems out there.
and yes, most people don't need it. but if your building a 3 liter, changeing turbos, injectors, etc you might wanna go there. I will also have a new cdi unit and loose the distributor.
to mention some goodies i can have enabled, als, launch, water injection control. nitrous control, boost control etc. I can also switch maps for E85 easy and a lot of other cool stuff. but if you just want more power it's way overkill. and I also get wb02 and EGT monitoring on a small LCD and a log of it all.
to raceboy, is it your car I see in vems wiki from estonia?
02-20-2007, 05:10 AM
#12
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by anders44
to raceboy, is it your car I see in vems wiki from estonia?
I just put some brains in the car.
02-20-2007, 08:57 AM
#15
Three Wheelin'
Knock sensor is just a safety device. And there's a difference in knock sensor receiver and a knock sensor receiver. Knock sensor is just a piezo-microphone that sends the signal to ECU or specialized devise and there's the most important thing: it has to know WHEN to act. Most of the stuff is just plain crap as it's not tuned to the knocking frequency of specific cylinder (has to a lot with the diameter and has to be calculated precicely). You don't want the device to pull the timing on hydraulic lifter noise (seen this many times) or not acting when actual knocking occurs (also seen that).
When tuning, ONLY viable device detecting knock is stethoscope. With that banjo-bolted onto the upper part of the block you can clearly hear when knocking begins and it doesn't get to hurt engine. By the time you hear it behind the wheel, it's usually too late: if it didn't kill the engine this time, it just won't survive it again.
And engine management that doesn't make use of intake temp sensor, is just crap. It must pull timing in pre-determined amount in user-defineable temps.
When tuning, ONLY viable device detecting knock is stethoscope. With that banjo-bolted onto the upper part of the block you can clearly hear when knocking begins and it doesn't get to hurt engine. By the time you hear it behind the wheel, it's usually too late: if it didn't kill the engine this time, it just won't survive it again.
And engine management that doesn't make use of intake temp sensor, is just crap. It must pull timing in pre-determined amount in user-defineable temps.