NC928S4

The auction for my 89S4 just closed and car did not sell. I got one bid for $10,000 which was close to the reserve price but was low. There were over 50 watchers and approximately 1400 Views.

I've owned the car for almost 6 1/2 years and piled in all kinds of money for parts and labor although I did most of the work and had a blast while doing so. I certainly did not expect to flip the car for a profit, rather just wanted to drive a really cool car.

Anyways, I find it kind of sad that a car with +$30K into it is not even worth $10K. Hopefully, my experience is an anomaly. Values should go up as more and more of these cars make their journey to Hans Heaven but for now 928 valuations are defying normal patterns.

Ducman82

20 thousand 10 thousand dollar car...... you are not alone.

77tony

What auction was it on ? T

hacker-pschorr

This one I assume:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1989-Porsche...-/272691577064

For starters, you ran ONE auction. I've worked with people who went through 4-5 eBay cycles before the car was sold and in most cases those went to secondary bidders after the winning bidder disappeared.
A single online auction does not dictate anything about overall values. When you watch the televised TV auctions you never know how many times a particular car was run through different auctions. It's not uncommon to run a car through 3-4 different auctions "fishing" for the right buyer. Every buyer is never in every location. Just like fishing, some spots suck on some days.

Also, what you financially have into the car is irrelevant. All that matters is the overall conditions, what still needs work, records etc... Just because someone sinks six figures into a restoration doesn't mean it's worth six figures. In many cases, very far from it.

The good:
1. LSD
2. Nice color combination (black / black still the most popular for some reason)
3. Well presented

The bad:
1. Anything not working
2. Almost 150k miles
3. Non original paint

The mileage is the biggest factor here. I know as a community of 928 aficionados we like to brag about how awesome these cars are and the high miles they can go without a major rebuild. However, outside the 928 community anything past 100k is high. Nothing is ever going to change this perception. I am continually asked by non-928 people when my 87 is due for a complete major (engine out, complete refresh) because it has 100k on it. These are not ignorant people, just the "norm" with many other collector cars, especially Italian ones.

Where else is the car presented? I would list such a car on minimum 4 sites (auto trader, hemmings, cars.com etc..) at the same time. Is it in the local paper? On Craigslist?

Mrmerlin

Eric has good points for you and the car.
Thats said I would suggest to put the car on Bring a trailer and post here that its on so we can comment GLWS.
NOTE most cars on BaT bring more money than Ebay

GT6ixer

^ What everyone said.

I'll only add that from the pictures it looks like the radio is missing. You definitely need to have one in there before you take the photos. It makes people wonder what else is missing. I would also suggest that you put an original set of wheels back on. There is a wider audience of folks that want originality over a custom set. Either offer the newer wheels as part of the auction or sell them separate.

NC928S4

Thanks guys for the great feedback. My naivety on selling is embarrassingly loud and clear. I expected the car would be quickly snapped up on eBay because of the obvious greatness of the car and all the things that brought the car into excellent shape.

The mileage comment I think is the clincher. After watching a buddy beat the hell out of his 87 with 148K miles at the track(VIR), I became a believer that these engines can live a long long life much different from most other engines.

I figured my biggest problem was going to be a wheel barrow big enough to carry away the money from the sale.

I'll look into Bring a Trailer if I decide to sell it. I'm more inclined to continue my journey of the restoration.

Jerome Craig

Just sold my '87 on BaT and am very happy with the outcome. I got $13,900 for a car I bought 12 years ago as a daily driver for $10,500. Sure I put money into it, but I would have had to do that regardless, and I enjoyed every one of the 53K miles I put on it. I think a car that has been maintained by the owner stops a lot of folks from bidding - unless you're MrMerlin

As for durability, I drove a 86.5 928S for 14 years - mostly as a daily driver - and sold it with 236K miles on the odometer. And the odometer hadn't worked in 3 years. My biggest unplanned expense with that car was; a top end refresh at 125K miles and a rebuilt trans at 160K miles.

vanster

BAT for sure. Also auctions are can be weird. It really depends on "who is in the room" On BAT you have a much larger room to show the car and it's worldwide. Follow Den's 928 sales and try and mirror the photo's he has taken. Don't take pictures in your driveway and try and shoot with a good camera and wait for a cloudy day so the pics aren't blown out. Black is a tough color to photograph in harsh light. BAT will ask you for 40 pics or so. Take your time and yes put the radio back in. You might what to buy an original radio on eBay for the ad. You might even look at a 928 sales brochure to use as a guide for the best angles. Think of it as prom night. My day job for the past 40 years has been printing high end books and car brochures. I have watched photographers struggle with the best angles and lighting. Subscribe to 000 magazine and study the photography and you will get it.

2002M3Drew

Used car pricing for the 928 really has been disappointing up until lately. I never really noticed it before I owned one myself, except for once in a while thinking to myself how cheap they seem to be. When you think about it, an S3 32 valve car was $45,000-$55,000, and the S4s were something like $67,000 in 1987...and that in 1980's currency. S3s car be below $10,000 in decent shape but with higher miles, or approximately 1/10th to 1/5th of its original value. Now compare that with a 911SC. Those range from $17,000 in 1978 to $30,000 for a coupe in 1983 new, but used they pretty much bottomed out at around $12,500 for a rough, high miles car in the early 2000's. That means that the early ones were holding some 60-70% of their original value, and even the latest ones only depreciated by about half. I bought my 1983 SC in 2004 at the bottom of the market, with under 65,000 miles for $15,500, and it was originally $30,000. That car today is worth maybe $35,000, or maybe even more....who knows.

This may be a big opportunity for the 928 speculator, though. The numbers are so in favor of the 928. They made 61,000 total cars worldwide over 17 years of production. Of those, I have to think that more than half of them of them are rusted out, parted out, crushed or otherwise just "gone" for whatever reason. Will we ever see 911 Carrera RS money? No way. But can you expect a reasonable bump for a rare series of cars that are now proving to have been such a vital part in the company's history? Absolutely. If you bought an S4 low at $10,000, you one day may have a $50,000 car or even more. Remember, the 914s were made in much larger numbers, they have a shared lineage with VW, and look how their values have skyrocketed over the past ten years. And that is intrinsically a cheap car - the 928 is intrinsically a hand built supercar.

As for ideas on how to "pitch" your car, that 1977 911S that sold recently on BAT set the bar high, with the seller doing a "coffee table book" (probably through Shutterfly for $10) using the photo shoot pictures, and he promised to personalize it for the new owner upon selling it (easy to do). He also made a cool short video of the car. Before that, all I saw was a 911 in the arguably the worst year of production, with the worst (2.7) engine, the narrower body, the ugly interior, the fiberglass reproduction nose and the mismatched early 911 rear lights. Credit the seller, because he turned what was recently a nice $30,000 car into the image of a junior Singer, and got $75,000 for it.

NC928S4

Car is being listed on BAT. Or I should say, she's been "accepted" to be sold by BAT. I attempted to put it up with a reserve price and got denied.

Their sales person informed me that they are "inundated" with 928s and that they would not accept the car unless I had a current CarFax report and NO RESERVE.

Rolling the dice...

retcav1sg

PM sent

hlee96

That's ridiculous. Less than 10% of cars there are without reserve, and those are almost parts cars. Pull out of BaT, unless you are ok with selling this car for $5k (which may happen, especially lately with lower auction prices in the past 2 months).

linderpat

yikes. No reserve is risky or sure. GLWA

Adamant1971

+928

I would tell them to suck eggs. Make the changes mentioned, photograph well and try ebay again. Sometimes it takes a few auctions.