Ryan Thompson

I was able to pull the motor today with the help of a buddy. Having two people made it much less intimidating. Feeding the wires through the firewall was the most daunting task. It wasn't as bad as thought it would be with some one to push, while I pulled from underneath.

I took one picture of metal in the oil pan. Not looking good.

Please give me your opinion on the block.

granprixweiss928

Thrust bearing failure.

Pack up the motor on a pallet and ship to Greg Brown, or other re builder. Unless you can do yourself.

It should be completely gone thru, disassembled, everything mic'd, and rebuilt.

Imo000

Pull the girdle and let's see what it looks like.

Ducman82

wow

Mrmerlin

how much is the end play of the crank?
it looks like the 2/6 rod bearings have failed .

the thrust bearing is in the center of the block and the machining marks look normal

Ryan Thompson

Here is a video. See if you can determine anything more. Tried prying on the flywheel and it didn't apear to move at all.

Mrmerlin

the way to check crank end play is with a dial indicator on the flywheel and two screw drivers,
pry the crank one way then the other,
the dial indicator should move.
it looks like there is still thrust bearing material on the bearing.
Otherwise pull the rod caps for the 2/ 6 rods

jcorenman

That all looks pretty clean... So where did all the schwarf in the pan come from??

The heads and all that are still on, correct?

So try a prybar from each end, as Stan said. A bad TB bearing throwing that much crap will have obvious movement. If that seems OK then I would leave the girdle (lower block) alone for the moment...

You said it sounded like a rod knock, and 2/6 are usually the first to go. Pulling the rod caps is easy, and rolling in new bearings is easy. These cranks are tough, it is really hard to hurt the journals ... fingers crossed.

Imo000

I can see the trust bearing still there, hard to tell the condition but it's still there but there is lots of bluing around the crankshaft journal at that location. Start pulling the bearings and let's see what's in there.

Ryan Thompson

Started pulling the girdle and wondering how you support the engine. 2 of the 4 through bolts are in the girdle.

Ryan Thompson

What do you see here that makes you believe that the 2/6 rod bearing has failed? Where is the 2/6 rod bearing located from the image I have given you? I am guessing I can look in the WSM and there is a cylinder number identifier pic.

Mongo

The girdle also doesn't have the self-machined look of a failed thrust bearing. Merlin mentioned it prior. You can tell the crank did get hot in the location IMO mentioned. Since it's out of the car, might as well rebuild it anyways.

Not sure how mechanically savvy you are, but this is a great opportunity to really learn your car. You will get LOTS of help on a DIY rebuild from here.

docmirror

I don't see an indication of heat on the 2/6 journal, but I do see the heat indication on the crank at the face of the thrust bearing. And, I too see a bit of thrust bearing material still at the cheek of the girdle/block.

How I would proceed: Remove the cap nuts on the 2/6 rods journal if you can get to them(second one down from the front). Push the pistons to the top of the bore, and carefully try to turn the crank just a little bit. Be very careful of denting the journal of the crank with the rod bolts, although the crank is badly heat damaged, no need to mess it further. This will indicate whether the 2/6 was seized. When I took mine apart, I had bad heat damage on the journal, and I had to hammer the rod bearings off the crank. Your's may not be as bad.

Next, if the crank will now turn just a bit, inspect the 2/6 crank journal for damage, and also the rod bearings that came out. Then, check the crank end play with the dial ind and pry bar. If the crank is still frozen in place with the 2/6 rod caps and bearings off, more likely the seizure is in the mains journal(thrust bearing), and the girdle has to come out.

Support the top of the engine facing downward with a metal brace to the center base leg of the engine stand. Take out the engine stand bolts that go through the girdle s-l-o-w-l-y and insure the brace and engine stand will take the load and not fall over. Make sure the anti-rotation bolt on the pivot yoke of the engine stand is in very snug too.

jcorenman

Right side (car's right side) is 1-2-3-4 from the front, left side is 5-6-7-8.

So from the front of engine (accessory pulley), the rods in the first bay are 1-5, then 2-6, 3-7, and 4-8 next to the flywheel. The thrust bearing is in the middle web.

After pulling rod nuts and removing the cap, it is a good idea to slip two pieces of vinyl or rubber hose over the studs on each rod to protect the crank journal surfaces as things flop around.

Ryan Thompson

There was no seizure. The crank turns fully still with no noises or grinding. The motor was running fine even at 6,000 rmp shifts, but had "what I am calling rod knock noise." I drove it probably 80 miles with this noise, as I thought it was the notorious lifter sound. Then I drained the oil and realized I had a bigger problem. I definitely do not claim to be an engine noise expert. I tried using my stethoscope to isolate the noise, but couldn't pin it down. I have done a lot of work to cars over the years. I do ALL of my own work on all years of cars I own. Whether it be my Wife's, or mine. However, I have very limited internal motor experience. Not scared of it, but have a healthy respect, so I don't damage anything. I think I am going to pull the girdle, since I am already half way done with that job and then if it looks good I will check 2/6. Thanks for the brace idea and all others suggestions. This is the best group of people I have ever witnessed. Thank you!