928s for Sale
05-29-2020, 11:16 AM
#8281
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Does it have the "Do It Yourself" manual transmission, or the superior "Fully Equipped by Porsche" Automatic Transmission?
George Layton March 2014
928 Owners are ".....a secret sect of quietly assured Porsche pragmatists who in near anonymity appreciate the prodigious, easy going prowess of the 928."
Does it have the "Do It Yourself" manual transmission, or the superior "Fully Equipped by Porsche" Automatic Transmission?
George Layton March 2014928 Owners are ".....a secret sect of quietly assured Porsche pragmatists who in near anonymity appreciate the prodigious, easy going prowess of the 928."
05-29-2020, 02:43 PM
#8282
Burning Brakes
I really like the interior on that car. I have two red GTs both with complete black interiors, but this interior really makes the interior pop in a late 80s kind of way.
Last edited by Red Flash; 05-30-2020 at 04:15 PM. Reason: Added picture for posterity's sake...
05-29-2020, 02:56 PM
#8283
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Comments on this ‘88 5-speed are ... very ... um ... interesting.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
05-29-2020, 06:56 PM
#8284
Burning Brakes
Allow me to restate
Harsh? Which part?
I don’t know what’s ’fair.’ I do know that someone who pays $65k for a GTS may feel ‘suckered’ when they find out they need to put $10k-$30k into it to make it a reliable driver that isn’t in the shop every other week. And then, what’s a 100k+-mile $65k GTS with $10k of recent work worth? Apparently $65k or less from what I’ve seen.
On the other hand, how many folks will spend 50, 75, 90, 100k on a ‘classic’ car and then put miles on it?
The ‘market’ seems to be clueless about the difference between a reliable 928 and those than can only be driven to and from the shop (due to ultra-low mileage or unreliability) and what it costs to turn the latter into the former. The ultra-low mileage cars don’t really count as they’ll be driven a couple hundred miles per year at best, so they can leak, or misfire, or have dead motor mounts and no one cares.
The 928 I referred to above (intake re-re-do) is an example. There was a 10 year period where the VAST majority of its miles were going between shop and garage where the work was more-or-less changing one a/c o-ring per trip. (Some hyperbole, but not as much as you think...)
Frankly, none of it makes sense to me anymore except how much it costs to take an average 928 with no, or spotty history, and turn it into a 928 that you can jump in and take on a two week trip with no worries (and working A/C, etc. And, for a GTS, not adding 1/2 quart of oil with every tank of gas.)
I don’t know what’s ’fair.’ I do know that someone who pays $65k for a GTS may feel ‘suckered’ when they find out they need to put $10k-$30k into it to make it a reliable driver that isn’t in the shop every other week. And then, what’s a 100k+-mile $65k GTS with $10k of recent work worth? Apparently $65k or less from what I’ve seen.
On the other hand, how many folks will spend 50, 75, 90, 100k on a ‘classic’ car and then put miles on it?
The ‘market’ seems to be clueless about the difference between a reliable 928 and those than can only be driven to and from the shop (due to ultra-low mileage or unreliability) and what it costs to turn the latter into the former. The ultra-low mileage cars don’t really count as they’ll be driven a couple hundred miles per year at best, so they can leak, or misfire, or have dead motor mounts and no one cares.
The 928 I referred to above (intake re-re-do) is an example. There was a 10 year period where the VAST majority of its miles were going between shop and garage where the work was more-or-less changing one a/c o-ring per trip. (Some hyperbole, but not as much as you think...)
Frankly, none of it makes sense to me anymore except how much it costs to take an average 928 with no, or spotty history, and turn it into a 928 that you can jump in and take on a two week trip with no worries (and working A/C, etc. And, for a GTS, not adding 1/2 quart of oil with every tank of gas.)
But as you stated how do people judge the market.
05-30-2020, 06:23 AM
#8285
Burning Brakes
The ‘market’ seems to be clueless about the difference between a reliable 928 and those than can only be driven to and from the shop (due to ultra-low mileage or unreliability) and what it costs to turn the latter into the former. The ultra-low mileage cars don’t really count as they’ll be driven a couple hundred miles per year at best, so they can leak, or misfire, or have dead motor mounts and no one cares.
As for the GTS cited above? Well, some seem to work without having to have the engine out service and others need it to clean up the effects of oil ingestion. Without knowing the car you kind of have to assume that for a GTS you would need it, if you actually intend to "use" the car. So, I'm on Worf's side with regards to that general statement too. But, on the other hand, if you just want to admire it in the collection, that's perfectly ok too. Your money, so enjoy it however you want.
05-31-2020, 01:04 AM
#8286
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Comments on this ‘88 5-speed are ... very ... um ... interesting.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
05-31-2020, 01:22 AM
#8287
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Notice that that 928 has "Pre-amps" installed? And that it's almost a GT - every option - except for the exhaust (that adds the extra hp?) How about "standard" 8-inch and 10-inch wheels?
And he "replaced all the wiring harnesses"
Have you priced "all" of the wiring harness lately? Never mind the labor involved in replacing *all* of the wiring harnesses. That alone should add $20k to the value.
And he "replaced all the wiring harnesses"
Have you priced "all" of the wiring harness lately? Never mind the labor involved in replacing *all* of the wiring harnesses. That alone should add $20k to the value.
05-31-2020, 01:32 AM
#8288
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Aw h3ll. I don't know. I'm giving up on trying to understand the 928 market. I see 928s like Rob's Cobalt GT that was - arguably - as good as new go for <50% of sticker and see 928s that haven't had 10% of the Cobalt GT's work for the same money.
On the other hand, if we're chasing the air-cooled 911s where a rusted bare tub is worth $10k+ then great!
Last edited by worf928; 05-31-2020 at 01:40 AM. Reason: spellos
The following 2 users liked this post by worf928:
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06-01-2020, 10:07 AM
#8289
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It is funny as everyone expects cars on BaT to need little or nothing. Nearly every 964 coupe I have seen sell at BaT in the $50-60k range is going to cost the new owner at least $15-30k in deferred maintenance or a full engine build. These cars are not getting any younger and the prices to have work done properly is escalating.
06-01-2020, 11:26 PM
#8290
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Comments on this ‘88 5-speed are ... very ... um ... interesting.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
06-02-2020, 03:01 AM
#8291
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It is funny as everyone expects cars on BaT to need little or nothing. Nearly every 964 coupe I have seen sell at BaT in the $50-60k range is going to cost the new owner at least $15-30k in deferred maintenance or a full engine build. These cars are not getting any younger and the prices to have work done properly is escalating.
06-02-2020, 12:17 PM
#8292
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Comments on this ‘88 5-speed are ... very ... um ... interesting.
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...che-928-s4-53/
06-02-2020, 01:23 PM
#8293
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I've spoken to thiis man before, all indications are the car is completely legit. I seem to recall JP inviting him to attend frenzy but I guess it wasn't his thing. Had 2 other 5 speed S4s last May when we spoke. Very professional guy on phone. I think he may hang with the ferrari guy circle more than the 928 folks. But he. in vacuum from all of us, if one could imagine that's possible, came across as a real long term 928 enthusiast who wanted to simply sell them all and buy something else instead.
I guess everyone’s ok with that. (I haven’t checked back. Maybe there’s evidence to the contrary now.)
06-02-2020, 10:16 PM
#8294
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Understood.
I'd probably have thought similar thoughts, too, had I not spent about 45 minutes on the phone with him talking about the hobby.
Funny thing is that sometimes a totally unusual, unexpected thing happens.
10 years ago my son chased a holy grail 944 rumor all the way to a farm on the SK/North Dakota border. Turned out to be a beat up 924.
Last year, a totally improbable, 99% likely fake ad led to one that hadn't even been broken in yet.
Sometimes we should 'do opposite' of first impression.
I'd probably have thought similar thoughts, too, had I not spent about 45 minutes on the phone with him talking about the hobby.
Funny thing is that sometimes a totally unusual, unexpected thing happens.
10 years ago my son chased a holy grail 944 rumor all the way to a farm on the SK/North Dakota border. Turned out to be a beat up 924.
Last year, a totally improbable, 99% likely fake ad led to one that hadn't even been broken in yet.
Sometimes we should 'do opposite' of first impression.
06-02-2020, 10:25 PM
#8295
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I do agree that he could present the car much better. Start by putting the Cup wheels on, and the original steering wheel, sourcing a period correct head unit (not a Blau IIRC) and swapping out that tricked out sound system, and....remove the flank badge and decals. IMO, not only do those pricey upgrades not add value, they detract.
Take better pics focusing on the things that have endured, like the dash, driver's seat, etc and let the car speak for itself. I think that all of the personal touches offset the good, original bones that this car has.
He may come off as a salesman or a flipper, but he isn't. He's had these 928s in a really nice climate controlled garage for decades and is totally straight when he says how much he likes the 928.
This car isn't getting nearly the attention on BaT that it deserves.
Take better pics focusing on the things that have endured, like the dash, driver's seat, etc and let the car speak for itself. I think that all of the personal touches offset the good, original bones that this car has.
He may come off as a salesman or a flipper, but he isn't. He's had these 928s in a really nice climate controlled garage for decades and is totally straight when he says how much he likes the 928.
This car isn't getting nearly the attention on BaT that it deserves.