993inNC

Good day all. I'm here because I'm a 993 and 914 guy and know nothing of 928's other than they can be complex. I'm a long time member here but no longer a paid active member, hope you don't mind my request.

I have a 356 Speedster Replica that I am about to trade for a 928 and I'd like to make sure I'm not loosing out on the deal.
The car's stats are:

1985 S - Black on Black, just turned 40K miles.

The car's interior is almost flawless for the age IMO, a couple of little nicks in console etc. But rear interior quarter panels and door panels are perfect. Seats are as perfect as one can expect for 30 years old. No cracking no bolster wear, still somewhat "supple". Carpet excellent, dash excellent, switches etc in great shape.

I plan to take it to a guru mechanic I know for timing belt/water pump and there's a couple small items not working correctly I'll have him fix but the car is solid as far as I can tell.

Body is excellent, with one tiny rust blister under rear/side driver's window and it seems as if the driver's fender either had a respray or replace and spray but well done.

Auto tranny, shifts well and runs tight.

The car seems unusually clean, but again I don't have a lot of experience with these cars. Most I've seen tend to be less than acceptable in condition.

Curious what you guys think a value would be. I'm deep in money into my Speedie, so want to know that this is a fair trade (it's an even trade, no cash).

Thanks guys,
Chris

hlee96

Welcome to the world of 928, potentially. Anyway you've described a pretty clean and cared for specimen, but it may not equate to "well maintained". Do you have all the service history and work done for the car, most importantly water pump, timing belt, injectors, etc. In addition, since it's an auto, what is the thrust bearing, flex measurements?

Even beautiful looking 928 may have $10,000 in catch up maintenance in order to make it run perfectly, ask me how I know.

Pictures of the car, exterior and interior, and the engine will allow for the 928 experts in this forum (much more experienced and smarter than I can ever be) to give you informed and sounded advice and opinions.

You haven't mentioned, but what do you think your 356 replica is worth? Then we can tell you if it is an even trade.

Best of luck-Hoi

medipedicman

Price checks from afar are always tough. It sounds like a good example but I would research the value of a top dollar 1985 and see if you are in the right ball park. You can use eBay as a rough guide.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-928-...m=121935013234

That one is listed for $19,800 with 79,xxx miles. 5 speed adds $1k vs Auto

In the end it is for you to decide what your replica is worth to you.
If you are able to verify timing belt and water pump service in the last two years then it might be a good deal for all.
But, if you trade your baby for the 85 and then have to sink another $5000 in it you might have a different attitude.

There is a great 928 mechanic 134 miles NW of you in Raleigh called Ray Munsch, and a great shop a little further from you in Atlanta called Garage 928. I would take any new to me 32 valve engine to one of these guys before putting any serious miles on it.

docmirror

The devil is in the details.

As said above, even a car with one tiny rust bubble can have big bills for catch-up mx. The TB/WP job is just the most common. You're starting out with a good year. Check the option sticker under the rear carpet in the hatch for the codes, and post them here. If it also has 220(LSD), and 474(sport shocks/springs) that will add to the value considerably. Also things like sunroof delete, and side molding delete could improve the value.

Here's my decode as sight-unseen, but I'm the bottom-feeder of the bunch so my numbers might be lower than most.

Things to look for: 1. ALL electrical systems working as they should, incl the AC. 2. Get the car in bright sunlight and recheck the paint again. Black is quite tricky, be objective. 3. Open the hood, start the car, and rev it quick from idle. See if the engine rocks, if not - you need motor mounts. 4. Check the shifter for slop. 5. Look carefully at all the exterior trim, incl the fender liners, front air dam, window moldings, etc.

Base price for average 85, common color ### $5-6000.
Add for mileage under 50k ### $2000
GT-type options(LSD,shocks) ### $1000
Near flawless int ### $1500
Above ave paint ### $2-3000
Catch-up mx if you pay shop rates ### ($3-4000) (could be higher)


Top of the range would be about $13,500 if it requires minimal mx.
Bottom of the range would be ~$7000 if the paint is only average, and needs plenty of work that you haven't seen yet. I would peg the car based on description just below $10k. Note this is what BUYERS will pay, not what sellers will offer.

YMMV, don't try this at home, contents have settled, and may cause **** leakage.

Oh, and welcome.

[edited for recheck it's an auto, thus less desirable.]

Clill

I think 356 replicas are right about 20K ?

linderpat

It sounds like a very good example. The thrust bearing issue didn't become an issue until Porsche dropped the retaining clip off the spline in 1986, so you are probably ok on that point. Not to mention that the miles are low enough that there would not be any damage anyway (still have it checked). The work that you will have done will be in the $3 to $4 K range. If all as described, I'd say $17 to $22K is a fair deal.

GuardsTurbo

Also be careful with the mileage, these cars are old and could have been tampered with in the past as the 80's and 90's were known for such illicit acts.

Wisconsin Joe

Others have offered their opinions, here is mine.

You are planning on a TB/WP, what about an intake refresh? That is as much a "Time" issue as a "Miles" issue. It involves pulling the intake and fuel injection stuff and putting new gaskets, boots, vac lines, ect, ect.

Your description, depending on what it needs, sounds to be a $12k - $18k car.

Paint and interior are the two most expensive areas to fix, so having those good is a strong plus.
Mechanicals (engine, drive line & suspension) isn't cheap, but not as bad as paint and interior.

I would strongly suggest getting a good pre-purchase inspection (PPI). It helps avoid expensive surprises.

Good luck, and if you get it, come back and post pics.

James Bailey

bad trade.....replica is far more $$$$

davek9

As said some pic's and the Vin would be helpful to evaluate condition and options.
Once you have it sorted out an '85 32v can be easily chipped then the added power will surprise you, as they were really detuned from the factory.

I'd budget at least $3k in parts for deferred maintenance (T-Belt, Fuel lines, Intake refresh), figure that most if not all under hood rubber will need replacing, it's more age than millage.

Good luck and please post some pic's

Dave K

James Bailey

The replica does not "eat" much .....the 928 any 928 requires more care and feeding. It is very easy to spend thousands of $$$$ on a 928 just catching up on all the things the prior owner put off doing because it was "too expensive" the last time he took it to the shop.....

dr bob

Kind of what I was thinking, but so much depends on the specific cars.


Do you WANT a 928? Most new owners are passionate about the car, which causes glaucoma during shopping.

Based solely on your description:

-- Interior is in need of a little care due to age. Some serious leather conditioning will make the intact leather supple again. The rugs can be cleaned to new condition if the car was stored well in the dark. Otherwise you may want new because of fading.

-- Exterior has a couple flaws described. The painted-different front fender can sometimes be remedied by a good paint detailer. Know that you'll be doing this every few years, as the newer paint fades at a different rate than the original. The blistering at the rear quarter window is from moisture that accumulated in the window well. Could be from rain, wash water, or condensation while stored. The windows come out, the "S" spoiler comes off, metal repair is done, and it all goes back together after respray. Depending on your talents, most or all of that work goes to a specialist body shop.

-- Cars of this vintage have age-related concerns. Pretty much everything rubber in the car is suspect. Start off with the critical stuff like replace all the fuel lines, and have the injectors cleaned or replaced. All coolant hoses get renewed during the timing belt/water pump project, and it's best to do all the vacuum and oil vent lines under the intake manifold as one project. Brake hoses are on the list, along with a full brake system flush.

-- The cooling system is a critical concern on the 928. The aluminum block falls victim to old coolant, sacrificing itself to the ravages of wrong and/or old coolant. Visit the records for the car, looking for coolant refresh every couple years. Popular coolants like Prestone are good for less than two years in these cars at best. Porsche/VW blue coolants are great, and G05 Zerex is good too. There are some specialty coolants in Europe that fill the bill, but they are not at all commonly available in the US. Anyway, the acid test for coolant is exactly that for your candidate car.


My general guidance for any new 928 owner is to plan for at least $5k in rubber parts and pieces to make the car safe enough to drive. Labor is on top of that. Then your tire budget, and then cosmetic stuff. As others have mentioned, it's way easy to find a "nice" car, and spend $10k+ in the first year on it, doing the work yourself. Unless you find an enthusiast car that's been kept up along the way.

The flip side is that there are folks who buy OK cars, do a few things so it runs OK, gamble on the fuel and other hoses, and love their cars.


My personal standards are that the car needs to be safe and reliable enough to throw throw golf bags and weekend luggage in the back and drive anywhere without a worry. Everything needs to work as designed. Car needs to look good enough to turn heads on arrival at the country club. Decide what your standards are, and what it will take to get your candidate car to that standard.

docmirror

All these reasons above is why the guy wants to trade. I'm betting he found out the hard way how much stuff there is on a 928 to take care of and just wants to get out from under a few centuries of front labor.

Which means you get to inherit all those centuries of deferred mx. Motor mounts, inj harness, relays, fuel bits, sensor harness, etc.

Crumpler

I would harken back to Dr. Bob's statement...do you really want a 928?
If you haven't yet, drive it. Then drive it like you stole it. We are talking about a pretty big transition from a 356 clone, apples to oranges really.
If a brute of a GT is appealing, don't let the maintenance scare you off.

linderpat

My goodness, to listen to the remarks in this thread one would never ever buy a 928! Honestly, you can get a good one, and if it was well maintained, just drive it and catch up with items over time. With a car as described by the OP, you DO NOT need to immediately put it on blocks and not drive it until you dump $10K plus into it. I have had several of these cars, and have never done that. I just fix them as I go along, and never had one burn up on me or break down somewhere or whatever.

Yes, the rubber items will need to be replaced at some point, but not before you drive and enjoy it. Yes, there are little odds and ends that you will want to do, but again as time and budget allow. The only major things would be timing belt and the proper water pump (which the OP said he was doing anyway). For a few dollars more, do the fuel lines, then drive it. These are incredibly bullet proof cars - you can yank old ones out of junk yards, as rotting hulks, and with a fresh blast of ether and some new fuel, they fire right up - I've seen it happen multiple times! The car that the OP is describing is hardly that.

Sometimes we are just too conservative in our collective advice.