PaulD_944S2

No the clip has anti-gravity effects and is lifting the person standing on the scale!

FredR

Carl,

As you know I am a big fan of your cross brace and its contribution to resisting twist of the support rails under extreme cornering loads but my concern was that a 45 degree type direct hit on those ends might cause the rail to buckle inwards given the brace has a different function and the loads are notionally different [ or so I believe].

To be fair the brace mount is closer to the end of the rail than I initially visualised but I would think it is structurally essential to tie those ends together- of course no issue given you have this covered.

As a matter of interest, had the frame rail yielded would you be able to repair such damage or would you [simply?] transplant everything into another body shell assuming they are plentiful?

Rgds

Fred

Carl Fausett

nice...

Carl Fausett

Depends on the degree of damage. I twisted that left front frame rail once before, and was able to make a "tool" that was about 5' long that clamped to the front tube and we unwound the twist to within spec. (God I love mild steel) But yes, there is a point of no return where I would need another tub. At my age (about to turn 60) I frankly know that would be the end of my 928 racing campaign. I would sign off. Shame, too, because I'm just getting good :-) (or at least, better)

Carl Fausett

There are benefits both ways, hydraulic and electric. I am still running the 1978 steering rack (rebuilt) and the original power steering pump. Surprised it can handle the 305 racing slicks in the front. It was under-powered at Pikes Peak on the switch-backs and I had burns in both arms when I got to the top.

I seem to remember Mark Anderson had an electric steering assist in the White Zombie at the end. I could be wrong. Somebody will know.

mark kibort

I have been running the stock rack for 20 years.. running a lot more Gs that you have seen Carl at much more g intensive tracks as well, and it works just fine.. on sticky 320 slicks up front... no problems, BUT to your point, man !!!!! its HARD on the arms.. im in pretty close to peak shape these days and those 30-40 min races are a HUGE work out, expecially at tracks like Sears point. a electric sterring rack might be a nice change and with a little tighter steering ratio as well!
the faster you get Carl, the more you might want to consider the modification to electric.. maybe Anderson can assist with the design... i think he used the stock rack with an electric pump and dont know how it effected the ease of use. i guess the ratio wouldnt change , but if its easier to drive, it might be worth it.
hey... you could make a kit for it!!

Carl Fausett

The reason the switch-backs at Pikes Peak were so steering intensive is that the engine was at idle. It was very difficult to keep the throttle up while i was also braking and clutch was in. So, engine was basically at idle and I had to turn those big meats over FAST with that little bitty steering wheel :-)

The power steering fluid cavitated. A change to a better synthetic power steering fluid and the addition of an power steering fluid cooler fixed the cavitation.

Carl Fausett

uh-oh. sounds like another ****-measuring contest is in the offing... We are installing a digital dash this season and I will have absolute lateral G info to submit this summer. I have been measuring my lateral G's for several years, but the methods were always sketchy and unreliable. I saw 2.2 often enough. A very occasional 2.4 G lateral. But always wondered about the accuracy. With this new digital dash I will be inclined to believe what it reports.

but I do completely agree with this: They are a huge work out for me as well. It would surprise many guys if they knew how athletic a tough race in a fast car is!

Mark Anderson

I did convert to an electric pump off a 911 RSR. You can also use the Toyota MR2 pump which you might find at a pull your part for much less.

Carl Fausett

Good info. Thanks Mark!

hacker-pschorr

The MR2 pumps are very popular with the hot rod / replica car crowd. Super reliable and easy to use.

Here is a ready made kit for the Factory Five crowd:

http://www.fastfreddiesfabrications....p?id_product=4


The difficulty with running manual steering in a 928 is the factory never offered this option and I have yet to find a non-powered rack that we can substitute in. Taking the belt off is not the same as having a true manual steering rack.

I'm talking with XSChop about converting one of my 928 racks to manual. He's done this for the 944 crowd who prefer the converted power rack over the quicker ratio factory manual rack.

Another point with manual vs power steering is the alignment. To go manual you may want to reduce the caster which will lower the steering effort.
With my Factory Five Cobra the recommended caster with power steering is 6-12 degrees (most I see run 8-10). Without power steering 2-3 degrees is recommended for street cars.


Once I have a non-power rack I plan to play with caster settings. I'm not sure how adjustable a 928 is here so I'm also looking into making a pair of adjustable upper control arms like my Factory Five has which also has an adjustable upper ball joint for roll center adjustments.

mark kibort

no.. no measuring.. i would be a complete hack if i wasnt able to, based on 20 years of road racing vs you just getting rolling. Its not comparing driver to driver, its just a fact so that we can really compare forces on the car.
im running at a rate (based on any comparitive marker) of 10 seconds faster a lap.. and if you are at twice the hp i have... the difference is brakeing and g loading.
im sure you will be hitting the same G loading very soon base on the seat time you are getting. keep it up.... maybe we can do some testing together sometime!!!

and yes.... i would just about anyone i race close with , driving my car, would have no chance against me in theirs for that reason... the 928 is not an easy car to drive.. after driving almost every popular race/supercar at the track, i can tell you this with confidence!!

YES!! yes yes.. its one of the reasons you dont want to have the engine ever at idle , ever on the track. you need to keep the throttle up while braking and putting it in gears before turns...... I sense this at sears point (and this is the only track in california where this happens to a 2.2 928..... at turn 3-4 complex. very hard left and right turns with the RPM the lowest i ever go (just under 4krpm) anything lower , and a harder turn, and the turns are a bear to try and muscle around.

what are the trade offs and how hard to convert? what about current draw?

Carl Fausett

I dunno Mark, I haven't seen you at my race courses much... and I have never been to your tracks in CA so I'm not sure where you pull these comparables like you do. But never mind. Its off topic. this thread is not about driving or lateral G's. It's about something else - leave it that way.

Carl Fausett

Wow Hacker... $1,125? Looks like the 928 Power Steering is going to have to go a little longer...

http://www.fastfreddiesfabrications....p?id_product=4

hacker-pschorr

That's all brand new parts sold in a "turn key" kit.
You can find pumps for $300 or less. Make your own lines and harness while re-using the factory reservoir (the one in that kit is $110).

I've talked to guys who snagged one of those pumps at a local pick-n-pull for $50.