Just got 89 928 S4 auto, hasn't been started in a year, should I try?
05-29-2011, 07:28 AM
#1
3rd Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just got 89 928 S4 auto, hasn't been started in a year, should I try?
Just got my hands on a 1989 928 S4. Haven't paid anything yet for it. Owner did take care it and it was a drive every day to work vehicle for him. Last time it was started was about a year ago and he says it ran rough then. Prior to that, it hasn;t been started and has been sitting, outside, since 2005. I don't want to be over anxious and try to start it. I'm no expert on 928's, however, other than checking the fluids and cleaning contacts, what makes the decision on whether or not to try and start her up?
John
John
05-29-2011, 08:30 AM
#2
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Things to check:
- is the battery fully charged
- oil level
- coolant level
- take off the air hoses and look down the cam covers, see a belt there?
Then either:
1. Take out the fuel pump relay and turn the engine over until you see oil pressure building up. Replace relay and start her up, or
2. Rotate the engine by hand -clock wise-, you'll need a breaker bar and 27 or 34 socket (I forgot which), feel for any obstructions, then go to 1, or
3. Take out the spark plugs, add a tea spoon of oil to each cylinder, replace the spark plugs, then got to 2, then 1.
- is the battery fully charged
- oil level
- coolant level
- take off the air hoses and look down the cam covers, see a belt there?
Then either:
1. Take out the fuel pump relay and turn the engine over until you see oil pressure building up. Replace relay and start her up, or
2. Rotate the engine by hand -clock wise-, you'll need a breaker bar and 27 or 34 socket (I forgot which), feel for any obstructions, then go to 1, or
3. Take out the spark plugs, add a tea spoon of oil to each cylinder, replace the spark plugs, then got to 2, then 1.
05-29-2011, 11:34 AM
#5
Race Car
Just got my hands on a 1989 928 S4. Haven't paid anything yet for it. Owner did take care it and it was a drive every day to work vehicle for him. Last time it was started was about a year ago and he says it ran rough then. Prior to that, it hasn;t been started and has been sitting, outside, since 2005. I don't want to be over anxious and try to start it. I'm no expert on 928's, however, other than checking the fluids and cleaning contacts, what makes the decision on whether or not to try and start her up?
John
John
05-29-2011, 02:03 PM
#6
Under the Lift
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
I am a bit puzzled by the math. 1 year wouldn't concern me at all. Other than checking fluids and turning it over with the fuel pump fuse out, as Aryan suggested, I wouldn't see any problem starting it. It appears he's saying the car did sit for much longer at one time, and it ran rough the last time it was started. Good luck.
05-29-2011, 02:18 PM
#7
Drifting
You guys just need to put your reading glasses on.
Makes sense to me the it has been sitting out side since 2005 but has not been driven for a year. At lease thats the way I read it.
I would use Aryans method.
Brad
Makes sense to me the it has been sitting out side since 2005 but has not been driven for a year. At lease thats the way I read it.
I would use Aryans method.
Brad
Trending Topics
05-29-2011, 02:33 PM
#8
Rennlist Member
I've had a couple of these 32 V interference engine cars that were sitting.
Best practice, in my opinion: No, don't start it yet.
Do some assessments above and below.
Check the air inlet and filter for obstruction / mouse nests.
Remove alternator cooling hose and vac it.
Clean around plugs, vac holes out, and remove plugs ( insure nothing can fall back down holes / note if any plugs were submerged in oil)
Pull covers and check timing belt tension, condition (melts, missing teeth, rubber dust) and then move the engine with socket wrench to assess alignment of cam gear marks.
Pull the exhaust down, bell housing cover down, and check endplay.
Drain and refill oil / cut filter open and inspect.
Then consider working thru the precursors to starting === fuse panel remove / clean / re-fusing and new 53 relays; cap and rotor cleaning; special attention to coil ends where wires insert for corrosion.
In other words, get a baseline on its condition, preemptively do the non-monetary work needed to insure a successful first start, then consider starting it.
Best practice, in my opinion: No, don't start it yet.
Do some assessments above and below.
Check the air inlet and filter for obstruction / mouse nests.
Remove alternator cooling hose and vac it.
Clean around plugs, vac holes out, and remove plugs ( insure nothing can fall back down holes / note if any plugs were submerged in oil)
Pull covers and check timing belt tension, condition (melts, missing teeth, rubber dust) and then move the engine with socket wrench to assess alignment of cam gear marks.
Pull the exhaust down, bell housing cover down, and check endplay.
Drain and refill oil / cut filter open and inspect.
Then consider working thru the precursors to starting === fuse panel remove / clean / re-fusing and new 53 relays; cap and rotor cleaning; special attention to coil ends where wires insert for corrosion.
In other words, get a baseline on its condition, preemptively do the non-monetary work needed to insure a successful first start, then consider starting it.
05-29-2011, 09:24 PM
#9
3rd Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'll try and clarify some things. i didn't get much time to work on her today as I was cleaning her new home. I moved into my house 5 years ago, have a three car garage and couldn't walk in it. Needless to say, everything's in the driveway, floor is half painted and will finish it up tomorrow. I did manage to get a new battery today, some dry gas and Marvel Mystery Oil. I pulled all the fuses and tested them in the fuse tester in the panel. I tried to pull the fuel pump relay but it wouldn't come out and I stopped as I didn't want to snap it. I did check the air inlets, vacuumed them out and re connected. That's about it.
The car was parked in 2005, August I think and there it sat until last year, 2010, when the owner started it for a potential buyer. It ran rough, according to him and it sat for another year and now it's in my driveway. I will remove plugs tomorrow and see what else I can uncover. I will also try to move the engine with a socket wrench. I live in Brewster, Massachusetts on Cape Cod.
Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate it.
John
The car was parked in 2005, August I think and there it sat until last year, 2010, when the owner started it for a potential buyer. It ran rough, according to him and it sat for another year and now it's in my driveway. I will remove plugs tomorrow and see what else I can uncover. I will also try to move the engine with a socket wrench. I live in Brewster, Massachusetts on Cape Cod.
Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate it.
John
05-29-2011, 09:37 PM
#10
Rennlist Member
Northern car, sat outside?
New house?
Consider keeping it on the driveway until you check thoroughly for mice.
On 928, air filter, also, in and around heater box/fan at base of windshield, fuse box area, and especially under console side covers. And, under bell housing cover.
New house?
Consider keeping it on the driveway until you check thoroughly for mice.
On 928, air filter, also, in and around heater box/fan at base of windshield, fuse box area, and especially under console side covers. And, under bell housing cover.
05-29-2011, 09:55 PM
#12
Race Director
Using the 6 year old assumption.....I would drain EVERYTHING....fuel, coolant, trans, rear end, oil even power steering fluid and replace it..... chances are the fuel pump is a goner and take a good look at the Timing belt and all the other belts-hoses....
Once everything is fresh, install the battery and give it a shot!
Once everything is fresh, install the battery and give it a shot!
05-30-2011, 05:53 AM
#13
John,
A lot of good advice given above, however, you will have to do you own risk assessement of how much you wish to do before attempting to start.
Most important aspects in my opinion are:
1. Crankshaft end play and re clamping front flex plate. Other would recommend releasing the front and rear flexplate clamp and then retighten after clamp first and then retighten forward flexplate clamp. While you are in there at the forward flexplate checking the end play of crankshaft and after retigtening forward flexplate clamp, check that flexplate is actually flat, not bowed, then paint drive shaft spline adjacent to the clamp to allow for checking migration of clamp in future. As good insurance fit a PKlamp obtainable from Roger at www.928srus.com
2. Timing belt condition, as it is recommended it be changed at around 5 years regardless of mileage, as has been recommend by Chris.
3. Spark- plugs, leads, coils and earth connection. As the car has been outside for so long a period I would clean all earths before attempting to start. Inspect the spark plug holes prior to the removal of the spark plugs and if any oil present (you can see with a torch) get some rag on the end of a long screw drive and mop up the oil, as the last thing you want is the oil to drain back into the cylinder with entrapped dirt.
If you have a DMM (digital multimeter) I would recommend you check the resistances of the connections at both ends of the HT leads, the distributer caps etc., to see whether they are within Porsches' resistance specifications as given in the WSMs.
When plugs removed turn the engine by over by hand using a socket and T bar in a clockwise direction (standing at the front of the engine) to ensure that it is free to turn (at least 2 revolutions).
4. Fuel- You may need to add some fuel treatment or drain the fuel tank. Check the fuel pumps, intank and external for opertation. This can be done by jumping fuel pump relay (terminals 30 to 87). Many would recommend that the intank fuel pump is removed and filter cleaned and small section of internal hose connection is checked to see whether it is still in good condition and renew the external fuel filter. I would also recommend you check the fuel pressure within the fuel rails to see whether any fuel injectors are leaking. This requires the fitting of a pressure gauge to the passengers side fuel rail at the front end and time the leak down of fuel pressure. Again the specification of this for pressure and leakage over time is described in the WSMs. To ensure that the fuel pipes are in good order and condition some recommend that they be changed. IIRC the fuel pipe material was changed with the MY89 to a better grade of hose, however, this hose should not be bent as it is likely to crack. I would recommend that you check the front hose as a minimum between the two fuel rails as this hose does detoriate and the fuel pressure is over 3 bar and if you get a leak it can be a 928 BBQ.
5. Water-check level in reservoir and check for oil contamination in reservoir to see whether there is any leakage from oil ways, head gaskets into water passages.
6. Oil, engine and auto box, as the drive shaft is directly connected to the flywheel on the automatic cars, so when started the troque converter will drive the internals of the auto box when it is neutral or park. After 6 year I would change the oil and check the filter as suggested by Chris.
7. Electrial - As the car has been parked outside for around 6 years check whether the 14 plug connector on the passenger side of the engine bay at the front where the emergency jump start connector is located to see whether there is a cover over it. If cover is in place then the plug maybe OK, however, it would pay to remove the socket from the connector and check the pins and sockets are not corroded. Beware the pin connects can come out of the plug and it is easy to get the wires mixed up.
As suggested I would inspect the CE panel for water leakage onto it from the recirculating air vent directly above it as it causes corrosion. Again Chris has given you a heads-up in this area. Fuse and Relay drawing are available at 928 Specalists web site at www.928gt.com under their technical tips.
As previously suggested if you give you address there maybe some 928 owners nearby to assist you.
I there is and if any of them have a Bosch Hammer, a JDS Spanner or a DT928 diagnostic tester then they can carry out a diagnostic test prior to starting and then once running further checks can be done actuating many of the item installed on or about the engine, as your car was the first model fitted with a digital dash and diagnostic capabilities.
A lot of good comments were recently made in this forum regarding a car that had not been started for 15 year IIRC. Use the "search" function to locate this thread and remember the search function it is you best friend to find out this and any other information.
Don't rush the inspections, as the Chinese say "Slowly slowly catchie Monkey". Be slow and methodical and you will get it started without causing any damage.
Keep the members of this forum posted as you proceed and you will get a lot of help and advice and don't forget to thank them when they post it.
Tails 1990 928S4 Auto
A lot of good advice given above, however, you will have to do you own risk assessement of how much you wish to do before attempting to start.
Most important aspects in my opinion are:
1. Crankshaft end play and re clamping front flex plate. Other would recommend releasing the front and rear flexplate clamp and then retighten after clamp first and then retighten forward flexplate clamp. While you are in there at the forward flexplate checking the end play of crankshaft and after retigtening forward flexplate clamp, check that flexplate is actually flat, not bowed, then paint drive shaft spline adjacent to the clamp to allow for checking migration of clamp in future. As good insurance fit a PKlamp obtainable from Roger at www.928srus.com
2. Timing belt condition, as it is recommended it be changed at around 5 years regardless of mileage, as has been recommend by Chris.
3. Spark- plugs, leads, coils and earth connection. As the car has been outside for so long a period I would clean all earths before attempting to start. Inspect the spark plug holes prior to the removal of the spark plugs and if any oil present (you can see with a torch) get some rag on the end of a long screw drive and mop up the oil, as the last thing you want is the oil to drain back into the cylinder with entrapped dirt.
If you have a DMM (digital multimeter) I would recommend you check the resistances of the connections at both ends of the HT leads, the distributer caps etc., to see whether they are within Porsches' resistance specifications as given in the WSMs.
When plugs removed turn the engine by over by hand using a socket and T bar in a clockwise direction (standing at the front of the engine) to ensure that it is free to turn (at least 2 revolutions).
4. Fuel- You may need to add some fuel treatment or drain the fuel tank. Check the fuel pumps, intank and external for opertation. This can be done by jumping fuel pump relay (terminals 30 to 87). Many would recommend that the intank fuel pump is removed and filter cleaned and small section of internal hose connection is checked to see whether it is still in good condition and renew the external fuel filter. I would also recommend you check the fuel pressure within the fuel rails to see whether any fuel injectors are leaking. This requires the fitting of a pressure gauge to the passengers side fuel rail at the front end and time the leak down of fuel pressure. Again the specification of this for pressure and leakage over time is described in the WSMs. To ensure that the fuel pipes are in good order and condition some recommend that they be changed. IIRC the fuel pipe material was changed with the MY89 to a better grade of hose, however, this hose should not be bent as it is likely to crack. I would recommend that you check the front hose as a minimum between the two fuel rails as this hose does detoriate and the fuel pressure is over 3 bar and if you get a leak it can be a 928 BBQ.
5. Water-check level in reservoir and check for oil contamination in reservoir to see whether there is any leakage from oil ways, head gaskets into water passages.
6. Oil, engine and auto box, as the drive shaft is directly connected to the flywheel on the automatic cars, so when started the troque converter will drive the internals of the auto box when it is neutral or park. After 6 year I would change the oil and check the filter as suggested by Chris.
7. Electrial - As the car has been parked outside for around 6 years check whether the 14 plug connector on the passenger side of the engine bay at the front where the emergency jump start connector is located to see whether there is a cover over it. If cover is in place then the plug maybe OK, however, it would pay to remove the socket from the connector and check the pins and sockets are not corroded. Beware the pin connects can come out of the plug and it is easy to get the wires mixed up.
As suggested I would inspect the CE panel for water leakage onto it from the recirculating air vent directly above it as it causes corrosion. Again Chris has given you a heads-up in this area. Fuse and Relay drawing are available at 928 Specalists web site at www.928gt.com under their technical tips.
As previously suggested if you give you address there maybe some 928 owners nearby to assist you.
I there is and if any of them have a Bosch Hammer, a JDS Spanner or a DT928 diagnostic tester then they can carry out a diagnostic test prior to starting and then once running further checks can be done actuating many of the item installed on or about the engine, as your car was the first model fitted with a digital dash and diagnostic capabilities.
A lot of good comments were recently made in this forum regarding a car that had not been started for 15 year IIRC. Use the "search" function to locate this thread and remember the search function it is you best friend to find out this and any other information.
Don't rush the inspections, as the Chinese say "Slowly slowly catchie Monkey". Be slow and methodical and you will get it started without causing any damage.
Keep the members of this forum posted as you proceed and you will get a lot of help and advice and don't forget to thank them when they post it.
Tails 1990 928S4 Auto
05-30-2011, 09:49 AM
#14
3rd Gear
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thank you to all who replied to my post. I'm a bit fuzzy on the abbreviations used but I'm sure I can figure them out. I will let you know on the outcome as ti willtake me a while to run all the steps. Until then...