Anyone using 928 Motorsports upper control arm?
03-22-2011, 04:56 PM
#46
Under the Lift
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Good cartoon, Michael. 
And Carl, you're right, you shouldn't be faulted for responding to attacks, even just inuendo. It would be better if they just didn't happen. To their credit, I have never seen Dave Roberts, Mark Anderson, or Roger ever initiate any attacks or make disparaging remarks about others, and I guess you too for that matter, but they usually find a way to defuse the situation if they are attacked. It takes all kinds, and I understand some people are just, um, more "passionate" about these things. If I had my way, this place would be more friendly and probably pretty boring. Conflict is to be expected and needs to be tolerated at least to some extent, but at some point it just drives a lot of good people away, and open hostility between vendors really undermines the purpose of this message board.
Anyway, I hope the OP gets some satisfaction and I don't blame him for posting here. Your replies are all seem logical and follow your rules, but sometimes these rules just don't work and insisting on following them does more harm than good.
And Carl, you're right, you shouldn't be faulted for responding to attacks, even just inuendo. It would be better if they just didn't happen. To their credit, I have never seen Dave Roberts, Mark Anderson, or Roger ever initiate any attacks or make disparaging remarks about others, and I guess you too for that matter, but they usually find a way to defuse the situation if they are attacked. It takes all kinds, and I understand some people are just, um, more "passionate" about these things. If I had my way, this place would be more friendly and probably pretty boring. Conflict is to be expected and needs to be tolerated at least to some extent, but at some point it just drives a lot of good people away, and open hostility between vendors really undermines the purpose of this message board.Anyway, I hope the OP gets some satisfaction and I don't blame him for posting here. Your replies are all seem logical and follow your rules, but sometimes these rules just don't work and insisting on following them does more harm than good.
03-22-2011, 05:28 PM
#48
I completely agree.
A moderator should kick Greg off this thread - it does not involve him. His posts seek only to inflame and add nothing to the discussion.
I do not post on Greg's threads as a professional courtesy, even tho he does not afford me the same courtesy.
But I will not appologise for responding when attacked. I am sorry to be one of the parties involved and wish it were not so.
A moderator should kick Greg off this thread - it does not involve him. His posts seek only to inflame and add nothing to the discussion.
I do not post on Greg's threads as a professional courtesy, even tho he does not afford me the same courtesy.
But I will not appologise for responding when attacked. I am sorry to be one of the parties involved and wish it were not so.
My only comment other than that is this: If someone wishes to live by the internet - then they should understand the flip side - dying by the internet as well.
You basically, as we have seen before, get one shot online.
03-22-2011, 05:42 PM
#49
In general, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar. Pissing on another vendor's wares or badmouthing the competition is generally not a good way to conduct business. Gotta give props to Carl (and others) for this.
I don't see "Sponsor" or "Small Business" under Greg's name, and maybe that's the issue. He is a vendor of sorts, but not to the masses and does not [directly] market his wares here - that I've seen.
So what constitutes being a vendor? It's kind of like the Supreme Court and Pornography, "I know it when I see it." Is that the case here?
I don't see "Sponsor" or "Small Business" under Greg's name, and maybe that's the issue. He is a vendor of sorts, but not to the masses and does not [directly] market his wares here - that I've seen.
So what constitutes being a vendor? It's kind of like the Supreme Court and Pornography, "I know it when I see it." Is that the case here?
A vendor advertises and sells his/her wares here.
Champagne, Roger, Mark A, and of course Carl. Advertise their stuff - and post online about what is on sale this month or day.
A simple member - you, I, or Greg are contributors to others' issues, problems, and also ask for help. Some of us may have ideas as to how to assist the community. I am in insurance and you... Do whatever (I'm honestly not sure) - I do not pay vendor fees, and neither do you. Greg is a contributor here and contributes just as you or I would. He has a business, just like you or I. He writes about it occasionally but does not specifically advertise as Carl or Roger, or Mark A do.
If this site is going to require every Tom dick and harry to pay vendor fees when they wish to sell something here and there, even if their business is automotive, insurance, or widget refrigeration, then they will lose. We will lose the valuable, fact-laiden contributions of people like Greg, Louie, Z, you, or similar. What we will be left with is people who need the help, and people who only are here to sell, and not contribute (selling is not contributing - and I am sales) EDUCATION is contribution. And we get our education from this community - from this economic ecosystem.
[/COLOR]
03-22-2011, 06:19 PM
#50
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Carl,
First of all are you delusional? If the part wasn’t defective why on the return receipt I received from you it stated “repair”. Not only that the original video I posted a few pages back is pretty detrimental to your case, wouldn’t you say?
It’s pretty obvious you have no intention of being REASONABLE. For me to pay a restocking fee on defective parts you sent me is at best, laughable. The fact of the matter is I paid for working control arms and when I received them they were defective (both videos as proof). You are now strong arming me in either taking a worthless in store credit (like I want anything from you after this), refund plus restocking fee, or another repair. Laughable!
I wish you lots of luck in your business venture, but one piece of advice I wouldn’t treat my customers this way! I tried to reason with you but your not willing to be sensible. Sooner or later Carl is going to realize the internet and word of mouth is a powerful tool!
Over the years Rennlist has gotten extremely popular, so much so you can consider it brand or household name when it comes to online forums. If I was the owner of this site, I would be rethinking my involvement with this company 928 Motorsports. It’s pretty obvious I’m not the first, nor the last person that has been treated as such. This will be the first time ever that I have been burned by a rennlist sponsor. Being a rennlist site sponsor isn’t what it use to be... I’m very upset by the outcome of this.
BUYER BEWARE OF 928 MOTORSPORTS
First of all are you delusional? If the part wasn’t defective why on the return receipt I received from you it stated “repair”. Not only that the original video I posted a few pages back is pretty detrimental to your case, wouldn’t you say?
It’s pretty obvious you have no intention of being REASONABLE. For me to pay a restocking fee on defective parts you sent me is at best, laughable. The fact of the matter is I paid for working control arms and when I received them they were defective (both videos as proof). You are now strong arming me in either taking a worthless in store credit (like I want anything from you after this), refund plus restocking fee, or another repair. Laughable!
I wish you lots of luck in your business venture, but one piece of advice I wouldn’t treat my customers this way! I tried to reason with you but your not willing to be sensible. Sooner or later Carl is going to realize the internet and word of mouth is a powerful tool!
Over the years Rennlist has gotten extremely popular, so much so you can consider it brand or household name when it comes to online forums. If I was the owner of this site, I would be rethinking my involvement with this company 928 Motorsports. It’s pretty obvious I’m not the first, nor the last person that has been treated as such. This will be the first time ever that I have been burned by a rennlist sponsor. Being a rennlist site sponsor isn’t what it use to be... I’m very upset by the outcome of this.
BUYER BEWARE OF 928 MOTORSPORTS
Last edited by Dan87951; 03-22-2011 at 07:48 PM.
03-22-2011, 06:45 PM
#51
Developer
Dan, I have tried to be reasonable with your requests and have tried to fullfill every one to the best of our ability.
I have offered you replacement parts, a full store credit and even a refund less a nominal restocking fee.
Now I see that you have stooped to name-calling. Great.
You did threaten in a private email that unless you got your way you would smear us on the Rennlist. I do not respond well to threats. Now that you have taken this direction, am I still supposed to help you?
I have offered you replacement parts, a full store credit and even a refund less a nominal restocking fee.
Now I see that you have stooped to name-calling. Great.
You did threaten in a private email that unless you got your way you would smear us on the Rennlist. I do not respond well to threats. Now that you have taken this direction, am I still supposed to help you?
03-22-2011, 06:50 PM
#52
Nordschleife Master
I am curious as to know how he was to know these were defective without first installing them?
As well if the product is bad right off the get go and decides to go a different route, he should not be held at fault on this.
As well if the product is bad right off the get go and decides to go a different route, he should not be held at fault on this.
03-22-2011, 06:52 PM
#53
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Dan, I have tried to be reasonable with your requests and have tried to fullfill every one to the best of our ability.
I have offered you replacement parts, a full store credit and even a refund less a nominal restocking fee.
Now I see that you have stooped to name-calling. Great.
You did threaten in a private email that unless you got your way you would smear us on the Rennlist. I do not respond well to threats. Now that you have taken this direction, am I still supposed to help you?
I have offered you replacement parts, a full store credit and even a refund less a nominal restocking fee.
Now I see that you have stooped to name-calling. Great.
You did threaten in a private email that unless you got your way you would smear us on the Rennlist. I do not respond well to threats. Now that you have taken this direction, am I still supposed to help you?
WHAT???? Please post this email where I "threaten" you and claimed I would "smear" you on rennlist... The only thing that has been posted on this forum and in email are the facts Carl!
Wow, have you really gone that low...
Please provide this email Carl that you speak of!
03-22-2011, 06:52 PM
#54
I honestly did not forsee it going THAT way.
Dan - I did want to mention - I have a copy write on that color red...
I'll need you to switch it topurple
THANKS!
Dan - I did want to mention - I have a copy write on that color red...
I'll need you to switch it topurple
THANKS!
03-22-2011, 06:53 PM
#55
Rest in Peace
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All I can say is that in the very few times I have had a customer not happy, they got all the money back and I took my parts back, seems pretty simple to me.
03-22-2011, 06:57 PM
#56
Developer
at your request:
and my response:
Carl,
I’m not interested in arguing back and forth. I didn’t get what I paid for and you had ample opportunity to make things right when I original placed the order and sent the video of both arms. You never mentioned anything might be wrong with the second arm. You can either do the right thing and offer me a refund which I will let the rennlist community know or you can continue to state there is nothing wrong with the parts and I will reverse the charges on my credit card. That simple.
The first exchange was necessary because the part was frozen solid as the video shows while the other moved fine. Obviously something was binding inside there because when we got it back it was at least moveable! So like I said before I don't buy the we greased them and sent them back.
Well duh.. of course the parts have been installed, that’s how we found out the other arm was defective, because once the control arm was loaded up you could feel the slop. There are still zero miles on them.
I have wasted enough time on these and want a refund. What is so hard to understand about that? Offer me the refund and im a happy customer.
Dan
I’m not interested in arguing back and forth. I didn’t get what I paid for and you had ample opportunity to make things right when I original placed the order and sent the video of both arms. You never mentioned anything might be wrong with the second arm. You can either do the right thing and offer me a refund which I will let the rennlist community know or you can continue to state there is nothing wrong with the parts and I will reverse the charges on my credit card. That simple.
The first exchange was necessary because the part was frozen solid as the video shows while the other moved fine. Obviously something was binding inside there because when we got it back it was at least moveable! So like I said before I don't buy the we greased them and sent them back.
Well duh.. of course the parts have been installed, that’s how we found out the other arm was defective, because once the control arm was loaded up you could feel the slop. There are still zero miles on them.
I have wasted enough time on these and want a refund. What is so hard to understand about that? Offer me the refund and im a happy customer.
Dan
I understand you are upset at the inconvenience of removing and installing the parts. I would be too.
However, I want to politely remind you that the first exchange was unnecessary.
Had you returned the parts before they were installed, you would have received a complete refund - no questions asked.
But, our policy once the parts have been installed is to repair or replace that part under our product warranty. This is no different than any other manufacturer. I have, in the spirit of good customer relations, also went beyond that and said that we would permit a return for in-store credit if you like.
Please afford me the opportunity to inspect and/or the piece that you feel is defective.
Yes, I will pay for the shipping.
Carl
However, I want to politely remind you that the first exchange was unnecessary.
Had you returned the parts before they were installed, you would have received a complete refund - no questions asked.
But, our policy once the parts have been installed is to repair or replace that part under our product warranty. This is no different than any other manufacturer. I have, in the spirit of good customer relations, also went beyond that and said that we would permit a return for in-store credit if you like.
Please afford me the opportunity to inspect and/or the piece that you feel is defective.
Yes, I will pay for the shipping.
Carl
03-22-2011, 07:07 PM
#57
This is not a leather wallet that does not work well. This is an integral piece of a performance suspension which is quite difficult and involved to install, let alone Take out again and return in the hopes that you can get it back and it will work once you have again reinstalled. The shaft clearance is probably too much, and will not fully show this until the suspension together and weighted. Therefore there is no way to figure out if it works or not until you install it.
03-22-2011, 07:14 PM
#58
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Carl.. Thank you for PROVING my point!
Again, where is the email in which I threaten to smear your name? If you're referring to the line, "You can either do the right thing and offer me a refund which I will let the rennlist community know or you can continue to state there is nothing wrong with the parts and I will reverse the charges on my credit card", you completely misunderstood. What I would let the "rennlist community know" is that you are a stand-up guy who refunded my money like any good business owner should. No smearing. The second part means that I will take it up with my credit card company to get the charges reversed. Again, no smearing.[B]
And, yes, you are still supposed to help me.
Give me my money back, please.[/B]
Again, where is the email in which I threaten to smear your name? If you're referring to the line, "You can either do the right thing and offer me a refund which I will let the rennlist community know or you can continue to state there is nothing wrong with the parts and I will reverse the charges on my credit card", you completely misunderstood. What I would let the "rennlist community know" is that you are a stand-up guy who refunded my money like any good business owner should. No smearing. The second part means that I will take it up with my credit card company to get the charges reversed. Again, no smearing.[B]
And, yes, you are still supposed to help me.
Give me my money back, please.[/B]
03-22-2011, 07:16 PM
#59
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
This is not a leather wallet that does not work well. This is an integral piece of a performance suspension which is quite difficult and involved to install, let alone Take out again and return in the hopes that you can get it back and it will work once you have again reinstalled. The shaft clearance is probably too much, and will not fully show this until the suspension together and weighted. Therefore there is no way to figure out if it works or not until you install it.
03-22-2011, 07:26 PM
#60
Developer
I dont disagree. You probably would not know it is defective or not until it is installed.
But you cannot expect, because you are a Rennlist member, that the published store policies
http://www.928motorsports.com/policies.php
don't apply to you.
You cannot expect to buy car parts, install them, and then say "I want my money back".
It does not work like that. If I take a car part into my local auto parts store after it has been installed and say "its no good"- they give me another one.... I don't get my money back.
...and thats what I was trying to do.
Failing that, I have offered (beyond our policies) to accept his return for a full in-store credit, and then I offered (also beyond our policies) to give him a cash refund less a nominal restocking fee. I have also offered a credit to him for his shipping back the part that was not defective!
Listen, I am responsible for the part. No question. But that isn't to say the customer has no responsibility here.
1) the customer should expect the company to follow the store policy guidlines should there be a problem.
2) the customer saying "the part is defective" does not mean its defective. Perhaps it is, or perhaps the ball joint is lose, the wheel bearing is improperly adjusted, its installed incorrectly, or it was damaged in shipment. Whatever - the customer should expect to work with the supplier to a resolution as defined in the published store policies.
But I have not been given the opportunity to inspect my part, but rather, a full refund was demanded or else. And thats what brought us here.
Return the part you are concerned about. We will repair or replace it.
But you cannot expect, because you are a Rennlist member, that the published store policies
http://www.928motorsports.com/policies.php
don't apply to you.
You cannot expect to buy car parts, install them, and then say "I want my money back".
It does not work like that. If I take a car part into my local auto parts store after it has been installed and say "its no good"- they give me another one.... I don't get my money back.
...and thats what I was trying to do.
Failing that, I have offered (beyond our policies) to accept his return for a full in-store credit, and then I offered (also beyond our policies) to give him a cash refund less a nominal restocking fee. I have also offered a credit to him for his shipping back the part that was not defective!
Listen, I am responsible for the part. No question. But that isn't to say the customer has no responsibility here.
1) the customer should expect the company to follow the store policy guidlines should there be a problem.
2) the customer saying "the part is defective" does not mean its defective. Perhaps it is, or perhaps the ball joint is lose, the wheel bearing is improperly adjusted, its installed incorrectly, or it was damaged in shipment. Whatever - the customer should expect to work with the supplier to a resolution as defined in the published store policies.
But I have not been given the opportunity to inspect my part, but rather, a full refund was demanded or else. And thats what brought us here.
Return the part you are concerned about. We will repair or replace it.