My son's 1980 repaint begins.
05-23-2010, 09:37 PM
#91
Rest in Peace
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You will have to go a lot past 600 to get the scratches out and they will show up in the final paint if you do not.
They show up in mine after a year when the paint shrunk, it was glass smooth after color sanding and buffing.
I need to try to get it to the body shop before SITM.
I am at the point that my car is going to have to go in front of other folks cars.
They show up in mine after a year when the paint shrunk, it was glass smooth after color sanding and buffing.
I need to try to get it to the body shop before SITM.
I am at the point that my car is going to have to go in front of other folks cars.
05-23-2010, 10:00 PM
#92
Dean,
This is a good site to seek for paint advice: http://www.autobodysupply.net/Articles.asp?ID=139
http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/body-exterior/
Some good pointers here: http://www.autobodysupply.net/Articles.asp?ID=139
This is a good site to seek for paint advice: http://www.autobodysupply.net/Articles.asp?ID=139
http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/body-exterior/
Some good pointers here: http://www.autobodysupply.net/Articles.asp?ID=139
05-23-2010, 10:27 PM
#93
Drifting
The only way the scratches in the last picture could be fro 600 grit is if the 600 grit is dirty and clogged. If that's the case, you're not rinsing enough.
Now that you've gone back over it with 120 and 220 you've gone a long way to get the body straight. Everywhere you have bare metal showing is a high spot. What you can do is mix a small batch of epoxy and spray it on the areas of exposed metal. Clean the gun. You need to apply more 2K. You can do 2-4 more coats. You need the epoxy on the exposed metal because it adheres to metal much better than the 2K. You need more 2K because after sanding with 120 and 220 you've removed most of what's there, and there's not enough material left for you to get rid of the sand scratches.
1. Clean.
2. Apply epoxy to exposed metal.
3. Apply 2-4 additional coats of 2K.
4. The more you apply, the coarser your first round of blocking can be. If you go with 3 or 4 coats, start with 320. If you only do 2-3, then start at 500/600 wet.
5. After 600, you can go to 800 wet.
Now that you've gone back over it with 120 and 220 you've gone a long way to get the body straight. Everywhere you have bare metal showing is a high spot. What you can do is mix a small batch of epoxy and spray it on the areas of exposed metal. Clean the gun. You need to apply more 2K. You can do 2-4 more coats. You need the epoxy on the exposed metal because it adheres to metal much better than the 2K. You need more 2K because after sanding with 120 and 220 you've removed most of what's there, and there's not enough material left for you to get rid of the sand scratches.
1. Clean.
2. Apply epoxy to exposed metal.
3. Apply 2-4 additional coats of 2K.
4. The more you apply, the coarser your first round of blocking can be. If you go with 3 or 4 coats, start with 320. If you only do 2-3, then start at 500/600 wet.
5. After 600, you can go to 800 wet.
05-24-2010, 01:18 AM
#94
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The only thing that I can say from my experience is that you have to keep wiping the block with a sponge, sponge water on the area and block sand. You have to be careful sanding. It is not like using a DA which I didn't use. All by hand and time consuming.
Not sure what you mean by a guide coat. A guide coat, I was taught, is applied after the primer has been block sanded and you think it is ready for paint but the fun is really just beginning. Then you apply a thin coat of paint and cover the whole car. Then block sand ALL of the paint off unti you are at the primer again.
In my case I did it twice to get it just right. The first time I painted the car green and the second time I painted it in purple. After block wet sanding the second coat of paint off she was as flat and straight as I was capanle of getteing her! Very happy to be finally ready for paint. The other frustrating part for me was taping the car up every time just to pull it off and do it again. It took me a while to learn how to tape around a cormer, a key hole/ Your prior work will make this process easier.
When it is done it will be worth it, knowing that you did it and not someone else. It will also blow away any 400 dollar job! When you get compliments on your car it's nice to say you did it and see the look on there face!
Not sure what you mean by a guide coat. A guide coat, I was taught, is applied after the primer has been block sanded and you think it is ready for paint but the fun is really just beginning. Then you apply a thin coat of paint and cover the whole car. Then block sand ALL of the paint off unti you are at the primer again.
In my case I did it twice to get it just right. The first time I painted the car green and the second time I painted it in purple. After block wet sanding the second coat of paint off she was as flat and straight as I was capanle of getteing her! Very happy to be finally ready for paint. The other frustrating part for me was taping the car up every time just to pull it off and do it again. It took me a while to learn how to tape around a cormer, a key hole/ Your prior work will make this process easier.
When it is done it will be worth it, knowing that you did it and not someone else. It will also blow away any 400 dollar job! When you get compliments on your car it's nice to say you did it and see the look on there face!
05-24-2010, 01:51 AM
#95
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Dean - kudos to your hard work! I'm probably jumping ahead but I'm in the midst of getting ready to do a complete paint of MY87 S4 (but by a paint shop). What are your plans when reinstalling everything related to seals and trim? I've just priced that out and I'm still choking over sticker shock!
05-24-2010, 08:25 PM
#97
Drifting
Thread Starter
5-24-10
Re shot the main body and door jambs with epoxy primer after blocking the 2K primer as best I could. The driver side has more orange peel than I would like. The passenger side I turned the air pressure up 10 PSI and turned the material flow back a bit. The orange peel in better but still there. The epoxy goes on more like paint...very shiny and I noticed on the passenger side there are a few places that are not flat. So I have that to fix. The the door jambs I am very pleased with. They look great. I will not even sand those I think.
I know this is dragging out like a bad novel...but I hope this will help others ( maybe what NOT to do ) that want to tackle this job in the future.
Re shot the main body and door jambs with epoxy primer after blocking the 2K primer as best I could. The driver side has more orange peel than I would like. The passenger side I turned the air pressure up 10 PSI and turned the material flow back a bit. The orange peel in better but still there. The epoxy goes on more like paint...very shiny and I noticed on the passenger side there are a few places that are not flat. So I have that to fix. The the door jambs I am very pleased with. They look great. I will not even sand those I think.
I know this is dragging out like a bad novel...but I hope this will help others ( maybe what NOT to do ) that want to tackle this job in the future.
05-24-2010, 10:00 PM
#98
Nordschleife Master
Dean, this is NOT dragging and it would be/IS a GREAT NOVEL! Man, this is the kind of thing that CAN NOT BE RUSHED!!! You are really doing this right, and I am more impressed than I can express here!
05-24-2010, 10:07 PM
#99
Drifting
Thread Starter
Thanks James...as much work as this is it would be a sin for the final job to be sub par. Maybe when I'm done and IF the job looks well above average ..I will condense this to a usable formate. I have already learned a lot and its not even base coat pained yet. Lots more to come.
05-25-2010, 08:41 AM
#103
Rennlist Member
hi, great post, I have done my old Alfetta GTAM , bare metal ,so I bow to your effort!
I note that you clean with lacquer thinners. Doesn't this melt the paint?
I know it did for me, you can't rub ,just wipe.
I use [ was recommeneded by th epaint shop] 'prepsolve' or 'wax and grease remover'. You wipe on with one rag and wipe off dry with another. It cleans but doesn't melt the paint. You can nearly scrub the paint. Then use a tac rag to remove dust.
About to attack/paint the media blasted fairings from my Ducati 907, so I am enjoying the refresher course, well done
nigel
I note that you clean with lacquer thinners. Doesn't this melt the paint?
I know it did for me, you can't rub ,just wipe.
I use [ was recommeneded by th epaint shop] 'prepsolve' or 'wax and grease remover'. You wipe on with one rag and wipe off dry with another. It cleans but doesn't melt the paint. You can nearly scrub the paint. Then use a tac rag to remove dust.
About to attack/paint the media blasted fairings from my Ducati 907, so I am enjoying the refresher course, well done
nigel
05-25-2010, 10:48 AM
#104
Man of many SIGs
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Dean,
I appologize for not responding sooner. I didn't see your post about getting out the scratches after 600 grit. You shouldn't see those scratches after wet blocking with 600. I will include a picture of my rear quarter after wet blocking with 600 grit. It is completely dry in this picture but looks a little glossy. JHowell makes a good point, you may have trash in your paper or something similar. I also know that pro's have a preference for certain brands of paper vs others due to quality and ease of use. 3m is a good brand and they have a few different grades of quality I believe. Maybe PM Kevin Michael or Sonett over on Pelican.
I appologize for not responding sooner. I didn't see your post about getting out the scratches after 600 grit. You shouldn't see those scratches after wet blocking with 600. I will include a picture of my rear quarter after wet blocking with 600 grit. It is completely dry in this picture but looks a little glossy. JHowell makes a good point, you may have trash in your paper or something similar. I also know that pro's have a preference for certain brands of paper vs others due to quality and ease of use. 3m is a good brand and they have a few different grades of quality I believe. Maybe PM Kevin Michael or Sonett over on Pelican.
05-26-2010, 09:37 PM
#105
Drifting
Thread Starter
5-26-10
GOOD NEWS! Although I did waste ALL day and I'm no further to Paint than I was days ago. The ORANGE PEEL practically is gone. After re-sanding the orange peel out of the passenger rear fender and wet sanding AGAIN with 600, I re shot the epoxy with my "primer gun" ( regular siphon type ) . I adjusted the material down as far as I could and still get a "wet coat" down and the orange peel was back. After taking photos down to the paint store and talking with the DuPont guys they all suggested it MAY be the gun I was using for primer ( new bought from them days earlier for $50 ). So...I went home and prepared the driver rear fender for round 2 of "how to waste primer and money at the same time." I broke out my brand new HVLP gun I was saving for base and clear. The difference is night and day.
The finish is smooth with no peel. Wow. If I had done this last week I would be tons further down the road. Moral of the story is if you are shooting epoxy primer...shoot out of a "paint worthy" gun. Also the primer gun has a 1.8mm tip where as the paint gun has a 1.4mm....what a difference.
GOOD NEWS! Although I did waste ALL day and I'm no further to Paint than I was days ago. The ORANGE PEEL practically is gone. After re-sanding the orange peel out of the passenger rear fender and wet sanding AGAIN with 600, I re shot the epoxy with my "primer gun" ( regular siphon type ) . I adjusted the material down as far as I could and still get a "wet coat" down and the orange peel was back. After taking photos down to the paint store and talking with the DuPont guys they all suggested it MAY be the gun I was using for primer ( new bought from them days earlier for $50 ). So...I went home and prepared the driver rear fender for round 2 of "how to waste primer and money at the same time." I broke out my brand new HVLP gun I was saving for base and clear. The difference is night and day.
The finish is smooth with no peel. Wow. If I had done this last week I would be tons further down the road. Moral of the story is if you are shooting epoxy primer...shoot out of a "paint worthy" gun. Also the primer gun has a 1.8mm tip where as the paint gun has a 1.4mm....what a difference.
Last edited by Dean_Fuller; 05-26-2010 at 09:58 PM.