Tampa 928s

I could not unlock my drivers door and pulled everything apart. I could see the the lock would turn when disconnected. I tried to use the non-alarm key the short one and I can lock and unlock the door but it will not arm the alarm. The large alarm key will not turn at all although the small key works on the other locks. Any idea what is going on?
The windows are next this car is a nightmare!

Ron_H

Has this situation just begun or has it always been this way?? Or did you just rekey your locks?

Tampa 928s

Well I just bought this 82 so I don't know but considering the small key works on the other locks I would say they have not been changed. But who knows!!!!!!
The car did have an after market alarm that was taken out before I purchased it.

928ntslow

Yea...what Ron said! I just rehabbed an 85 that was broken into and vandalized. Not to mention the screwed up contacts at the back of the lock cylinder to arm and disarm. I have been intimately involved with rebuilding these things and rekeying of late.

You need to give us more info. Is it just one door that the long key does not work in? does it work in the ignition? The short key is most likely your valet key. Did you compare the short and long key to see if they have the same 4 sided cut? You need to be as descriptive as possible to allow us to help you. Are you sure there is a factory alarm?

Ron_H

+1 I have suffered the process too of rekeying all the locks, and when I got my keys back, the long ones would not operate any of the locks but one door.
The short ones worked in all locks too. I happened to be passing by 928 Intl one day on my way home to Sunnyvale, (400 miles away ! I like to take long drives now and then....!) and Jim took my long key and put it on his magic grinder which removed some material and it worked just fine in the hatch lock. It never worked in the doors or ignition. I suggest that you remove one cylinder and get a file and go to work on the long key to reshape the end (last few millimeters) of the key to match the cylinder shape. You'll need to guess at how to shape it. Once you have the cylinder out, you can see the extended cylinder which might help. If you get the hatch cylinder out it will be easier than the ignition or door locks to change. Be careful not to break the contact on the end of the lock cylinder that actuates the alarm. It is copper and bends easily. Also, keep a magnet handy to remove the tiny screws that hold the wiring and connector to the end of the cylinder, and keep them in a handy place for later retrieval. Don't lose them. If you can't manage to make the long key work, PM me and I know a great locksmith in San Francisco that can make it work if you send him your cylinder and both keys (short and long). Expensive but it is done correctly. Put a black plug in the hole where the hatch lock was while it is in transit so no one will know the lock isn't there. (or leave a poisonous snake in your car overnight).

Ron_H

From what you describe it seems the PO has changed the locks and the rekey was only done to accomodate the short key. Or the new locks were supplied with only a short key. Does the long key penetrate fully into the locks, or only as far in as the short key? Maybe the PO only installed short key cylinders when and if he changed locks. The longer cylinders are very expensive. If you need to replace them, try Partsheaven in Hayward, CA. They are reasonably inexpensive. I found a hatch lock w/alarm key for $50. Now all I need to do is match my lonk key for the other locks to that cylinder. Until then I carry two keys.

928ntslow

To add to what Ron had said, there are tiny springs that are located directly in the middle of the alarm contact at the back of the cylinder. When you remove the thin long philips head screws, hold the keyside of the lock cylinder up with the alarm contact down...OVER a bench with a towel or something. These spring LOVE to disappear!!! Gently work the contact side off knowing that you should not pull it straight off or you will damage the contact Ron had mentioned. You want to separate the rubber gasket from the contact plug and keep it on the lock cylinder side as it will bend that contact. The spring makes the ground connection to this contact when the set up is put together. As you turn the key left or right, the thin copper contact touches the inset round contacts pressed into the plug. I had found that someone had been into the locks at one time a and a couple of them did not have the springs. Hence there was no contact in the alarm plugs and the alarm would go off depending on which door I opened.

ANYWAY, none of this means anything if you don't have a factory alarm. I meant to ask, does the long key slide all the way into the lock cylinder??? If not, you do not have a factory alarm and you need to toss the key...and this whole conversation is pointless.

Tampa 928s

Humm, The all keys "alarm and valet" work on all the locks so it is just related to this drivers door, can it be a bad cylinder lock I hate to remove it for no reason. It seems like there is an arm connected to the cylinder but it will not allow me to remove it all the way out to disconnect it. I'm afraid if I disconnect it I will be in a worse case scenario. Is there a way to tackle this I could bring the lock to a lock smith but not sure how I should proceed.

Ron_H

Pull the lock out as far as it will come from the outside face of the door. Then use a small bladed screw driver or extra small open end wrench to pry loose the ball on the end of the arm holding the lock cylinder to the other "stuff" in their. You will pry the ball free from the female end. Then you may remove the cylinder. Look in with a small flashlight to examine how it is held, and remember how to re-install it. Once you figure it out it is simple and you'll be able to do it quickly. It is like a bell crank on a weber carb linkage. I presume you have found the allen screw holding the cylinder to the door in the door jamb. Careful not to loose the washer under that screw for it controls how far into the cylinder the screw is screwed.

Then you can have access to the entire cylinder and can check your key's proper function and penetration into the cylinder. It will all become clear with the cylinder in your hand. There may be a wiring attachment to the rear of the cylinder too, if I remember correctly. Carefully remove it. Take your time not to damage anything, or scratch the paint on the door.

928ntslow

Buck up my boy and fix it yourself... part of owning a 928.

Remove the entire door panel. Disconnect the plug at the top of the door (the smaller plug) This is the lead to the alarm. Disconnect the plug at the bottom of the lock motor. Easily visable...use a flat head screw driver and just twist. Remove the two allen head bolts at the end of the door that run threw the latching mechanism. Take a light and look inside now and use a large flat head screw driver to pop off the nylon end of the arm that is attached to the outside door handle. Disconnect it at the bottom end which is attached to the locking mechanism. Then, if you look up and behind this piece you had just disconnected, you will see another nylon arm which is attached to the lock cylinder. Do the same thing and disconnect. Now you can pull the whole mechanism down and out of the way.

Go back to the end of the door and remove the rubber plug (if it is still there) located towards the top of the door and behind it you will find another allen head bolt. After you remove this, you can now carefully remove the lock cylinder from the door by pulling it to the outside. Work it out as you will have to angle it to clear the nylon arm still attached and the alarm contact plug/wire.

Now just do what Ron and I had said before in addition to opening up the lock cylinder. There have been many threads on this that explain exactly how to remove the cylinder case and expose the cylinder and tumblers...also how to adjust/file them to fit your key.

ADDED: Looking at Ron's post, I guess it is possible to not have to do all of what I had said to get the cylinder out. I am just so used to have to deal with the motor adjustment and the other nonsense that I had to fix to make it all work. Just do what he said...it's probably a lot faster and easier.

To have someone else do this will cost more money than it it worth! You can do this, just be patient and take your time. Good luck!

Tampa 928s

I won't let anyone touch my 928 I was referring to removing the cylinder and having a locksmith try to repair the cylinder. One question how do you know if it is a long or standard cylinder?

Ron_H

What Keith said about the cylinder: notice there is a small shiny hard pin in the side of the cylinder. You will need to drill or file or grind this pin away without penetrating to far into the cylinder case. Once this pin is rendered in effective (gone), you can slide the guts out and expose the pins / wafers inside. CAREFUL not to loose control of their relative positions. You may then slide your key into the cylinder to reveal how they are redistributed relative to the case by the key. You will then realize how they must be filed to clear the case and allow the cylinder to rotate in the case. Do this with a small file so that the wafers match the contours of the key. It will be obvious once you have gotten this far.

When you have filed the wafer to fit the case and the key, you need to re-insert the cylinder into the case and then epoxy the case hole where the old pin was located so that the cylinder will not slide out of the case. make certain that the epoxy is not excessively proud from the surface of the cylinder. When the epoxy cures, you may reinstall the cylinder into the door lock and you're done.

Ron_H

If the cylinder is a long key (alarm), it will be about a quarter or half an inch longer than a short cylinder. The long key will not completely slide into the short cylinder. The short key wil not completely slide into the full length of the long cylinder. The alarm key will turn the end of the alarm cylinder separately from the front part of the cylinder, and will thus actuate the alarm disconnect.
If your long key doesn't slide completely into the cylinder it is not an alarm cylinder, IIRC.

no doubt

Quote of the day!

pscottjr

Tampa, here is a link that has some links in it that shows some of what is being discussed here. I always find pictures help.

Good Luck

https://rennlist.com/forums/928-forum/397857-re-keying-locks.html