Why is the "green wire" so special?
 

I was doing some cleanup in my engine compartment and noticed that the end of my green wire is beginning to get brittle and crack. Needless to say I was a bit stunned when I priced this part out. Over $100.00! Tell me what type of magical properties this little piece of wire has that make it so costly. Is there something special about this wire, or is it just a length of wire with factory connectors on each end. :eek:

because its green! DUH

and S4's and later cars dont have them, so they are rare





why is it so special, is the magic green wire as important and the magical blue hose?

It is a shielded cable. Nothing special other than that. If someone locates the connectors it could be fabricated for $5.00.

Shielded- sort of.
The wire has a core that handles one side of the polarity for the signal, and then a braided casing that handles the other. So you have both positive and ground in one casing. I don't get how that doesn't induce a current, or why Porsche elected to do it that way, but I guess it doesn't matter.

The wire is just a shielded coax cable with a Bosch two pin connector on one end. What makes it unique, and pricey, is the pin configuration on the distributor end. Just another case where the Porsche engineers reinvented the wheel. :(

Dennis

I sell the Green wire for $98.20 and already said the connector at the distributor end is all that makes it special.
John Speake has an alternative for about half the price but we need cores to reuse the connector.
If the connector is toast we are SOL.

I personaly am happy that it is still available new because the cars will not run without it. Which reminds me I should buy one and tuck it away in my personal stash along side the new printed circuit foil that I bought for the very brown 1980....

So Roger, do you require the old wire in order to make the new?

Assume John Speake also requires the old wire?

Just want to clarify if the connector is golden and the ONLY way to create a replacement.

TX.

I need to get one for my stash as well, it will go along side my 9 printed circuit boards for my 80.

The distributor pickup is used on the same year 911's. If the 928 version becomes NLA, why not make an extension for the 911 green wire (<½ price of 928 wire)?

930 602 907 01
https://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin...3060290701-M14

928 602 907 00
https://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin...860290700-M100

What years is this wire applicable to? Pre-87?

If someone sends me a sample of the magic connector, I may be able to duplicate it..

I don't remember seeing a green a wire on the early 32V engines.

Used 78-84 except the LH Euro cars. Not on any 32 valve. Basically all single distributor cars it sends the signal to the spark TSZ unit tach and brain. The crank timing sensor replaced it for L H cars

[QUOTE=PorKen;5500680]The distributor pickup is used on the same year 911's. If the 928 version becomes NLA, why not make an extension for the 911 green wire (<½ price of 928 wire)?

Porken,

My problems with the wire have always been at the connectors. Would adding an extension double the potential problem areas?

Dennis

These look like they have a fairly standard 2-pin Bosch connector at the non-distributor end. It's the end at the distributor that seems to be the challenge. I have the modern cable (it isn't green though) for replacement but no good source for the distributor-end connection. Maybe if the 911 cars chew them up too, it would be worth new-sourcing the connectors.

By the time K added her normal mark-up and billing fees, a single replacement would cost as much as a new one from Jim and Mark. Plus the 928 Int'l service and warranty policies are much better. :)

Jim are you saving up for 959 too?

Never!

I think we are all saving up for a 959. Some save faster than others. Some, like me, just don't save fast enough to overcome the inflation in 959 prices lately. It doesn't keep me awake at night worrying, if anybody was having that concern. :)

I road tested the prototype in my 81 Euro s; worked fine.

Marton

I have a barely used green wire, I will sell for $65. It was in my race car for about an hour of use before I had terminal motor problems :(
Update: The wire is sold, thanks.

Current price is 129.00. A 31% increase over 4 years. Still available new. That is good. I may need one someday.

Tell those factories to start making another batch of parts!

hmm, been thinking about grabbing one and adding it to the stash for future reference. Per Jim B's thought above.

If only they were available in red. That would make the car alot faster.

Has anyone found a suitable substitute connector?

I'll have to swap around on some cars to see if it's a different size or anything, but the distributor connector looks like a typical Bosch distributor end (same as on similar vintage BMWs, etc).

I makes me grin to read complaints about a wire that cost $100 and only lasts 30 years. (And on a Porsche no less!)

I replaced mine a few years back. Maybe I'll need another when I'm 80 years old - better start planning for that!

What they charge or how long they last is not the point. It's a bloody wire for **** sakes.

From my files of accumulated notes and references:

-The connectors are the same ones used on the 930 green wire (Part 93060290701). This one is too short for use on our cars, though an extension wire can be used.
-The distributor connector is also found on a Mercedes condenser wire (Part 000-159-61-18, or Bosch number 1-234-431-181). (the other end is a standard connector - the distributor end is the odd one) This is more expensive than our wire, but might be able to find it at junk yards though. (70s and 80s 360s and 450s???)
-If you have the connector for the distributor you can rebuild the wire unit
See This Thread and This Thread for discussions thereof.

Roger at 928sRus also offers a rebuild service for the wire I believe.

I am sure some one in the electrical field should be able to mod the wire for way less, sure $100.00 to last 30 years is a hell of a deal but how many parts are there in a 928?

My Bosch connector was bad so I tried to replace it with a new connector which didn't go too well so I bypassed that connector and wired it straight through. Works great.

and when you wash the car and it wont start this could be a possible reason why.

that said putting in the correct Bosch parts is the best bet to insure continued reliable service.

Same goes for swapping in substandard ignition parts like coils, caps and rotors and ignition wires.

After finding cheapo parts and trying to get the engine to run correctly, it just saves a lot of time to do it right the first time and possibly keep the car off the hook of the tow truck.
Do it once do it right

Your local autoparts store should have the female connector for that end. Its a 2-pole male AMP junior plug. Its the one on the other end which is unique.

I think at the time I had spent so much money on it I couldn't stomach anymore so I cut a corner. I have it covered up pretty good.

that looks pretty good ...for now that is if you have other priorities or it doesn't give you any trouble at all.

So, who is going to take the "A" on molding-up a bunch of distributor-side plugs.

Should be doable on the benchtop with a crude unit mold and a cold pour of some sort?

Don't the electronics prototypers have means / materials for this? Would need resistance and durability to the engine bay environment.

Roger,
Is this your price for OE or AM?

I want this project, just need to clear a couple others before I can get to it.

I figured this is an item that will only increase in price until it becomes NLA. I believe this would be a great project inkeeping with what 928 Classics is all about.

Bump.... Just wanting to resurrect this discussion as I am going to be buying a green wire within a month or 2. Has anyone looked into making a new distributor end?

I have. Unique injection molded parts and progressive-die terminals. Not insurmountable, but high capital expense. It's a project that will have to wait until my business develops some operating capital.

If anyone has time on there hands and can find 'off the shelf' terminals (for the distributor end), that would be HUGE!

If someone has a bad green wire with the 'rogue' connector that they are willing to send me, I have a friend who runs the prototyping lab at a major computer manufacturer, and he specializes in connectors of all types. He is willing to try and model the part we need . He is a walking encyclopedia of parts!
PM me if you can help this much needed cause.

It's German Engineering made only in Bavaria. You would not understand the subtlety of it's design or purpose.

If you're thinking of taping it up; it won't work as a black wire or a green wire with black stripes.

IIRC John Speake could not find the distributor end of the green wire. We were totally dependent on receiving good useable cores to rebuild another green wire. As most cores were toast (end was brittle and unusable) this died a natural death very quickly. Maybe easier to find an alternative method of connecting the wire to the distributor that is readily available.

I used to be able to buy OEM from Bosch but this dried up and I can only buy direct from Porsche.
List is $128 and the good news is they have over 300 in stock.

Unless someone else has one readily avail that isn't on a car I will send mine in for the greater good. But I'm sure someone here has one sitting around somewhere. I'm pretty sure that is part of my no start problem and the non distributor end has disintegrated but I believe the distributor end is good. I will check tonight.

As I mentioned before the Green Wire is only available via Porsche.
Here are some pictures of a new one - the spade type connector is the distributor end.
Notice the additional black slide on plastic piece. I can only surmise that the green wire is used on another application and this extra piece is needed. It does stop the part being used on a 928 so we remove it before shipping.
I know I need a better camera.

the 911s of the 70s early 80s also use a green wire...and also have problems with it.

I thought I recognized it in the 930 forums.

Another possible method of making these connectors could be to scan one with a 3D scanner, then print them off on a 3D printer. The printers at least are getting steadily cheaper and better, though not sure if they can fully replicate the connector terminal channels.

There are a lot of parts for many different vintage cars that could be made and sold using this method. Simple-to-make (with a printer), but expensive-to-buy (in the present market) NLA Marelli switch knobs come to mind. I bet there are many more NLA Porsche, Bosch and other manufacturer parts that would be good candidates for this budding cottage industry.

Jim thats the best insurance you can have that you will never need either one...! ;)

Alan

Cheaper printer use ABS, which can be OK for a lot of parts, but not for high temp uses. Also the cheaper printers are not really high resolution. Still, I've been wondering the same thing -- it seems like it could work for some parts -- particularly if someone wanted to do a little hand finishing. Maybe not the first choice, but in a situation where there's no viable alternative, it might be worth a try.

The trick is getting a good model.

I have easy access to a Makerbot Replicator 2x if we want to experiment with making a couple of parts.

One other thing to consider: part designs are usually protected IP. And while a manufacturer is likely to look the other way on very small volume enthusiast uses, the more it looks like a real business the more likely one is to get a firmly written WTF letter from counsel.

Actually Kevin the cheaper printers use PLA, which is much lower temp than ABS.
Of course nylon is really the best overall.

3D printing will come in few years and take care of this problem but its not quite ready yet.

Actually Errka, I know I could design and print either an ABS or Nylon replacement end that would stand up well right now.
But I'm far too busy with the printer right now to consider it.

Indeed. I believe the 2X is currently the only Makerbot that can use either PLA or ABS (and you have to set platform temp accordingly). And the 2X is currently the most expensive of the cheaper printers. My point is even ABS is not really heat resistant -- though a bit better than PLA.

Nylon is definitely better.

I'm printing two separators in Nylon right now as we speak. ABS has no issues standing up to underhood temperatures, or even engine oil.

Colin,

Which printer are you using for 3D printing? Been researching them before taking the plunge

Cheers!
Carl

Carl, I'm using a variant of the printrbot.

All the things I've been printing, I've made in solid works.

ABS has been the hardest to work with. There have been lifting troubles with it, mostly as I haven't wanted to make an ABS slurry. The nylon is showing to be pretty easy/good actually.

Thanks Colin,

I was looking at the Ultimaker 2, do they all handle Nylon? You have to heat the nozzle to a higher temperature I think? Sorry to hijack the thread.

Cheers!
Carl

PM inbound.

Why not make your own?

MAKING THE MOLD:

1. Get some mold making silicone here
2. Get a small plastic box like 50mm L X 75mm W X 35mm H. You can use paper but you will need a release agent or a wax coating on the inside.
3. Get eight very thin sewing needles (or equivalent) 50mm or longer.
4. Take two of the needles and push them through both sides of the box about 8mm off the bottom of the box, centered in the box and separated by 15mm.
5. Take your connector and place it centered the needles.
6. Take two more needles and push them through the box perpendicular to the other needles tight over the top of the connector.
7. Repeat the procedure with the remaining four needles so you have a grid like # on top and bottom of the connector.
8. Take your silicone parts I & II and mix enough to fill the box to the top.
9. Pour the mix around the connector.
10. Wait the full recommended time for cure and then 30 minutes more.
11. Remove the needles.
12. Carefully remove the rubber mold from the box.
13. Take a new razor blade and cut the mold the long way (wire to spade connector end) through the center tracing the connector. Use a straightedge to ensure a clean cut. Do this on three sides, the top, bottom and the spade connector ends.
14. No carefully open the mold and extract the connector. Voila! You now have a mold to make your connector

MAKING THE CONNECTOR

1. Get some plastic resin here
2. Get four needles as those in the MOLD MAKING procedure.
3. Take the wire you have chosen and crimp the subminiature female spade connectors (available here ) onto the wire pair. (by the way 944 harnesses have a lot of "green wire" for various sensors so get a bad harness and you now have a source of many feet of this wire)
4. Place the wire in the mold and push two needles through the mold and into the spade connectors. Make sure the connectors are suspended and centered in the spade cavity. If you are not careful to do this the connectors will be poking out of you plastic pour. Don't worry if you have to do it a couple of times, its rubber.
5. Take two more needles and suspend the wire pair in its cavity. You may need two more needles if the wire will not stay in place laterally.
6. Take two thin pieces of wood or MDF (fiber board) and put gentle pressure to hold the mold together and prevent too much expansion
7. Mix the resin trying not to whip it as to reduce bubbles
8. Pour the resin into the mold
9. Wait the recommended set time plus 15 minutes
10. Remove the pins
11. Remove the casting from the mold
12. Clean up flashing with razor knife ( you may need to do some dremel work)

Total cost $66 and now you can make more for all your 928 buddies:)

Here is a crude example I whipped up in 60 minutes start to finish. I used low density polystyrene and silicon putty. Both are inadequate for detail molds requiring strength, temperature resistance and non-porous.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...e6fd02f365.jpg


https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...45a1e1a567.jpg


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...4f8dd68c94.jpg


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...e5c3a89ec4.jpg


https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...5e58363f10.jpg

Fronkenstein

Old thread, but the title speaks to my question... which is...
If the green part of the green wire is coaxial, what about the wire connection from the ECU to the green wire? Is it a simple 2 conductor or is it something special?