Red Flash

Hi all

So an acquaintance of mine dumped this water pump in my lap yesterday and asked me what I thought. Never seen one of these before. He seemed to think that it was OEM quality...

I did note that it had a metal impeller. My acquaintance had also been told by a Porsche parts person that new Porsche pumps still have metal impellers. I thought this was not true.

Has anybody used or heard of the pump in the pictures?

The Forgotten On

I can tell by the lack of an extra bushing on the impeller shaft that it is the old design.

With it being a metal aftermarket impeller I wouldn't use it personally. It becomes a mill once it fails and starts gouging the block.

The worst that can happen with a plastic one doing this is the impeller fins break off.

jpitman2

Looks like something has been removed with an end mill - is it any clearer in real life? On my old 16v pump it has nothing there, but an S4 pump says '7533/F2' there.
jp 83 Euro S AT 57k

Chris Lockhart

I noticed that as well. Definitely suspicious. A rebuild maybe?

docmirror

It's rebuilt and dist by this company:

http://www.autex.de/englisch/product...umps-kits.html

Which purchased the rights to the GK brand when the developer retired. It appears that a OEM casting, and an OEM pulley were sourced, and the impeller was provided by someone for GK. The critical components are the bearings and seal, which cannot be checked unless the impeller and pulley are pressed apart. Autex does not provide specific info on the critical components inside. They may be the finest German bearings and seals, or they may be cheap Chinese junk.

Red Flash

Thanks for the reply gents. I just lack any kind of current knowledge on this subject. After my investigation 5 - 6 years ago, I decided that I would buy either Porsche pumps and/or Guardian pumps, both with a plastic impeller.

@ JP and Chris, the pictures are quite representative of what I saw.

Help from people with a broader knowledge on this topic was needed. Thanks again. I will report back to my acquaintance.

docmirror

I strongly suspect the metal impeller in this unit has been cast by a third party for Autex rebuilds. Why they chose metal is a question for the company, but many cars still use them successfully(non-Porsche).

GregBBRD

The pump in your picture is a GEBA pump with the casting numbers and the brand name removed.

Here's a picture of a GEBA, for comparison.

All GEBA pumps come with metal impellers.

928 International sells them and Roger was mumbling about selling them, due to the lack of Laso pumps. I have no idea if these guys will replace your engine block when the metal impeller comes loose and ruins your engine, but they should....they both know better!

Personally, I encourage people to remove every one of these pumps that I find on engines that come into my shop. (Most people paid Porsche retail for these cheap pumps, when they got installed....it's one hell of a profit margin for "shady shops".) I've got a box full of them....this picture is from one I pulled off the top. It has 50 miles on it....when the client brought me the car to have the timing belt job done correctly.

BTW....the last Porsche pump with a metal impeller was made in 1988....Porsche couldn't keep the metal impellers on and had to swap to plastic impellers to keep engines from being ruined.

Think about that....Porsche couldn't keep the metal impellers on!

That's pretty damn good clue that no one should be installing these pumps.

Rob Edwards

HA! I get to correct Greg. Once. Metal impeller factory pump, '89 casting date. But yes, been a while since Porsche would sell you a metal impeller.

worf928

GregBBRD

And that is late in 1989!

I stand corrected.

We should put that thing on your race engine, Rob!

ROG100

I have plenty of Laso pumps in stock with plastic impellers. Both early and late.
Sold one, yes one, GEBA and it failed.

GregBBRD

Your moral compass is why you are so successful!

You're the best!

dr bob

My 12/88 build car came with a metal impeller. If that means anything.

docmirror

Y'all are focusing on the wrong bit of the asm. The impeller is the instrument of destruction, while the bearing and seal are the instrument(s) of failure. I don't care who's casting, pulley, or impeller are present. If the bearings and seals are good, the unit will last. Except for an obvious casting defect like an axial shaft offset mistake. I've been wondering if it would be useful to start taking them apart and doing it myself. I did the rebuild in my Mondial water pump and it lasted a long time(low miles).