V2Rocket

Just wondering on people's experiences here...if it was worth it to them in the end to fit a 944S engine into their originally-8-valve NA cars.

Not talking about wiring work etc...just the expense of finding the S engine and the bolt-in engine swap...was the power gain worth the trouble?
Don't tell me "just skip to an S2 or 968 engine"...I don't want to spend $2-3k on just an engine lump.

In my experience the 944S "feels" like its lacking below 4000rpm but then hang on! Whereas the 944NA is pretty smooth in power delivery all around.

In reality the 944S is essentially the same low-end power as a 944 8 valve but then as the RPMs climb there is a +40 hp jump at the top end...which is surprising to feel.

I have aftermarket ECU so wiring and tuning is no problem for me. I can get some more low-end out of it easily enough...

Please share...

FRporscheman

Have you ever driven an S? Test driving one could tell you whether the power is worth it to you.

odonnell

Yeah but it's not the full potential when you test drive it, because the stock tune sucks.

AZ520

I would say not really, how about building a shave high compression 8v head with a cam , over size valves, porting etc. You can dial in the tune yourself you said. Should yield the same results with less labor and cost.

924srr27l

Stick with 8 valves, even put a 2.7 bigger valved head on and it'll be better for street use, unless you're not too bothered about lower rpm performance and just want a higher revving peaky thing ?

The S2 and 968 get away with a twin cam set up due to their large 750cc per cylinder capacity, otherwise they would be like most 16V cars (2.0) you gotta rev the knackers off them to get them going....

I could fit a 3.0 Twin cam head to my 2.7 but I reckon whilst a higher top peak figure would be achieved I'd lose the low end torque I have now...

The 190ft Lbs at 2850rpm is Superb on the street, I can be in a higher gear than most in the slower to medium bends and it just pulls and pulls....

R

Noahs944

I agree you can come close with a modified 8v vs a stock 16, but obviously the 16v has more potential if you were to compare modified to modified.

I only mention this (somewhat obvious statement) because a modified engine, especially a very modified engine typically doesn't have good drivability manners. Especially in cold weather start ups. This became a really pita with my "built" 8 valve and why I have since gone back to stock, and had my eye on 16... I suspect the intake flow design is better for the cfms, but thats merely speculation.

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Which brings us to what is the car going to be used for? Do you need to meet emissions standards?

V2Rocket

I've driven a few of them but only for short drives (customer cars...the "make sure everything works after I fixed the car" test)...not something I've lived with.

+1
No way that's less labor and cost...I can get a complete 944S engine for $1000 or less and swap it in a day's time and have it running by dinner.
This is purely in my case since I can just tweak my existing ECU/wiring harness to run the S engine, rather than having to swap the S DME etc in.

Can't get a 944 head rebuilt with porting/valves and a hot cam for $1000, and there's no reason to even bother with the head - all it needs is a cam...but...

Street car, and yes, I live in the state with the most stringent emissions standards, so wild cams are not in the cards for me...which rules out a hot 8v engine. I've been thinking about building a 16v engine to supercharge for a while now and have all the bits, just no time to put it together (some custom work/assembly required). The supercharger unbolts easily enough so that's not a problem for emissions testing, but I don't want to have to swap camshafts every 2 years.

The tune I can change from hot-rod to smog-lump in about 10 seconds.

Noahs944

I find this a remarkable asset.

Noahs944

This was my personal experience also. I find it boggling when I hear what sort of prices Doug mentions. His engine guy works for peanuts, but here in my town the reputable guys aren't cheap!

Noahs944

I'm tempted to say you are exaggerating here. (that's okay), what about rod bearings, oil leaks, belts & rollers, chains & tensioners... all the maintenance crap. It's expensive and takes some time. Also the exhaust is a bit different & needs to be accounted for.

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Spencer I think you should go 16v due based on what you said. Better in everyway!!! (except reliability and parts costs).

V2Rocket

All those things would need to be done on a hot-rodded 8v engine anyways, so that extra cost is sort of a toss-up...

And there's no exaggeration...I have 2 guys within an hour's drive from me with good running 944S engines for ~$1000, already pulled from the car.

I once swapped the engines between 2 944's in an 8-hour day (two race cars, one with good suspension/tired engine, one with bad suspension/fresh engine, did the mix-and match to put good with good and tired with tired).

Doing a single swap is 5-6 hours. It's really straight forward once you've done it a few times and there's no rusty bolts...which we don't have down here

Exhaust no problem, I have cutter/welder and live near Lart so anything I want is 30 mins away.

Really just wondering if the 40 occasional HP is worth the $1000 and time.

Arominus

I've posted on this before so you know my answer.

DO IT. You get higher compression, way more flow in the head and you already have an S2 intake for it. This along with the VEMS will get you scootin' pretty good. Put fresh rod bearings and cam pads in it before you swap it and don't look back.

JohnA944

This is the thread I've needed to see. I picked up a complete 87S for $500 (not running) a couple years ago with the intention of doing this swap into an 88 NA, but I couldn't find anyone who had done it. Now I just need to get them pulled from the field and do the work....

AZ520

40 hp for 1000.00 I would do that . I paid 600 for a maf kit, only 10-15 hp gain. Why would you loss torque with 16v, torque mainly comes from displacement which is unchanged no?

Dougs951S

Worth it for 1000 bucks imho, though what happened to going boosted? The factory 16v pistons are not a good setup for boost, so if your plan is to add FI later, I say that isn't the best plan.

That being said, I think you'll get ~210 hp with the S2 intake and a good SD tune + good exhaust.