Turbo or S2 as a Daily Driver?
#1
Three Wheelin'
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Durham Region/GTA East, Canada
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Turbo or S2 as a Daily Driver?
That is the question. I've been looking for my next daily driver, which I was hoping would be an S2, but they just don't come up very often in my part of the world. Turbo's on the other hand do. Maybe 20 turbos for every S2 listed for sale.
Its starting to make me think about picking up a turbo instead. Sounds easy eh? Not so. I drive 120miles round trip every day, and I live in the land of igloo's, mukluks, and hockey. AND I drive year round with my 944. I am no longer interested in driving "winter beaters" for 6 months of the year, hence why I'm driving 944's and not a 928 or 911. Boxsters have entered my mind as well.
My commute is across the city on major highways, so I get some stop and go, but mostly easy cruising (shift work)
Any thoughts? Should I stay on the quest for an S2?
A nice Turbo is 8-10k and an S2 is in the 10K+ range. At least in my surrounding area. There are exceptions that prove the rule though.
Its starting to make me think about picking up a turbo instead. Sounds easy eh? Not so. I drive 120miles round trip every day, and I live in the land of igloo's, mukluks, and hockey. AND I drive year round with my 944. I am no longer interested in driving "winter beaters" for 6 months of the year, hence why I'm driving 944's and not a 928 or 911. Boxsters have entered my mind as well.
My commute is across the city on major highways, so I get some stop and go, but mostly easy cruising (shift work)
Any thoughts? Should I stay on the quest for an S2?
A nice Turbo is 8-10k and an S2 is in the 10K+ range. At least in my surrounding area. There are exceptions that prove the rule though.
#2
Rainman
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Either would be fine, with some edge given to the S2 because of engine size/gearing for slow speed driving.
Does it have to be one of those two? As a DD an NA is great, good available power at all RPM (but definitely not too much overall), and easy around-town gear ratios while being decent cruiser on the freeway.
Does it have to be one of those two? As a DD an NA is great, good available power at all RPM (but definitely not too much overall), and easy around-town gear ratios while being decent cruiser on the freeway.
#3
I went through the same thing a bit.
There are soooo many Turbos available, I never realized how popular they were and how many must have been sold. In my area, they not only greatly outnumber S2s, but if you are looking at 86 and newer cars, they seem to outnumber even "regular" 86-89 NA 944s (take a look at eBay's current listing, for example).
To me, though, personally I could not do the Turbo. I think they are great cars, but a 24+ year old Turbo, with all that underhood heat, extra plumbing, complexity, etc. just worried me too much. And, I don't need the extra power (which actually isn't much more than an S2 anyways), so I ruled Turbos out, as tempting and available as they were. I kept looking until I found a very nice S2.
As a 25+ year 911 owner (multiple 911s), I have to say I've been very pleased with the S2. The engine is super smooth, much better than I thought it would be, and the power is quite good. I had only driven earlier 2 valve 944s before, and the S2 is really a completely different car, IMO. The biggest downside to the S2 is they didn't make all that many (esp. the coupe, I think only 510 for the US in 1991), many have been trashed, and it's therefore very hard to find a really nice one.
There are soooo many Turbos available, I never realized how popular they were and how many must have been sold. In my area, they not only greatly outnumber S2s, but if you are looking at 86 and newer cars, they seem to outnumber even "regular" 86-89 NA 944s (take a look at eBay's current listing, for example).
To me, though, personally I could not do the Turbo. I think they are great cars, but a 24+ year old Turbo, with all that underhood heat, extra plumbing, complexity, etc. just worried me too much. And, I don't need the extra power (which actually isn't much more than an S2 anyways), so I ruled Turbos out, as tempting and available as they were. I kept looking until I found a very nice S2.
As a 25+ year 911 owner (multiple 911s), I have to say I've been very pleased with the S2. The engine is super smooth, much better than I thought it would be, and the power is quite good. I had only driven earlier 2 valve 944s before, and the S2 is really a completely different car, IMO. The biggest downside to the S2 is they didn't make all that many (esp. the coupe, I think only 510 for the US in 1991), many have been trashed, and it's therefore very hard to find a really nice one.
#4
Rennlist Member
+1 on the S2. The engine is sublime and is very friendly for daily driving. Depending on how much you're looking to spend, you might also want to consider a 968.
#5
Rennlist Member
+2 on the S2! I've had mine for a bit over two years now, and have enjoyed it even more than I thought I would.
I use the car as an occasional DD (I know,an oxymoron) and a DE/AutoX car and it has done it all very well!
I use the car as an occasional DD (I know,an oxymoron) and a DE/AutoX car and it has done it all very well!
#6
I like NA for a DD, just simpler to keep in tip top shape, no lag, great power curve, etc. A turbo is awesome if you'll be doing a full restoration or plan to mod for big power. I ended up with a 968 which isn't that different from an S2 and I love it.
#7
I have both, although the Turbo has now been converted to a track car. I like the S2 better in traffic because of the low end torque. It's also getting harder to find an unmolested turbo. However, have said all that, if you did find a nice turbo, I'd go ahead and consider it. If you are looking for more power at some point, the Turbo is the way to go. However, both are fun to drive.
+1 on the 968. Also a great car. Just a more modern version of the S2.
+1 on the 968. Also a great car. Just a more modern version of the S2.
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#8
I would not be wanting to drive a Turbo on anything but dry pavement.
#10
Love boost!!!! Stay out of it for fuel mileage, hammer down for some fun!!
Know several guys here locally in Denver that drive Turbos daily up to 150miles a day. All are high mileage cars at this point, (200-300k) and just keep plugging along.
Most drive fine in he the snow unless heavily modified! Boost isn't so much the issue, it's to the supporting hardware like heavy clutches and fat tires that make it tricky in the snow.
Know several guys here locally in Denver that drive Turbos daily up to 150miles a day. All are high mileage cars at this point, (200-300k) and just keep plugging along.
Most drive fine in he the snow unless heavily modified! Boost isn't so much the issue, it's to the supporting hardware like heavy clutches and fat tires that make it tricky in the snow.
#11
Burning Brakes
I have had both...Loved my Turbo but it was harder to keep running smooth and there was always something that I was worried about letting go...I was also always chasing a hunting idle on cold start which I could never fully fix..I would say I had an average example...The power is fun but in the winter could get you sideways depending on the tires you chose.
My S2 I found last summer I got for a great price, I find it much smoother to drive as a daily and it runs smooth..It is less complicated under the hood but make sure you find out if the timing chain shoes have been replaced.
You are a few hours away south west of me but I wouldn't drive either in the winter as everything is so old and the cold/salt will quickly take there toll on old parts.
My S2 I found last summer I got for a great price, I find it much smoother to drive as a daily and it runs smooth..It is less complicated under the hood but make sure you find out if the timing chain shoes have been replaced.
You are a few hours away south west of me but I wouldn't drive either in the winter as everything is so old and the cold/salt will quickly take there toll on old parts.
#12
I drive a Porsche 944 Turbo in Washington State all year round. Up here, there is no such thing as dry pavement. But seriously though, I could not imagine how gutless and slow an NA 944 must feel. The turbo barely cuts it IMO. Having said that, I would love to own an S2 or 968 but both start around $11 to $14k in these parts, and there are a lot of nice, (not to mention much newer cars) to be had at that price. Heck, another 10 grand and you are in 2000/2001 model year, 911 territory.
#13
I went through the same thing a bit.
There are soooo many Turbos available, I never realized how popular they were and how many must have been sold. In my area, they not only greatly outnumber S2s, but if you are looking at 86 and newer cars, they seem to outnumber even "regular" 86-89 NA 944s (take a look at eBay's current listing, for example).
To me, though, personally I could not do the Turbo. I think they are great cars, but a 24+ year old Turbo, with all that underhood heat, extra plumbing, complexity, etc. just worried me too much. And, I don't need the extra power (which actually isn't much more than an S2 anyways), so I ruled Turbos out, as tempting and available as they were. I kept looking until I found a very nice S2.
.
There are soooo many Turbos available, I never realized how popular they were and how many must have been sold. In my area, they not only greatly outnumber S2s, but if you are looking at 86 and newer cars, they seem to outnumber even "regular" 86-89 NA 944s (take a look at eBay's current listing, for example).
To me, though, personally I could not do the Turbo. I think they are great cars, but a 24+ year old Turbo, with all that underhood heat, extra plumbing, complexity, etc. just worried me too much. And, I don't need the extra power (which actually isn't much more than an S2 anyways), so I ruled Turbos out, as tempting and available as they were. I kept looking until I found a very nice S2.
.
Funny because there are literally 6x as many NA cars as turbos. Porsche made over 144k 944s and only about 25k Turbos! Worldwide!
....but I would bet that people give up and scrap NA cars at a rate faster than 6:1 to a Turbo.
There really isn't any more complexity to deal with. Turbos and their supporting hardware rarely fail unless poorly modded. All the normal maintenance stuff is EXACTLY the same as a NA car!
#14
Funny because there are literally 6x as many NA cars as turbos. Porsche made over 144k 944s and only about 25k Turbos! Worldwide!
....but I would bet that people give up and scrap NA cars at a rate faster than 6:1 to a Turbo.
There really isn't any more complexity to deal with. Turbos and their supporting hardware rarely fail unless poorly modded. All the normal maintenance stuff is EXACTLY the same as a NA car!
....but I would bet that people give up and scrap NA cars at a rate faster than 6:1 to a Turbo.
There really isn't any more complexity to deal with. Turbos and their supporting hardware rarely fail unless poorly modded. All the normal maintenance stuff is EXACTLY the same as a NA car!
speed and ref sensor... check.
Does it use Bosch L-jettronic FI... check.
Does it have a very poorly designed water-cooled, oil cooler... oh wait my turbo doesn't have that. :-)
#15
One thing to note, I'm at sea level. If I were in Denver I'd almost certainly do forced induction of some sort (aftermarket on a 968 or 944 turbo). Serious altitude really saps the power. I spend a fair bit of time in CO on motorcycles and find it's one of the few places in the states where a liter bike really makes sense for me.