What's wrong with aftermarket waterpumps?
09-08-2011, 07:29 PM
#16
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Some things to consider in this conversation.
Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) does not mean that those parts have the same tolerances or are made exactly like the ones they make as Original Equipment (OE) parts for end users, such as Porsche.
Most agreements between vendors and end users usually state that an OEM cannot sell the same product as a competitor to the OE products.
For instance, OEM parts are labeled under the manufacturer, such as Bosch.
OE parts are labeled under the end user, such as Porsche, even though Bosch made those parts.
Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) does not mean that those parts have the same tolerances or are made exactly like the ones they make as Original Equipment (OE) parts for end users, such as Porsche.
Most agreements between vendors and end users usually state that an OEM cannot sell the same product as a competitor to the OE products.
For instance, OEM parts are labeled under the manufacturer, such as Bosch.
OE parts are labeled under the end user, such as Porsche, even though Bosch made those parts.
Last edited by Black Sea RD; 09-08-2011 at 07:55 PM.
09-08-2011, 10:03 PM
#17
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Thanks all for this interesting discussion.
I believe I will be able to buy OE at a good enough price but have been concerned about how and where I can save some dollars in the whole plan for the life of the car.
Appreciate the advice.
I believe I will be able to buy OE at a good enough price but have been concerned about how and where I can save some dollars in the whole plan for the life of the car.
Appreciate the advice.
09-09-2011, 01:22 AM
#18
Late Porkchops
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I am not normally one to tell anyone else what to do.
But for these cars, get the BEST parts you can.
It is not all that much in the total picture if you plan to keep the car. And you may want to sell the car a LOT quicker if you dont.
For the time, effort, money and frustration involved in maintaining these P cars the water pump, belts, etc in my opinion should be the most proven parts available. And even more so the higher, harder, and faster you push the car.
These buggers run hot. I mean HOT. I had mine out a few nights ago, when it was not 105 F down here in Texas ,and pulled into the garage and popped the hood. Some 4 hours later I walked by the car and felt the top of the engine. It was still good and warm.
An issue for about a nanosecond with a water pump, or an oil pump, on these cars and now you have some real trouble. You will need a headgasket, or another new headgasket. And some head work. And some rod bearings, or another set of rod bearings. And some more ........................ fill in the list.
If you do the work it is a lot to do and takes some time. If you pay a shop then you will be looking at a whopping bill.
That is just my opinion. Work once if you can. More fun.
But for these cars, get the BEST parts you can.
It is not all that much in the total picture if you plan to keep the car. And you may want to sell the car a LOT quicker if you dont.
For the time, effort, money and frustration involved in maintaining these P cars the water pump, belts, etc in my opinion should be the most proven parts available. And even more so the higher, harder, and faster you push the car.
These buggers run hot. I mean HOT. I had mine out a few nights ago, when it was not 105 F down here in Texas ,and pulled into the garage and popped the hood. Some 4 hours later I walked by the car and felt the top of the engine. It was still good and warm.
An issue for about a nanosecond with a water pump, or an oil pump, on these cars and now you have some real trouble. You will need a headgasket, or another new headgasket. And some head work. And some rod bearings, or another set of rod bearings. And some more ........................ fill in the list.
If you do the work it is a lot to do and takes some time. If you pay a shop then you will be looking at a whopping bill.
That is just my opinion. Work once if you can. More fun.
09-09-2011, 01:45 AM
#19
Proprietoristicly Refined
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I have a WP bought from ebay...'new'. Can't remember the brand; I recall made in Germany, but was cast in China IIRC(metal impeller). I'm about 20K miles into it's life and have no problems at all. I do look and listen with a stethoscope almost weekly, and just installed a new Tbelt related to other repairs which could upset an old pump. I have the 9201 tension tool. I will check/reset tension in another 250 miles, but I do keep an eye on this thing.
I strongly recommend a known good pump to anyone and took the risk on my own. Constantine's torque tube bearings just moved way up my list of projects...of which I also strongly recommend.
edit: Hamburg Technic from Deutch Parts is my pump.
I strongly recommend a known good pump to anyone and took the risk on my own. Constantine's torque tube bearings just moved way up my list of projects...of which I also strongly recommend.
edit: Hamburg Technic from Deutch Parts is my pump.
The 928forum has a lot of info on waterpumps and this is one opinion:
ROG100
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Double Oak, TX
Posts: 264 The cheap pumps on eBay are Hamburg Technic. Supposed to be made in Germany but after checking a number of other car threads about HT products they are made in Asian - either China or Korea maybe.
Greg Brown took one apart for Mark at 928 Int and the quality of the parts that matter were poor to say the least.
I was hoping that the pump from HT would offer us a cheaper "new pump" solution - not to be.
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01-05-2009, 09:19 AM
I would not use this pump. There is a reason for the low price.
John
09-09-2011, 03:20 AM
#20
Porsche used several vendors for their waterpumps. Laso was actually one of them. All Laso pumps are still made in Germany like most of the other Laso pumps. I changed few months ago a water pump to 968. It still had original pump which was made in Italy. Laso used few years ago plastic impellers on their 928 pumps. This design had some problems and they went back to metal, like they do with 944/968 pumps. I have used Laso pumps for years without any difficulties.
What comes to chines pump manufactureres; there are few. Bad thing is that they offer the same pump for all models. We all know that 16V pump won't fit directly to 8V models.
What comes to chines pump manufactureres; there are few. Bad thing is that they offer the same pump for all models. We all know that 16V pump won't fit directly to 8V models.
09-09-2011, 11:10 AM
#21
Porsche used several vendors for their waterpumps. Laso was actually one of them. All Laso pumps are still made in Germany like most of the other Laso pumps. I changed few months ago a water pump to 968. It still had original pump which was made in Italy. Laso used few years ago plastic impellers on their 928 pumps. This design had some problems and they went back to metal, like they do with 944/968 pumps. I have used Laso pumps for years without any difficulties.
What comes to chines pump manufactureres; there are few. Bad thing is that they offer the same pump for all models. We all know that 16V pump won't fit directly to 8V models.
What comes to chines pump manufactureres; there are few. Bad thing is that they offer the same pump for all models. We all know that 16V pump won't fit directly to 8V models.
09-14-2011, 12:42 AM
#22
Three Wheelin'
Some things to consider in this conversation.
Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) does not mean that those parts have the same tolerances or are made exactly like the ones they make as Original Equipment (OE) parts for end users, such as Porsche.
Most agreements between vendors and end users usually state that an OEM cannot sell the same product as a competitor to the OE products.
For instance, OEM parts are labeled under the manufacturer, such as Bosch.
OE parts are labeled under the end user, such as Porsche, even though Bosch made those parts.
Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) does not mean that those parts have the same tolerances or are made exactly like the ones they make as Original Equipment (OE) parts for end users, such as Porsche.
Most agreements between vendors and end users usually state that an OEM cannot sell the same product as a competitor to the OE products.
For instance, OEM parts are labeled under the manufacturer, such as Bosch.
OE parts are labeled under the end user, such as Porsche, even though Bosch made those parts.
Plenty of examples on the 944 where OEM parts are clearly inferior to OE parts.
Having said that, I replaced my OE pump (after the plastic impeller failed) with a LASO...
Cheers,
Mike
09-14-2011, 02:16 AM
#23
For instance, OEM parts are labeled under the manufacturer, such as Bosch.
OE parts are labeled under the end user, such as Porsche, even though Bosch made those parts.
OE parts are labeled under the end user, such as Porsche, even though Bosch made those parts.
09-14-2011, 02:41 AM
#25
Late Porkchops
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09-14-2011, 06:35 AM
#26
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Quite many OE parts have original manufacturers label, not Porsche. They just have Porsche part number on them. Just check for example electric parts, in most cases they have Bosch label on them with Porsche part number.Check heater / AC unit, there is Nippondendo labels with Porsche partnumber. I have even found MB and BMW labeled parts from my 951, mainly from airbag system, which is controlled by Siemens labeled computer.
The "They just have a Porsche part number on them" is the clue that the part is a Porsche "OE" part and not a Bosch "OEM" part that looks like, fits like and will work like the Porsche part, but it isn't a Porsche part.
The OE parts will usually have the manufacturer's name and sometimes even their numbering system on the part along the car manufacturer's part number that comes in a bag or box with the car manufacturer's name on it and a more expensive price tag.
Don't want to take this conversation too far off track, just thought to point out the difference since many throw around OE and OEM as if they are the same, which they are not. Also there are parts being sold as the more expensive OE parts when they are not.
Cheers,
