HOLY CRAP!! (NA brakes)
 

I have inspected my brakes several times over the short time I have owned my car. I finally decided to do a complete brake job. The pads could still go a while, but I assume my brake fluid is original (Its black like coffee and I even have sludge in the bottom of my master reservoir) and I'm starting to get quite a bit of fade. So I spent almost $500 at vertex on a new master cylinder, 4 caliper rebuild kits, pads all around, DOT 4 fluid, and front drilled rotors (sebro)..

My packages showed up yesterday, and as always, I did my "Porsche parts came in the mail happy dance" that my wife loves so much. I opened up the box, and went right for the PBR metal master pads. Said to myself "Wow, those rear pads are kinda small"...then I found the other box of pads....the ACTUAL rear pads.

How the F does Porsche call those brake pads?!?!?!!? All 4 of them are TINY!! I never understood why everyone complained about the NA brake system. I knew it was a single piston caliper, but cmon, its a sports car. Its got tons of brake for a 2900lb car....NOT. You can't really make out the size os stuff through the top of the caliper. I guess always assumed the pad was...well...bigger.

I now see why everyone wants to upgrade to the 951 brakes. The REAR pads on my old civic were double the size of the FRONT pads on the 944. I plan on the LSx swap in my car, and always though the NA brakes with good pads, and good rotors would be plenty for the street...and now I see that I need to upgrade my brakes completely. Crazy.......

Plenty of people have been on the track with original NA brakes (myself included) with no lack of braking power or fade issues. It's not necessarilly about the size of the pads, but the swept area of the rotors.
Put your metal masters in and try using the brakes before making judgements; you'll be suprised how hard you can brake before reaching the lock-up threshold.

Actually the NA brakes are quite capable. I can run an entire season on one set of racing brake pads and a couple years on a set of OEM solid rotors. And still we can brake deeper than most other cars with just that one huge piston.

Turbo cars need more brakes due to more weight and more power. But NA's are just fine.

I've got stock calipers and stock rotors & pads (cross-driller Zimmerman rotors & hawk hp+ pads), and have had no braking issues at the track. I can typically brake either later or as late as most any car out there w/o any fade issues (I'm normally traction limited on braking, not brake limited). These cars simply don't generate enough speed in the straights to require more braking ability.

I have had to do one emergency stop (from 70 mph) with 100% stock NA brakes and they did not let me down. Wheels did not lock up and I stopped more than fast enough to avoid the situation, and I stopped HARD......

Not only are the pads tiny, but the calipers don't even look cool. UPGRADE! Hell, try to squeeze some CGT calipers in there!

My 944 brakes better than any other vehicle I have driven from the 80s except for my grandfather's testarossa. Look at the brakes from other mid 80s era cars when talking about how small the brakes are. My disks are still bigger than most new economy cars.

I have never had any problems with them either... with my stock car. I was just shocked at how small they really are. I was expecting bigger brakes than a honda civic.... and they are not lol.

I was expecting to hold onto the stock brakes with the LSx, but now I don't think thats possible. I think I will need the Rennbay calipers, at least.

Think about it... this is 30 year old tech in a 20 year old car. Look at the Civic brakes even from the 90s. It has taken them 20 years to catch up.

Basically, what you learned is that most big brake kits are sold solely for the appearance. Nobody needs 4 (or 8) piston calipers or 14" rotors. I've never suffered an fade on track, and I can use late braking points. How else can a spec series like Spec 944 and 944 Cup run races with stock materials.

PS: I'm pretty sure that the current M5 has single piston calipers up front.

FWIW, it would actually cause a DECREASE in performance to increase your brakes beyond the required size. Once you get the point you no longer have unacceptable wear or fade, you're just adding more unsprung weight and rolling inertia.

I believe when I was looking up part numbers (for my 924S), you'll find the front pads are the same pads they use on the rear of a Lamborghini Diablo.

No problems with my stock brakes on the track... :)

BB.

+1 with everyone else here.

It's not the size of the brakes, it's how you use them.

I just redid the brakes on my S and did much the same as yourself.
PBR metal masters, SS brake lines, ATE type200 fluid, Rebuild front calipers, cleaned up the slides on the rear ones.. the car stops great now... The Metal Masters do suck a little when they are really cold but 1 stop to get some heat in them and they get better :)

Do the brake upgrade when you get your LS3 stuffed in it, it will need it.