Derek911

Jerry Seinfeld said it best. "Cars are about style and personality." Your car has to fit your personality, not everyone else's personality. A 3.2, and 964 are two different personalities.
Regardless of opinions, the fact is that the 964 is the hottest 911 platform at the moment.
This may be driven by a younger generation coming of age and the 964 is what they are drawn to. The Carerra is more of a traditional style, the 964 is a contemporary style. Unlike the 993, the 964 has the classic "911 look", but with cleaner body lines. One is not "better" than the other, it's all about what style or personality you fit in.

cool whip

Well said!

tcabler

You are totally right! I am a "forty-something", and the 964 was the Porsche that I lusted over in my youth. Never cared for the 911's impact bumper styling, but I just have always heard how damn reliable and bullet proof these cars are, as well as the "raw" driving feel v. the more insulated feel of the 964.

cobalt

Funny but when they came out with the 964 I hated the bumpers. But I always hated the accordion bumpers as well. I always considered them a last minute afterthought. The long nose (my first 911) is still the best looking IMO but after owning several 964's I can never go back to the torsion bar cars. Now I prefer the 964 looks over the rest especially the turbo. I guess like anything you get accustomed to what you have in the garage.

The 964 IMO is the quintessential air cooled 911. The 993 was the beginning of the change over in design and ideal. Far to soft and not as visceral as the earlier cars. The earlier cars albeit light were quirky and no where near as well built. But a nice one is still a joy to drive.

They are all great and offer their unique pros and cons. As some said it all depends on what you want out of them. The one thing to consider is if your 964 is a 92 through 94 it is a very rare Porsche. So few were imported. There were less of all 964's made for the US in these years combined than any one year for the 3.2 or SC. With so many parted out being turned into long nose conversions or just scrapped out there are far less remaining in the US than most realize.

Might be a good decision or not but I have a feeling that fining a nice 964 in the next few years is going to become harder and harder not to mention more expensive.

BTW Reliability is dependent solely on how well the cars previous owners cared for it. Everyone says 928's are unreliable yet my GTS has been the most reliable Porsche I have owned. None of the Porsche's I have owned have ever been a problem except my 80 euro 928 that had water leaking onto the fuse panel and then you're just screwed.

Also the 964 didn't sell well for a multitude of reasons none of which are related to the car itself. Porsche couldn't control Production costs and Prices skyrocketed. When you consider an average price of $65k for 964 C2 more for Targas and Cabs and $110k for a turbo that was stupid money back in the early 90's when the economy was in the toilet and the big rage were SUV's. Hell if Porsche came out with a Cayenne in 1992 they probably would have sold more than they do today.

Good Luck in whatever you chose to do. If it were me I would start driving as many as I can before I jump.

rusnak

The 993 was designed after a particularly introspective Porsche asked itself why the 964 was not selling. Peter Falk was said to have said it concisely: agility. A Porsche 911 needs to feel agile, and the 964 was thought to lack that feeling. Hence, the 993 had a completely redesigned rear axle.

cobalt

Typical German response to what was perceived as a failure due to low sales. The 993 took time to catch on but the economy changed and the 993 was less expensive when money was more prevalent. Sales of the 993 are nearly double but that isn't saying much.

The rear axle is what kills it for me. Takes all the fun out of a 911. Agile yeah that is not how I would describe it.

myflat6

Cobalt, you have beautiful cars - in particular your 964's. I would say, however, that you seem to be the exception these days when it comes to the 964 community. I, like you, love the styling of the 964 - however, it seems most people aren't buying 964's for what they are - they want to make them something else. It is so rare to see a well preserved mostly stock (some tasteful mods - I am not that boring) 964 today. So how many truly love the 964 for what it is?

If I could own one of each generation I would. They are all so very different. If you want highly involved driving - it is the early cars. Having driven all of them, and as a 993 owner, I would say that the redesign of the rear end does make a dramatic difference. To me the 993 captures the authentic spirit of the vintage 911, but has just enough improvements to make it feel somewhat modern and comfortable when driving. In addition to keeping the rear end more planted, a 6 speed gearbox, 'real' mufflers (haha), the exhilarating sound and feel of the varioram when it opens up through the revs, excellent lighting of the road with litronics, great AC and fantastic chassis rigidity. The rear end of the 993 is the sexiest from Porsche IMHO, but I still love the pontoons on the 964.

I completely agree with you that the 964 - especially 92-94 - will continue to become harder and harder to find - especially in mostly original condition.

Anyway, we are getting way off topic in this thread!

cobalt

No pissing match intended. If he wants to trade his 964 for a 3.2 or whatever that is up to him. I wish him luck.

I do find it interesting that I have been helping people buy all sorts of Porsche's over the years and there are two distinct groups that either love or hate the 964. Lately I have more people asking advice regarding buying 964's than any other air cooled. I know many who have recently added them to their collection, are their first 911 or refuse to part with them.

I have owned them all except a 993. I do agree it does have a sexy butt. But the things most 993 guys list as improvements are of little importance to me. These are all just platforms and pick the one you like. It would appear the 964 covers more interests and has become more modified than most but in the end it is still a 964 and the little stuff is what you make of it. You can live with or make any of these cars exhilarating and fun to drive.

I don't know his car or condition and who is to say it is good or bad but if it is clean accident free car and he trades he might have a hard time finding another. Those that seem to have clean examples aren't letting go and the rest are being back dated. Soon there won't be many to choose from. That is one thing you can't quite say about the other air-cooled 911's.

Spyerx

This is how I rate my keeper status of my cars:

RS
964
G body

This is all based on a hard drivers perspective. Not really looks or whatever. It's the one I feel most connected to when driving it at its limit (or more often MY limit)

RS is my track toy
964 is canyon carver and occasional track toy
G body is my PCH cruiser and date car w/ the wife

The stock G body cars are stupid fun to drive. They "FEEL" old, but they are slow compared to anything that came after them. Sure you can hot rod one, or better put a 3.2 in a long hood light body. But if your 964 is in good running tune I think you may find the 3.2 a little lethargic. That said, I feel the stock 964 is a soft, slushy car, less so than a 993, but, it's not got the edge I like. Mine isn't so stock. Feels like a mini RS with 150 less HP.

That said, I wouldn't sell any of mine.

myflat6

Definitely lucky to have all of those beauties in your garage! I really haven't wanted to own a water pumper (I grew up on old VW bugs and busses and migrated to Porsches), but I will say that the performance of the newer water-cooled Porsches is staggering when compared to the old cars I like. I have driven a few variants and couldn't believe how much the car changed, so I cannot blame you for your feelings on the RS. Maybe I could convince myself to get a 996GT3, but I really hate those headlights and slab sidedness.

Spyerx

I kind of feel same on 996, but i actually like the skinny look. Whats interesting is my 964 and RS feel very similar (both have total monoball race suspension) now, maybe 964 is little sharper, RS a lot more grip and of course stupid power (the 991 are even like 2 levels more insane, like going from 993c2 to 996 GT3).

That said, the G body cars are awesome and fun. But in a different kind of way. On the street I like driving the old cars the best. You can push them and "feel" faster and much, much safer speeds compared to the new cars. I think the newer cars 996/7+ you really need to be on a track to enjoy them properly. And man are they fun.

To the OP, I wouldn't trade. i'd have both! :-)

tcabler

After all that I am reading, I think I would be crazy to trade my 964 for a 3.2. Sounds like the 964 is becoming more highly valued by the day. Besides a needed valve adjustment, my 964 is in impeccable condition inside and out. And like they say, better to have the devil you know than the devil you don't.

r911

face it the 964 is a blob-mobile

not that the bumper cars aren't also fugly

at least the 964 doesn't have sugar scoops