sad realization
03-08-2015, 06:53 PM
#1
sad realization
I have just about given up the hunt for a decent running sc or 3.2 for under $20,000 by the time I see an ad posted only hours ago flippers are already on the job buying them all, I can't compete with them all. Sad for me but great for others the way the air-cooled market is going.
03-08-2015, 08:40 PM
#3
Team Owner
People use pretty fancy tools these days to be alerted about cars for sale. You will have to hang in there and maybe post some wanted to buy adds
Last edited by theiceman; 03-08-2015 at 10:43 PM.
03-08-2015, 08:56 PM
#4
If this is what you want, its not out of hand.
These cars are becoming more and more expensive, but do some basic finance.
First, depreciation is the greatest cost of owning a car, and these cars are unlikely to depreciate.
Second, you can get collector car insurance on the car, and save maybe $500 per year.
Third, you can get financing on collector cars... I'm not big fan of financing a depreciating asset, but financing an appreciating asset is not a bad idea.
Smart people have figured this out which is one reason why collector car prices are going through the roof.
Buying a 3.2 is not speculating on a penny stock or going to Vegas. You are acquiring something of lasting value that will give you joy for a decade.
It may cost $30K or more to buy a good one, butif you plan to keep it and drive it spending a few $K extra for a really nice car is money well spent.
These cars are becoming more and more expensive, but do some basic finance.
First, depreciation is the greatest cost of owning a car, and these cars are unlikely to depreciate.
Second, you can get collector car insurance on the car, and save maybe $500 per year.
Third, you can get financing on collector cars... I'm not big fan of financing a depreciating asset, but financing an appreciating asset is not a bad idea.
Smart people have figured this out which is one reason why collector car prices are going through the roof.
Buying a 3.2 is not speculating on a penny stock or going to Vegas. You are acquiring something of lasting value that will give you joy for a decade.
It may cost $30K or more to buy a good one, butif you plan to keep it and drive it spending a few $K extra for a really nice car is money well spent.
03-10-2015, 02:08 PM
#6
Realistically, to get a good car today will cost closer to $30K, but don't give up hope. Some angles.
First, I'd focus on an SC. Typically they sell for $1-2K less than a comparable 3.2, and are virtually identical IMHO.
Second, if you are a reasonably handy, there is a lot of work on these cars that you can do yourself, so for under $20K, you can buy a solid driver with some issues and fix it up as time and money allow.
Lots of cosmetic stuff like scuffed wheels, worn upholstery, etc do not impact the car's function, and can be repaired relatively cheaply if you do it yourself.
If you are ambitious, and like doing mechanical work, you can rebuild the brakes, drop the engine, replace the clutch, fix oil leaks, and even do do a top-end rebuild (an SC with broken head-studs can still be purchased at a major discount).
Although parts are not cheap, most if the cost of this stuff is labor, and with the right tools, they are not that difficult to work on if you take your time and do your research.
However, I would steer clear of any car that did not have a near perfect body. While faded paint can always be re-painted (although not cheap) any rust or major accident repair would be a deal breaker.
Finally, do not rule out a 2.7. Although I'm not a huge fan of the narrow body, these are really nice cars, and typically sell for $5-10K less than a comparable 3.2... just make sure it is straight, rust-free, and the engine has received the typical updates (time-certs, etc).
My guess is the 2.7 will continue to keep pace, or even outpace the 911 market, so it is not a bad buy right now.
Keep looking.
First, I'd focus on an SC. Typically they sell for $1-2K less than a comparable 3.2, and are virtually identical IMHO.
Second, if you are a reasonably handy, there is a lot of work on these cars that you can do yourself, so for under $20K, you can buy a solid driver with some issues and fix it up as time and money allow.
Lots of cosmetic stuff like scuffed wheels, worn upholstery, etc do not impact the car's function, and can be repaired relatively cheaply if you do it yourself.
If you are ambitious, and like doing mechanical work, you can rebuild the brakes, drop the engine, replace the clutch, fix oil leaks, and even do do a top-end rebuild (an SC with broken head-studs can still be purchased at a major discount).
Although parts are not cheap, most if the cost of this stuff is labor, and with the right tools, they are not that difficult to work on if you take your time and do your research.
However, I would steer clear of any car that did not have a near perfect body. While faded paint can always be re-painted (although not cheap) any rust or major accident repair would be a deal breaker.
Finally, do not rule out a 2.7. Although I'm not a huge fan of the narrow body, these are really nice cars, and typically sell for $5-10K less than a comparable 3.2... just make sure it is straight, rust-free, and the engine has received the typical updates (time-certs, etc).
My guess is the 2.7 will continue to keep pace, or even outpace the 911 market, so it is not a bad buy right now.
Keep looking.
03-10-2015, 04:29 PM
#7
Intermediate
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: PA
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Hang in there.
I spent a year and a half searching for the right car and also found myself getting constantly beat to the punch by flippers and German exporters. Scrolling craigslist, forums, everywhere... the whole right half of the country...
Then one day, out of the blue, a car popped up 20 minutes from my house. By the time I got there, the seller already had Germans on the line waiting to wire funds. We got to talking, and eventually he decided he'd rather sell the car to me!
Anyway, keep looking! You'll find one soon enough.
I spent a year and a half searching for the right car and also found myself getting constantly beat to the punch by flippers and German exporters. Scrolling craigslist, forums, everywhere... the whole right half of the country...
Then one day, out of the blue, a car popped up 20 minutes from my house. By the time I got there, the seller already had Germans on the line waiting to wire funds. We got to talking, and eventually he decided he'd rather sell the car to me!
Anyway, keep looking! You'll find one soon enough.
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03-10-2015, 07:38 PM
#8
Just cont to look and save to bump the budget up. I found a decent low mileage SC last year around 20k. I will have close to 5k into by summer. I wonder if I should have just spent the 25 up front and bought a car needing less work. For 20k be ready to buy a car with a few issues, unless you get lucky. I've repaired a bunch of items myself, but had to pay for a few. Good luck.
03-10-2015, 07:42 PM
#9
O and put down a deposit if your sure you ate buying the car. I made a deal on 2 cars last year only to have the seller back out that same night for a better offer. One was on this site. Drove 100 miles after work. Had a hand shake deal for sale amount. Had owner call the next morning to advise car was sold to someone else. I had already called out of work and borrowed dealer plates from a friend to get car home. People are really dishonest when it comes to money.
03-10-2015, 08:57 PM
#10
2.7's are out of the picture because of the narrow body and the less than reliable engine, with me living in Cali it just makes things worse with smog. I appreciate the advise and positive owner experiences, persistence will pay off I hope.
03-10-2015, 09:55 PM
#11
Pro
Join Date: Jun 2006
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NOT FOR SALE
1987 Targa
58000 miles
Second owner
No Wrecks
4 of 5 original paint - Marine Blau Metallic
New reupholstered targa top from Lakewell - Belgium
New Bilstein HD shocks and struts (Turbo) front suspension
New ball joints
New front wheel bearings
New Genuine Porsche - not zimmer- front and rear rotors
New Pagid Orange or Black
New rebuilt calipers front and rear
New ATE master cylinder
DEKA light weight battery
Lemforder (Turbo) tie rods
Sander aka Elephant Racing 22 mm hollow front torsion bars
Wevo aluminum strut brace
Wevo Camber King strut plates
Momo steering wheel
Recaro Profi XL fiberglass seats
Bray Kraus seat mounts
Stroth 6 point harness driver and passenger
Bray Kraus Harness Bar "Targa"
WEVO/Ohlins adjustable rear shocks
Sander aka Elephant Racing 29mm rear torsion bars
New oil lines
New fuel lines
New rebuilt fuel injectors
New Kaaz limited slip differential
1974 BBS Mahle 15" wheels with nearly new Toyo 225 50 15
New Kumho 225x50x15 mounted to original Fuchs
New oil return tubes
No oil leaks
Dansk flanged pipe as substitute for catalytic converter
What doesn't work:
Heater/engine blower control switch.
Best modification:
Front suspension - Bilstein struts and HD shocks ie. Turbo option
Rear suspension - WEVO Ohlins Adjustable rear shocks
Gear Box - KAAZ LSD
--------------------------------------------
Parts For Sale On Pelican Classified - 911 used parts
search: "Used Parts w/pictures" original tie rods with boots $69 + freight
search: "Full set BBS/Mahle 15" Wheels & RA1's" $650 + freight
search: "For Sale New sander hollow torsion bars" (23 f/31 r) $797 delivered
search: "car numbers for sale" $69 + freight
search: "Solo Track Timer for sale" $325 delivered
search: "1987 Carrera 3.2 liter oil pipes" $69 + freight
All prices are negotiable. No harm in asking.
1987 Targa
58000 miles
Second owner
No Wrecks
4 of 5 original paint - Marine Blau Metallic
New reupholstered targa top from Lakewell - Belgium
New Bilstein HD shocks and struts (Turbo) front suspension
New ball joints
New front wheel bearings
New Genuine Porsche - not zimmer- front and rear rotors
New Pagid Orange or Black
New rebuilt calipers front and rear
New ATE master cylinder
DEKA light weight battery
Lemforder (Turbo) tie rods
Sander aka Elephant Racing 22 mm hollow front torsion bars
Wevo aluminum strut brace
Wevo Camber King strut plates
Momo steering wheel
Recaro Profi XL fiberglass seats
Bray Kraus seat mounts
Stroth 6 point harness driver and passenger
Bray Kraus Harness Bar "Targa"
WEVO/Ohlins adjustable rear shocks
Sander aka Elephant Racing 29mm rear torsion bars
New oil lines
New fuel lines
New rebuilt fuel injectors
New Kaaz limited slip differential
1974 BBS Mahle 15" wheels with nearly new Toyo 225 50 15
New Kumho 225x50x15 mounted to original Fuchs
New oil return tubes
No oil leaks
Dansk flanged pipe as substitute for catalytic converter
What doesn't work:
Heater/engine blower control switch.
Best modification:
Front suspension - Bilstein struts and HD shocks ie. Turbo option
Rear suspension - WEVO Ohlins Adjustable rear shocks
Gear Box - KAAZ LSD
--------------------------------------------
Parts For Sale On Pelican Classified - 911 used parts
search: "Used Parts w/pictures" original tie rods with boots $69 + freight
search: "Full set BBS/Mahle 15" Wheels & RA1's" $650 + freight
search: "For Sale New sander hollow torsion bars" (23 f/31 r) $797 delivered
search: "car numbers for sale" $69 + freight
search: "Solo Track Timer for sale" $325 delivered
search: "1987 Carrera 3.2 liter oil pipes" $69 + freight
All prices are negotiable. No harm in asking.
Last edited by sig_a; 03-14-2015 at 04:04 PM. Reason: corrections
03-11-2015, 07:32 PM
#12
Rennlist Member
911661, Lots of good advice and angles posted. As you know you can find a really well maintained/sorted car at the around the 30K mark and these should have very little to address after purchase. So top-end rebuild with all updated parts, a/c upgrade, etc already completed with good body,paint and interior condition. It is pretty easy to spend 10K (unless you can do a lot yourself) to get a car in great driving shape so it becomes a bit of pay me now or pay me later. 20K down and 10K finance puts you in a great car! Good luck, keep looking
03-13-2015, 06:23 PM
#14
Hang in there. There are still G50 values out there. I just bought an 88 carrera needing work off pelican for 16k. Tired out to be a very solid car. I looked for 4 months of doing the same searches.
03-15-2015, 12:43 PM
#15
keep looking
Below $20k, you are really looking at the low end of the market. I'm skeptical you will find a nice car at that price.
Add another $5k, and you've got a way better shot at it. There's a ton of expensive crap out there, and people are buying lousy SC's in the low to high $30's, but it doesn't have to be you.
If you're really serious, you've got to do the leg work, not just the keyboard. Get out and visit the Porsche shops, go to PCA events, auto crosses, DE's, socials. The Porsche mechanics have a lot of contacts. They see cars and buyers/sellers everyday.
I'm willing to bet that if you worked your local PCA clubs hard, and attended all their events for the next 9 months, made it a job to get to know all your local Porsche specialist shops in your area and also worked your own contacts and also the 'net, you'll have a car in your garage by next December.
Good luck.
Nick
Add another $5k, and you've got a way better shot at it. There's a ton of expensive crap out there, and people are buying lousy SC's in the low to high $30's, but it doesn't have to be you.
If you're really serious, you've got to do the leg work, not just the keyboard. Get out and visit the Porsche shops, go to PCA events, auto crosses, DE's, socials. The Porsche mechanics have a lot of contacts. They see cars and buyers/sellers everyday.
I'm willing to bet that if you worked your local PCA clubs hard, and attended all their events for the next 9 months, made it a job to get to know all your local Porsche specialist shops in your area and also worked your own contacts and also the 'net, you'll have a car in your garage by next December.
Good luck.
Nick