Attempting to buy a 3.2,having second thoughts
01-29-2019, 06:32 PM
#61
Rennlist Member
I still prefer a 901. It's still my "favorite" box. 1st out of "the pattern"!
01-29-2019, 07:30 PM
#62
Three Wheelin'
Ya well I'm a 915 fan but key words are "set up right" and "well tuned" 915, many don't know how to build them properly. I can count great 915 builders with one hand.
01-29-2019, 09:11 PM
#63
Advanced
Thread Starter
Care to share? I'm in the DFW area, and if I do end up with a 915 knowing who can set it up right would be great.
01-30-2019, 10:08 PM
#65
Rennlist Member
So this has become a 915 v G50 gearbox thread? As we all know Porsche is about development, improvements. It doesn't always mean later versions are better than previous versions. But let's trust Porsche in this case back in the 80's. They had the 915, they introduced the G50 with a hydraulic clutch, they would say... advancement, improvement. I agree.
01-31-2019, 09:38 PM
#66
Allow me to settle this 915 vs. G50 with my verbal sledgehammer.
A correctly adjusted and serviced 915 is a perfectly good gearbox. It was in production for the better part of 2 decades. It is not defective. It was not recalled. It was not subject to lemon laws. Contrary to internet folklore, remarkably, it actually does shifts the gears. Go figure! Are you going to be shifting with lighting precision where every 1/10 second counts? No, you are not. If you were, you wouldn't be looking at a 30 year old car in the first place, and you'd be driving a modern car with triple the horsepower and PDK, like the pros. If you get a 915 and it's worn out or needing adjustment, just get that fixed. Reliability of the G50 vs 915? The bottom line is that if either gearbox needs service, you're looking at thousands to get it fixed.
If you can operate a clutch, you can drive a 915. Period. Sure, it might take a minute to adjust to the heavier pedal and looser throw, but it's just a gearbox, not some arcane medieval abacus contraption that people can't operate without an long apprenticeship and flight training. The internet anti-hype surrounding the 915 borders on ludicrous. I don't have to pause between gears when shifting my 915 gearbox. I just shift. I can also shift into 1st while rolling to a stop. Unless a pre-G50 tranny is defective or badly in need or service, anyone can drive it.
Here is a premise worth considering. Some buyers say they are used to a modern Honda gearbox, and that's why they prefer to find a G50. I'll suggest that the entire point of getting an air cooled 911 (and paying top dollar for the privilege) is to have a vintage "leather goggles" driving experience. No power steering. Suspension firmness opposite of "floaty sofa". Mechanical clutch. No nanny assist or stereo or DVD player or Navigation. An exhaust rumble. Even an oil dipstick! The very point of buying an old 911 is that it's nothing like your modern convenient Honda, and that it's different. In that regard, a 915 gearbox is more authentically vintage than a G50 anyway. The guy that wants a modern gearbox probably would not be happy in a 30 year old car in the first place, and might prefer a 997, right?
In general, there is too much "Road & Track" data specification analysis/paralysis out there, and not enough test driving. How large is your search radius? You might want to increase it to 2-3 hours. Once you drive these cars, you will see the differences are trivial for road driving. Shopping for cars is a fun journey, but to pull the trigger, the first step is to forget about the G50 vs. 915 debate. Comparing weight of an SC and 3.2 is also very academic. For 99% of your driving, the differences are moot.
After you decide on '78-'89 or just '84-'89, shopping for your car is not like ticking off a "build sheet" for a new $150k car you are ordering from the factory. You are limited by real world constraints of what is available and crosses your path, even if you plan to budget $1000 for each car you jump on a plane to visit. Make it your goal to physically view 5 cars soon. With that, you will get a better sense of what is out there, because when the right car comes around, you are not going to have time to dilly dally and think about it. It will be sold from right under you. You need to get to a place where you know the market, the basic range of condition of cars out there, and be ready with a stack of cash.
The last word in this discussion is to buy your SC or 3.2 in the right condition and history, from the right owner, within your search radius, at a price you're comfortable with.
A correctly adjusted and serviced 915 is a perfectly good gearbox. It was in production for the better part of 2 decades. It is not defective. It was not recalled. It was not subject to lemon laws. Contrary to internet folklore, remarkably, it actually does shifts the gears. Go figure! Are you going to be shifting with lighting precision where every 1/10 second counts? No, you are not. If you were, you wouldn't be looking at a 30 year old car in the first place, and you'd be driving a modern car with triple the horsepower and PDK, like the pros. If you get a 915 and it's worn out or needing adjustment, just get that fixed. Reliability of the G50 vs 915? The bottom line is that if either gearbox needs service, you're looking at thousands to get it fixed.
If you can operate a clutch, you can drive a 915. Period. Sure, it might take a minute to adjust to the heavier pedal and looser throw, but it's just a gearbox, not some arcane medieval abacus contraption that people can't operate without an long apprenticeship and flight training. The internet anti-hype surrounding the 915 borders on ludicrous. I don't have to pause between gears when shifting my 915 gearbox. I just shift. I can also shift into 1st while rolling to a stop. Unless a pre-G50 tranny is defective or badly in need or service, anyone can drive it.
Here is a premise worth considering. Some buyers say they are used to a modern Honda gearbox, and that's why they prefer to find a G50. I'll suggest that the entire point of getting an air cooled 911 (and paying top dollar for the privilege) is to have a vintage "leather goggles" driving experience. No power steering. Suspension firmness opposite of "floaty sofa". Mechanical clutch. No nanny assist or stereo or DVD player or Navigation. An exhaust rumble. Even an oil dipstick! The very point of buying an old 911 is that it's nothing like your modern convenient Honda, and that it's different. In that regard, a 915 gearbox is more authentically vintage than a G50 anyway. The guy that wants a modern gearbox probably would not be happy in a 30 year old car in the first place, and might prefer a 997, right?
In general, there is too much "Road & Track" data specification analysis/paralysis out there, and not enough test driving. How large is your search radius? You might want to increase it to 2-3 hours. Once you drive these cars, you will see the differences are trivial for road driving. Shopping for cars is a fun journey, but to pull the trigger, the first step is to forget about the G50 vs. 915 debate. Comparing weight of an SC and 3.2 is also very academic. For 99% of your driving, the differences are moot.
After you decide on '78-'89 or just '84-'89, shopping for your car is not like ticking off a "build sheet" for a new $150k car you are ordering from the factory. You are limited by real world constraints of what is available and crosses your path, even if you plan to budget $1000 for each car you jump on a plane to visit. Make it your goal to physically view 5 cars soon. With that, you will get a better sense of what is out there, because when the right car comes around, you are not going to have time to dilly dally and think about it. It will be sold from right under you. You need to get to a place where you know the market, the basic range of condition of cars out there, and be ready with a stack of cash.
The last word in this discussion is to buy your SC or 3.2 in the right condition and history, from the right owner, within your search radius, at a price you're comfortable with.
02-01-2019, 01:49 AM
#68
Allow me to settle this 915 vs. G50 with my verbal sledgehammer.
A correctly adjusted and serviced 915 is a perfectly good gearbox. It was in production for the better part of 2 decades. It is not defective. It was not recalled. It was not subject to lemon laws. Contrary to internet folklore, remarkably, it actually does shifts the gears. Go figure! Are you going to be shifting with lighting precision where every 1/10 second counts? No, you are not. If you were, you wouldn't be looking at a 30 year old car in the first place, and you'd be driving a modern car with triple the horsepower and PDK, like the pros. If you get a 915 and it's worn out or needing adjustment, just get that fixed. Reliability of the G50 vs 915? The bottom line is that if either gearbox needs service, you're looking at thousands to get it fixed.
If you can operate a clutch, you can drive a 915. Period. Sure, it might take a minute to adjust to the heavier pedal and looser throw, but it's just a gearbox, not some arcane medieval abacus contraption that people can't operate without an long apprenticeship and flight training. The internet anti-hype surrounding the 915 borders on ludicrous. I don't have to pause between gears when shifting my 915 gearbox. I just shift. I can also shift into 1st while rolling to a stop. Unless a pre-G50 tranny is defective or badly in need or service, anyone can drive it.
Here is a premise worth considering. Some buyers say they are used to a modern Honda gearbox, and that's why they prefer to find a G50. I'll suggest that the entire point of getting an air cooled 911 (and paying top dollar for the privilege) is to have a vintage "leather goggles" driving experience. No power steering. Suspension firmness opposite of "floaty sofa". Mechanical clutch. No nanny assist or stereo or DVD player or Navigation. An exhaust rumble. Even an oil dipstick! The very point of buying an old 911 is that it's nothing like your modern convenient Honda, and that it's different. In that regard, a 915 gearbox is more authentically vintage than a G50 anyway. The guy that wants a modern gearbox probably would not be happy in a 30 year old car in the first place, and might prefer a 997, right?
In general, there is too much "Road & Track" data specification analysis/paralysis out there, and not enough test driving. How large is your search radius? You might want to increase it to 2-3 hours. Once you drive these cars, you will see the differences are trivial for road driving. Shopping for cars is a fun journey, but to pull the trigger, the first step is to forget about the G50 vs. 915 debate. Comparing weight of an SC and 3.2 is also very academic. For 99% of your driving, the differences are moot.
After you decide on '78-'89 or just '84-'89, shopping for your car is not like ticking off a "build sheet" for a new $150k car you are ordering from the factory. You are limited by real world constraints of what is available and crosses your path, even if you plan to budget $1000 for each car you jump on a plane to visit. Make it your goal to physically view 5 cars soon. With that, you will get a better sense of what is out there, because when the right car comes around, you are not going to have time to dilly dally and think about it. It will be sold from right under you. You need to get to a place where you know the market, the basic range of condition of cars out there, and be ready with a stack of cash.
The last word in this discussion is to buy your SC or 3.2 in the right condition and history, from the right owner, within your search radius, at a price you're comfortable with.
A correctly adjusted and serviced 915 is a perfectly good gearbox. It was in production for the better part of 2 decades. It is not defective. It was not recalled. It was not subject to lemon laws. Contrary to internet folklore, remarkably, it actually does shifts the gears. Go figure! Are you going to be shifting with lighting precision where every 1/10 second counts? No, you are not. If you were, you wouldn't be looking at a 30 year old car in the first place, and you'd be driving a modern car with triple the horsepower and PDK, like the pros. If you get a 915 and it's worn out or needing adjustment, just get that fixed. Reliability of the G50 vs 915? The bottom line is that if either gearbox needs service, you're looking at thousands to get it fixed.
If you can operate a clutch, you can drive a 915. Period. Sure, it might take a minute to adjust to the heavier pedal and looser throw, but it's just a gearbox, not some arcane medieval abacus contraption that people can't operate without an long apprenticeship and flight training. The internet anti-hype surrounding the 915 borders on ludicrous. I don't have to pause between gears when shifting my 915 gearbox. I just shift. I can also shift into 1st while rolling to a stop. Unless a pre-G50 tranny is defective or badly in need or service, anyone can drive it.
Here is a premise worth considering. Some buyers say they are used to a modern Honda gearbox, and that's why they prefer to find a G50. I'll suggest that the entire point of getting an air cooled 911 (and paying top dollar for the privilege) is to have a vintage "leather goggles" driving experience. No power steering. Suspension firmness opposite of "floaty sofa". Mechanical clutch. No nanny assist or stereo or DVD player or Navigation. An exhaust rumble. Even an oil dipstick! The very point of buying an old 911 is that it's nothing like your modern convenient Honda, and that it's different. In that regard, a 915 gearbox is more authentically vintage than a G50 anyway. The guy that wants a modern gearbox probably would not be happy in a 30 year old car in the first place, and might prefer a 997, right?
In general, there is too much "Road & Track" data specification analysis/paralysis out there, and not enough test driving. How large is your search radius? You might want to increase it to 2-3 hours. Once you drive these cars, you will see the differences are trivial for road driving. Shopping for cars is a fun journey, but to pull the trigger, the first step is to forget about the G50 vs. 915 debate. Comparing weight of an SC and 3.2 is also very academic. For 99% of your driving, the differences are moot.
After you decide on '78-'89 or just '84-'89, shopping for your car is not like ticking off a "build sheet" for a new $150k car you are ordering from the factory. You are limited by real world constraints of what is available and crosses your path, even if you plan to budget $1000 for each car you jump on a plane to visit. Make it your goal to physically view 5 cars soon. With that, you will get a better sense of what is out there, because when the right car comes around, you are not going to have time to dilly dally and think about it. It will be sold from right under you. You need to get to a place where you know the market, the basic range of condition of cars out there, and be ready with a stack of cash.
The last word in this discussion is to buy your SC or 3.2 in the right condition and history, from the right owner, within your search radius, at a price you're comfortable with.
Excellent post and well said, i could not have said it better myself. Excellent advice
02-01-2019, 02:28 AM
#69
As we all know Porsche is about development of their markets, improvements to the bottom line.
Over the years, their buyers changed - at least for the new cars.
Now, let's all go buy an SUV.
Over the years, their buyers changed - at least for the new cars.
Now, let's all go buy an SUV.
02-01-2019, 08:42 AM
#70
Rennlist Member
Words to live by..... If you can't go look DO NOT BUY. There is no substitute.
02-01-2019, 01:28 PM
#71
Rennlist Member
I agree with Sugarwood's general attitude toward the gearbox choices, though I think calling a G50 a modern transmission and/or comparing it to a Honda is going a little too far. But, I'll echo the idea to focus on the condition of the car and not the gearbox. This tired debate has been going on for more than two decades.
02-01-2019, 01:56 PM
#72
Advanced
Thread Starter
Thanks for all the responses, all. I think this thread was a good one and hopefully can serve for future porsche owners. As I stated earlier, I'm not really concerned about the 915 vs G50 since this car is going to be a weekend car, anyway. I have a comfortable daily driver that I don't have to struggle with shifting.
Before researching into the whole 3.2 I pretty much wrote off the SC because I actually already searched threads of the SC vs the 3.2 and most people said that the CIS just a complicated system and that the Motronic in the 3.2s is well worth the premium.
Before researching into the whole 3.2 I pretty much wrote off the SC because I actually already searched threads of the SC vs the 3.2 and most people said that the CIS just a complicated system and that the Motronic in the 3.2s is well worth the premium.
02-01-2019, 04:17 PM
#74
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I will throw my hat into the ring here. I currently have an '84. The 1984 3.2 is like a 911SC but has EFI. The radio antenna is still on the fender, the seats, dash, etc are all basically an SC. The '85 seemed to have gotten the antenna in the windshield and electric upgraded seats. The '86 got the new dash with the bigger vents of the later 87-89s. I have owned an 86 Targa, an 84 Targa, and an 89 coupe. I don't mind the 915 at all. Sometimes I wish it had that spring thing that kept the stick centered though. The G50 feels really good to shift with nice cha'clunk sounds throwing it into the gears. I don't like to shift quickly so I guess it doesn't bother me with the travel both transmissions require for a shift. I like to kinda savor the shift.
I like the spring loaded clutch pedal more than the hydraulic of the g50 cars. It feels way easier to push the pedal and shift. I remember the G50 totally wearing me out in traffic with the hydraulic clutch. If this were my first 911 I would recommend an 87-89 coupe with the G50. The second 911 to buy after that should be a targa with a 915. The only solution is to just own both
I like the spring loaded clutch pedal more than the hydraulic of the g50 cars. It feels way easier to push the pedal and shift. I remember the G50 totally wearing me out in traffic with the hydraulic clutch. If this were my first 911 I would recommend an 87-89 coupe with the G50. The second 911 to buy after that should be a targa with a 915. The only solution is to just own both
02-02-2019, 10:12 AM
#75
Burning Brakes
I read this entire thread with a smile. By my standards, none of you drive early 911s. I race a 1967 with 901 gearbox. No power anything. The only chip in the car runs the transponder. That is the 911 experience.
Rich
Rich