hrennry

Hi All,

Youngin here - joined Rennlist as I just signed a buyer contract on a 1984 Targa and I'm looking for some sound advice on ownership and thoughts on the purchase. Please help and note that I am on a very tight budget.

Background: Found an acquaintance in town who is very trustworthy and wanted the car to go to someone he knew. Transfer of ownership will most likely happen in August or Sept.

Year:1984
Model: 911 Carrera Targa 3.2
Color: Shieferblau Metallic
Miles: Est. 90k miles --> Odometer broke at 74,148 (Seller who I know and is trustworthy has put an estimated 15k miles on since odometer stopped working)
Price: $20k with downpayment and 3 mo. payment plan while owner holds car (I AM ON A VERY TIGHT BUDGET)
History: Purchased by seller 17 years ago with 18k miles (I will be third owner)

Inspection: Before purchasing I had an inspection done at a reputable foreign car shop with tons of Porsche, BMW, MB work as it is in a wealthy, car enthusiast populated area. Note that I did not do a "cylinder falloff test?" (is that what they are called?) or go to a top tier Porsche guru as people suggested (ignorance is bliss at this price?)

Inspection Results: Link to inspection results with if you would be so kind as to take a peek.
Below is recommendation: Note that the car is running well - I have driven it once or twice and the owner drives it in to town once a week - starts immediately.

• All rubber brake hoses are dry rotted. Recomend to replace hoses and flush brake system
• Oil pressure gauge goes to full with key on but engine off. Will require diagnosis.
• Right turn siganl indicator on dash does not work but signal light is working.
• All 4 tires are low on tread. Recommend 4 new tires and 4 wheel aligment.
• Left low beam is not working. Possible may just need a new bulb. Rear speakers are worn out & front speakers inoperative.
• Rear trunk insulation falling down, will need new insulation
• hood and trunk struts failed - will need struts.
• Oil seepage around right side cylinder head, seepage around oil line to right side cylinder head. Oil seepage around left cylinder head, both sides of crankcase heavy oil buildup around transmission
• oil scavenge line heavily corroded - will need replacement . Recommend to clean off oil from leaks to determine location and severity. Can replace transmission line when oil leak is repaired.
• Front suspension struts are worn out. Recommend to replace front suspension struts and strut mounts. Perform 4 wheel alignement.
• Exhuast header flanges, catalytic converter flanges and rear muffler show heavy corrosion. No visable exhaust leaks at this time.
• Due for 60K mile service if not done - 90% sure it was done by previous owner
• Total Estimated Cost: $5k

Note: The mechanic followed up saying that he would recommend a gasket head seep and service overhaul costing an additional $18K (Yikes)

What I'm hoping for thoughts/feedback/advice on (Remember - tight budget):

• Was it a good purchase - objectively speaking? What would you pay for it?
• What would you do first and foremost in terms repair?
• What else would you prioritize knowing I don't care about AC or stereo - JUST WANT TO KEEP THE THING DRIVING!
• What should be my biggest concern?
• If transfer of ownership will be in august or sept - what should I do to prepare for owning a 80's 911
• I can't find much info online about the 84 year - what would be its model code (i.e 991, 996, 930?)
• Is this color, year, combo rare? Do you see the car gaining value?
• Any other advice, thoughts, opinions, steps I should take would be greatly appreciated

The seller has kept a detailed log of services, etc. and still has it in his possession, so I likely won't be able to answer any history questions but I do trust he has put in somewhat of an effort to keep this car in OK shape.

Thanks sincerely

Auto_Werks 3.6

Seems like a low price, and the seller is willing to finance / hold the car, which gives me pause to wonder if he knows the condition is suspect, and will have trouble selling to a more savvy, well funded buyer. Personally I would NEVER hold or self finance a car, because I'd rather just wait for the right buyer and let the car sell itself.

Ignorance is never bliss with an old porsche. You want the leak down results, and you need to check to make sure there are no broken head studs. Also a careful check for corrosion of the body sounds warranted since it sounds like everything else underneath is heavily corroded.

It's probably a bad idea for you to buy this on a tight budget, but you're only young once, and I bought my first porsche pretty young... something something, people in glass houses.

Good luck!

Mark Salvetti

Welcome to Rennlist! I looked through the photos, and I think things look about typical. I'm not sure the oil seepage is actually from the heads, at least not where they seal against the cylinders. There are three places in the back of the engine, on top, that are classic oil leak locations (search "triangle of death"). Despite the name, not a hard or particularly expensive fix. These could even explain the oil on the underside of the gearbox.

A Porsche shop PPI probably would have pulled off the lower valve covers to check for broken head studs. That is probably your biggest risk right now (that would mean an engine tear down to replace). Some 3.2L engines needed early valve jobs too.

The recommended fixes are typical. Many of us would tackle those repairs ourselves (except the tires). How handy are you? I would prioritize the brake lines and the tires. Tires look evenly worn, so unless you plan a ton of miles this summer, consider holding off the alignment until you replace the front struts and bushings (since you'll need an alignment after that). Good winter project, you could do that yourself.

Not sure what their $18K estimate covers. That is more than a reseal, that's a rebuild.

Not clear that they checked for rust in all the right places. Area in the front around the battery and beneath the car where the front A-arms mount would be a concern - battery acid can eat this area. Also you can get a lot of debris collected in front of the rear tires, and that can lead to rust, especially at the bottom of the door lock posts and the rockers. Windshields often leak, and you can have rust under the windshield seal at the lower corners.

Did they drive the car? Would be nice to see an opinion on the gearbox - how well does it shift, do the syncros seem worn.

As to price, unless it has major rust or engine problems, then I think $20K is a bargain. Probably worth at least $30K-$40K. As Auto_Werks suggested though, there is reason to be a little suspicious here.

I think you need the more thorough inspection to know for sure. Or take a chance, if it turns out to be more work than you can afford or do yourself, you could likely resell and get your money back.

Mark

old man neri

I just looked at the pictures.
-The oil leaks look to be coming from the oil return tubes. They can be a bit of a pain to replace but aren't that expensive. $100 total maybe.
-The oil coming from the side of the transmission is interesting. Not sure what seal is letting that go, I don't have experience with the 915 transmission. The problem with it is that it is hard to top off the transmission oil and equally hard to tell if it is low. Easy with engine oil.
-Inspection refers to a 'transmission oil scavenging line'. No idea WTF the tech was referring to.
-The sound pad coming off is par for the course. Least of your concerns.
-Tires....get new tires.
-Trunk struts are easy and relatively cheap.
-Some of the components on the bottom of the car (axles etc) show surface rust. I would echo what the above person said and look for body rust.
-Brake lines are a normal replacement part. They are cheap to purchase. If the brake lines look like that the fuel lines probably need to be replaced as well. They are not cheap nor are they easy to replace.
- Leak down test is a must. If this car needs new valve seals it's expensive. Check for loose head studs when they are doing it. From the sounds of it the tech didn't really do inspection specific to this model. I would get another PPI from someone who knows these cars well. By 'these cars' I mean air-cooled porsches. Not just porsches in general.

This car sounds like it needs a bit of work, if not a lot. If you are on a really tight budget you may not be able to afford the work that is required. Nor anything else that may creep up in the first year of ownership. I know you won't want to hear this but you will be probably better off in the long run waiting for a better car to come along. It will cost you more up front but less in the long.

Colour combo? I don't even know what the inside colour is. It doesn't matter if it was rare or not. Doesn't really affect the value in my opinion. The condition affects the value. The only colour that I have seen consistently affect value a little is red, no one seems to like red. Targas are always cheaper than coupes, will that ever change in the future, are targas currently undervalued? I don't know.

oldskewel

Sounds like a great car. Just in general, these cars are great, not prone to have problems, and all of the things you list are likely to be minor things. Comments below.

theiceman

there is no oil leak at the head, that is rocker shafts and/or return tubes.
I would not be able to get my money out fast enough . This car will be worth easily twice that with some work. buying these cars on a shoestring budget could be problematic.

BTW that is a true 911 Carrera . an iconic car in every regard.

Rod_Ez

Yeah, an aircooled 911 and a tight budget just don't go together.

VRSENVL

hrennry

Love the Cat frost?biting picture - you guys must have been hauling ***. Thank you for my first Rennlist reply.

Anyway -

• I was the one who approached him about selling it initially in October of last year. Personal financing is a favor.
• The car seemed to drive well - don't know how to tell if synchros seemed worn.

Based on feedback below I'm either sitting pretty if I can fix them myself or this thing will be on blocks for the winter until I can afford a repair.

Go to Porsche shop and do PPI Test to make sure there are no broken head studs ASAP and do more thorough check for rust - GOT IT

n8kruger

If you can do some or most of the work you may come out money ahead down the road. Frankly, I think you should see if there any local air cooled 911 owners that could help you. I've been through probably most of the issues your car has and fixed what I can myself. I leave the alignment and air conditioning to the experts but the rest is fair game. Where in the world are you?

hrennry

Thank you for the great (although somewhat inconsistent) advice ALL! May have some follow up questions down the road. I do have some friends/good advisors who have solid knowledge who I think should be ready and willing to help me out.

rsteinjann

You didn't mention anything about the originality or condition of the interior. Obviously most of that are things you can live with, but eventually you'll want to recover the seats, change the carpet, and especially deal with the targa top inside and out. Look for a sagging inner liner and bubble effect from wind when at speed. Cracked dash pad, sagging door arm rests, etc. It seems from my experience that everything comes in denominations of $1000. When I had the targa top recovered with German material and the inner liner replaced it was close to that amount alone. The wind noise and water leaks will drive you crazy, so either leave it off all the time or get it replaced. Also look at the condition of the rubber seals across the windshield and on the targa roll bar. There are replacement parts vs. OEM, but neither are cheap.

gavonder

Sounds like a good deal if you have the time to put in some work. I had an '84 Targa for awhile. I'm in SW CT, where are you?

cairo94507

Welcome to Rennlist. If I were you I would prioritize the repairs needed. Essential safety items first to be able to drive the car w/o it getting you into an accident. Brakes, fuel system integrity, electrical, tires if worn and old, general maintenance issues- be sure the 60K was done and you have receipts to prove it. Please do not run out and buy a $5K stereo system and cram it into the car. Stock condition is where these cars retain their value and desirability. Get the car completely up to date maintenance wise and reliable for you to enjoy driving so you do not get stranded on the freeway on the way to school, etc. Tackle one project at a time. Be patient and don't go into debt to the tackle problems. Cheers and welcome to Porsche ownership.

hrennry

Stereos? We don't need no stinkin stereo! Why do you need a stereo when you have the finest six cylinder German symphony behind you? Cosmetic/interior/stereo are the last things on my list, I just want to keep this car on the road - way down the road I'll pursue refinement, but for now, I don't car if I'm sitting on towels and the dash is held together by duct tape.