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Future of the 718

 
Old 02-09-2019, 05:13 AM
  #91  
minthral
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Actually the 718 looks similar to 981, but its basically all new parts. If you owned a 981, the 718 styling changes give it a completely new vibe, but onlookers probably wont think its different. Its not just a facelift...

Being the 718 GTS is out and GT4 is in the works, I think spyshots on the next iteration will surface in 1 year.

I think all the media hype with Tesla is making people lose grip in the world we live in. Fact is the ICE engine will continue to be used for many many more years. Porsche is releasing an all electric 100k car and there is no reason for them to suddenly make all their cars electric. They will slowly introduce it into their established models when the tech is ready for prime time. The taycan is testing the market and it has high expectations, but it’s not even sold yet. If it is highly demanded, they’ll just increase production and sell more...doesn’t necessarily mean they’ll need to make all their cars electric.

People want SUVs today and even more so if they’re efficient. The cayman/boxster is not a significant part of Porsche’s business, but they need to produce it for marketing reasons. I bet plenty of Macan buyers get the warm fuzzies that they’re buying from a brand that makes sports cars. Wouldn’t happen if all Porsche sold was boring electric cars and SUVs. Others who immediately dismiss the idea of buying a 100k+ 911, can imagine an ‘obtainable’ (60-80k) 2 seater sports car...doesn’t matter if they don’t buy it.

Its no secret that the 992 platform was designed with plans for a hybrid. If the 718 will be going electric, I’m guessing that we’ll see the same trend in the next cayman/boxster revision. Nonetheless, its an good 3-5 years before a hybrid 911 is released. Porsche tends to triggle things down (not up) their model range.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Porsche makes the 718 NA again and markets it more as a fun sports car. The newer 911 is inching closer to ‘luxury GT super car’ (panamera coupe). Having owned a 981 boxster, I will admit that it was a better ‘fun/driver’s car’ than my 911, which is more comfortable, practical, and something that I can easily live with every day. For my (and likely many others) usage, the 911 is better than a cayman/boxster.

Last edited by minthral; 02-09-2019 at 05:33 AM.
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Old 02-09-2019, 10:16 AM
  #92  
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I guess the 981 guys view the 718 as a 981 with a flat four turbo. Whatever.
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Old 02-09-2019, 12:03 PM
  #93  
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Originally Posted by minthral View Post
Actually the 718 looks similar to 981, but its basically all new parts. If you owned a 981, the 718 styling changes give it a completely new vibe, but onlookers probably wont think its different. Its not just a facelift...
One can debate just how extensive a facelift it is. But it's a facelift. It's an updated car on the same platform. It's not even remotely all new parts. The vast majority of the structure beneath the cosmetic outer panels is carried over. Etc.

Would seem you don't understand how Porsche engineers these cars. The 991 and 981 are on the same platform (just like the 987 and 997 were on a shared plaform, which was actually a heavy update of the 986/996 platform - even the 987/997 were not completely new cars). This (the 9x1 platform) was facelifted for the 991.2 and the 982. The 982 is absolutely, positively a facelift and not a new car on a new platform. It is not even close to economically viable for Porsche to make a stand alone new version of the Cayster.
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Old 02-09-2019, 12:46 PM
  #94  
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It was 981 and now its 982 (not 981.2 like the 991). Actually almost all parts are different despite looking similar (especially the outer panels). Maybe since its same structural platform its technically considered a facelift. Seems like a grey considering there are so many changes.

Typically 'facelift' is when minor changes are made. New bumper style lines, updated headlights, updated nav, and etc. Here they rename the range and gave it a completely different engine. For 911's, they're always 911's. Its no longer a boxster or cayman... its a 718 in boxster, cayman, T, GT, or spyder flavor. To make it even more weird, '718' is known to be 4 cylinder and I think they'll be putting flat 6 into it again for the GT version.

Nonetheless, next generation will likely follow same trends as 911 did and I guess that's when technically it will have new platform... 'full redesign.'
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Old 02-09-2019, 02:23 PM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by minthral View Post
Actually almost all parts are different despite looking similar (especially the outer panels). Maybe since its same structural platform its technically considered a facelift. Seems like a grey considering there are so many changes.
No idea where people get this idea from. The 718 has a new engine and some new electronics, the rest is largely cosmetic or fine tuning. The internal structural is the same, it's got all the same suspension arms, all the stuff like radiators, rad fans, condensers, suspension arms, cooling lines, brake lines, all the fixtures and fittings underneath the cosmetic stuff. And so on and so on. It's an updated 981, it really isn't complicated. It's much easier to list what has changed with the 718, because what hasn't changed is far, far ore extensive.

Hell, the 987.2 is just as heavily revised versus the 987.1, arguably more so. The 987.2 got a completely new engine (the F4 in the 718 is derived from the MA1 that debuted in the 9x7 cars and isn't a completely new architecture, whereas the MA1 was completely new when it appeared in the 9x7), it got a new loom, new infotainment, new bumpers front and rear, new front fenders / wings, new lights all round, PDK for the first time - the chanegs were every bit as extensive as 981-982. If the 718 is a new model not a facelift, so is the 987.2. Of course, they are both very obviously facelifts, not new models.
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Old 02-09-2019, 04:50 PM
  #96  
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And the 996 was just a refresh of the 993...

The 718 is its own car. Only connection to the 981 is that they’re both mid engine sports cars with a generally similar body style.
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Old 02-09-2019, 05:24 PM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by Archimedes View Post
And the 996 was just a refresh of the 993...
The 718 is its own car. Only connection to the 981 is that they’re both mid engine sports cars with a generally similar body style.
Good Lord Man. You are the paragon of the horse dying of thirst at the well.

With the exception of the loss of two cylinders (which seems to have happened with the last Cayenne GTS at the mid-cycle refresh) you have failed to provide a single defensible fact on which to base your assertion. You made claims that because of ‘As’ and ‘Bs’ it’s a new car. I’ve pointed out that the ‘As’ are consistent with a refresh, and I’ve asked you to provide examples of any ‘B’ which is remotely relevant and not an example of a “A” and you have not yet successfully done so.

The bottom line - not my bottom line, Porsche’s bottom line - is that, once you go inside the body panels, there are very few parts that are unique to the 718. The vast, vast majority of the actual parts are either 981, 991, or shared with the 991.2. Whereas when you compare 991/981 to 997/987 it is very much not the case.
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Old 02-09-2019, 05:53 PM
  #98  
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The 718 is to the 981 in the same way the 991.2 is to 991.1 (changing from N/A to turbos). Porsche was just trying to figure out how to help dealers justify to their clients about 4-cylinder engines (easier with 991.2 since still 6-cylinder). Hence, they got creative and gave it a new model number. Porsche's model cycles have been around 7 years, with a refresh in between. It makes no economic sense to have 981 for only four years.
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Old 02-09-2019, 06:52 PM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by Archimedes View Post
And the 996 was just a refresh of the 993...

The 718 is its own car. Only connection to the 981 is that they’re both mid engine sports cars with a generally similar body style.
That's exactly where you are wrong.

The 996 was on a new platform, completely unrelated to the 993. The 718 was not. It's on the 9x1 platform, like the 981 and 991.
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Old 02-10-2019, 08:12 AM
  #100  
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Originally Posted by visitador View Post
The 718 is to the 981 in the same way the 991.2 is to 991.1 (changing from N/A to turbos). Porsche was just trying to figure out how to help dealers justify to their clients about 4-cylinder engines (easier with 991.2 since still 6-cylinder). Hence, they got creative and gave it a new model number. Porsche's model cycles have been around 7 years, with a refresh in between. It makes no economic sense to have 981 for only four years.
+1

Just like BMW, major engine changes can occur in facelift models.
The 982 is the mid cycle facelift of the 981. I was surprised they didn't name it 981.2. We now know why: the 981 will live for 1+1/2 model cycles (982 >> 983?) and then be terminated and replaced with a 2-seater EV. If the 982 even gets a refresh, it will be a lot less thorough than the 992.
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Old 02-11-2019, 12:12 PM
  #101  
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It's great you can miss many days in looking at some of these threads and return only to find you didn't miss a thing.
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Old 03-06-2019, 11:39 AM
  #102  
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https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-sho...iEYZ9iGyNtxVTQ

Soon-retiring Porsche sports car boss August Achleitner explains the surprising reason a new generation 718 is a while away.

That makes it official, then.
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Old 03-06-2019, 01:02 PM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by Yellow Submarine View Post
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-sho...iEYZ9iGyNtxVTQ

Soon-retiring Porsche sports car boss August Achleitner explains the surprising reason a new generation 718 is a while away.

That makes it official, then.
Interesting. There will always be subtle upgrades year to year, but it makes sense to leave the platform alone especially since there's no expectation a new platform will generate a generous increase in sales. The last positive spike in sales was 2013. I'm sure the new GT4 and Spyder will be appreciably more powerful, and will have PDK offered, so sales of those will be great even if sales start to really slide on current 982s, which is inevitable to stretch the offering another 4 years. I also can't imagine they'd put a NA motor back in with current emission standards ... perhaps a 6 cylinder turbo though, which wouldn't be kind to current car values.
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Old 03-06-2019, 02:19 PM
  #104  
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^^^ didn't I read when the 718 was introduced that the reason for 4 cylinders is bc the 6 cylinder turbo could not fit?
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Old 03-06-2019, 02:31 PM
  #105  
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I'm disappointed they couldn't collaborate with Audi for a mid engine TT/Cayman/Boxster like BMW and Toyota are doing with their Z4/Supra.
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