Mister C

I am new to the track game and signed up for the HPDC (Potomac) for March 23. I noticed that the 5 points that came with the car expired so I just bought new ones.

I am curious as to why these things expire so quickly. Yeah, I know the answer is safety and the webbing materials supposedly degrades with exposure to sunlight.

BUT regular seat belts never expire. A regular seat belt is a single belt system. Harnesses have 5 or 6 much beefier webs that expire quickly. That doesn't make much sense to me.

Is this collusion between the harness manufacturers and the racing bodies? Anyone else have issues with this or do you just see a rule and follow it since it is supposedly safety-related?

hacker-pschorr

I don't undrestand it either. The UV degrading story doesn't sit with me either since most track cars spend 99% of their life in a garage or inside a trailer.

Do they wear out after repeated tightening cycles? I hope not.....

GuyIncognito

I don't get it either. obviously if they were exposed to a lot of stress (ie a big crash), yes replace them. but to have a "shelf life" makes no sense to me.

Stuttgart951

I cannot speak to the harnesses from a technical standpoint; but if you ever get into competitive racing, the stop at the end of the sentence is always safety regulation.

In any event; harnesses will be overkill for the Potomac clinic on Jefferson. You will learn quite a bit if it is your first outing and have an awful lot of fun - but the circuit isn't all that exciting, in my opinion. When schedule permits, hook up with one of the other local organizations (SCCA/NASA/Trackdaze/BSR-FATT) or PCA and try the Shenandoah Circuit next - Summit Main after that. Shen is a fantastically technical and fun track and allows you to learn even more at, compared to Main, relatively low speeds.

Based on your avatar picture, it looks like you have a DAS bar installed? Even though a helmet is not required for the clinic, you'll want one with the roll bar installed. If memory serves, rentals will be available - I think through the on-site OG Racing shop, which is located on the Main paddock.

OEM pads will be fine for a single day. Make sure to bring a few tools; torque wrench, sockets, tire pressure gauge (take 4-5 PSI out of the tires before you go out), etc. There should be a list somewhere on the site that includes all of the "I wish I would have brought X" items.

I won't be at the clinic, but should be at the next DE. I'll come say hello if I see your car.

Be safe and have FUN!

element

my guess is that they rate them based on professional, everyday use. Im not sure if the clubs look at the dates or condition of the actual belts.

phil.

Serge944

For the same reason textbooks come out with a new edition each year - because harness manufacturers need to continue making money.

For non-professional use, harnesses do not have an expiration date.

Paddy

Yep, it's pretty silly if you ask me and only certain clubs enforce that rule, Potomac PCA for one. I was at an event and had my Schroth HANS harness expire the previous month and they wouldn't let me use them. I was flabbergasted and annoyed considering they don't get that much use.

Instead, I was able to go out without my HANS device and use my factory 17 y/o seat belt. Now that's some flawed logic if you ask me.

dan212

Everything ages. Straps that are pulled tight are under more load than a street 3 point.. Agreed that your track car might not be exposed to as much UV light.. But this isn't an area so expensive that (just as with a helmet) it makes sense to save a few pennies in exchange for your safety.

Just as an example. I consider wheel studs a wear item and replace them every year.

Mister C

Thanks for the tips.

I realize that 5 points are a bit of overkill for this particular event. But I know myself well enough to realize that one hit on the track pipe will not be enough. I plan on doing DEs and some autocross. I also picked up a helmet from OG a few days ago.

I will be checking my pride at the paddock gate. I thought I was a good driver until I did some autocross. I realized how much I have to learn and being prideful gets in the way of learning.

Yes, that is a DAS rollbar in the car. Some of you may recognize the car. It was formerly known as Mrs. P and was owned by Rennlister George from MD. George has kindly agreed to be my instructor.

I am really excited about my first track event. Hope to see some of you there or at a future track event.

Michael

Mister C

Gotta pay to play and I am not fooling around with safety equipment.

Someone here was complaining about how expensive it was to race a Porsche. The reply that I remember was great. I was something like...what did you think was cheap? The racing part or the Porsche part?

Bill Verburg

The answer is liability and the 5 year rule has historically been ignored for DE but the insurance company's are pressuring PCA to enforce the rule. Same w/ the pin requirement for the harnesses. oe is seen as manufacturer's liability and thus you can apparently use them forever.

I agree it's silly in some respects my 4 yr old harnesses which have been in the sun(but not direct sun as it's a coupe) for a grand total of maybe 100 days will have to be replaced next year, but the 3 pointers in my 37 yr old C3 targa which has seen thousands of days in direct sunlight are perfectly legal.

Marc Shaw

Conspiracy theories about manufacturers making money aside, some of the data regarding harnesses expiring is based on a study done in the 1960's by Dupont - Bulletin X-203.

24/7 UV exposure to light caused fibre degredation, particularly with smaller fibres (like OE belts) and dark coloured fibres (like black OE belts). You'd think that light coloured, larger fibre belts like harnesses would fare better than OE belts....

The graphy below is on the Simpson and Schroth web sites but is based on that testing ("Light and weather resistance of fibers") but, that study is now over 40 years old and I would have though they would have changed the fibre structure and material composition sufficiently that a new study should be done.

Marc

Steve113

yes and thats 24/7 exposure to UV no race cars have anywhere near that type of exposure

Jarez Mifkin

Not true per the rules of every single amateur level club racing rule book.

kurt M

The belt rules fly in the face of true safety in DE. Tires are a safety item that will, not might, be called into play while on track. Tires are given a visual inspection. Belts are a safety item that might or might not be called into play while on track and are also given a visual inspection. Tires can be used if they pass a visual inspection regardless of age but belts cannot be used after a set date regardless of condition.

"Hey, look this has a date the device maker placed on it, lets make a rule around that." The exp dates do not have any basis in real world use or lab testing. The "they are not all that expensive" argument does not work in real life. All too often I see cheaper belting systems used as due to the "discard by" rules are forced to be considered disposable.