mdrums

Early this year I went against Bob Woodman of Woodman Tires advice and bought some left over Toyo RA1's with manufacturing dates of 3 and 4 years old. Some hear on these forums said they will be fine plus they only cost me $800 shaved and delivered.

The RA1's like we all know work out great if you get them shaved to at least 5/32. These tires lasted me 5 DE days at Sebring. This was not as good as the R888's I had before and the RA1's I used back in 2008 which lasted around 10 DE days. So shaving makes them fast but they wear out a lot quicker. The 90 mile drive home is horribly dangerous in the rain with no tread too. So I was thinking of not shaving another set of RA1's but the tread really squirms around and at least 3 good DE days are lost. I do not have to shave R888's and even though they heat cycle out a little faster than the RA1, I at least have some tread for rain events and the drive home. Plus any RA1's out there now are a good 4-5 years old. Woodman really warned about buying older R-Comp rubber so I bought R888's this time.

I had the R888's installed today and we noticed these old RA1's I bought 7 months ago had dry rot and some cracks at the bead. Also I was told that these old RA1's can be and are dangerous at a high speed track due to how the rubber softer r-comp rubber ages and how these old tires where probably stored. I got seriously lucky I did not have tire failure. My new R888's have 2010 manufacturing dates.

fatbillybob

I thought Ra1's were back in production and available all over town. Didn't they start making them again in miata sizes first and now a bunch of sizes? There was universal hate for the r888 iirc. I don't use these tires so never paid much attention

mark kibort

Yeah, cracking of any kind is bad. they are junk, when you see the slightest cracking. Ive never seen that in any of my tires, all coming from WCGT races, even back as far as 2005. Im through the 5s now, and only have the 7s and they are like brand new. I guess you need to see a picture of the used tires before you buy them. also, 800bucks for used tires is a complete rip off. 50bucks each is the going rate, 100 each if they are in pristine conditon.

LDadrenaline

the hate for the R888s was mainly people too used to the RA1s. R888s require a different setup and the tire doesn't hold performance until it chords like the RA1 does, but initial grip was actually slightly better. I know people on both sides of the fence. I prefer the RA1s personally and am definitely glad they are back in production.

Mike, from what I have heard I wouldn't use a tire more than about 2.5 years old. All the oils start to leave the tire, so even if they aren't cracking they will still have hardly any grip.

AudiOn19s

I think the $800 was for brand new, but old stock RA-1's which isn't a horrible deal.

I didn't dislike the R888's on my 996 but wasn't crazy that grip started to fall off when there was still a good bit of tread left on the tire.

I've been through two sets of RA-1 scrubs ($70 ea) on my M3 this season. I think the ones on the car now have an '06 production date and were still pleanty fast for a DE tire and gave me great longevity...plus at $70 a tire you can't go wrong for DE use. I still get 4-5 days out of scrub RA-1's that have maybe 2-3/32 when I get them. When I have them dismounted in a couple of weeks I'll make sure to look closely for cracking. Could just be how the ones you got your hands on were stored.

For me as a DE guy I'd much rather have consistancy than pace. That's what I really like about the RA-1 and why the R888 was such a let down.

RonCT

Mike,
I don't think you can generalize and paint a bad picture over all RA1s. I've run them for many years and they have always been "older production". I'm on about my 50th heat cycle on the current set and they are rock solid, perfect in every way. I've got another 2 sets in my basement ready for 2011 and 2012 - I timed it so that they would be 3, 4, and 5 years old respectively when mounted and used. I've never heard of an RA1 that caused problems before, while I have heard of other tires blowing out at the track. As Toyo and all the other tire makers say, 6 years is the shelf life, possibly longer if properly stored (ie: Covered to protect from UV in a climate controlled basement vs. on a car sitting in the driveway). So my late 2007 RA1s will easily serve me well in 2011 (new set to be installed March 2011) and 2012 (new set to be installed March 2012).

The thing I didn't like about the R888 was they were not as grippy as the RA1 and they were painfully loud on the way to / from the track. But, once my RA1s are done, I'll have to switch.

Also, Toyo announced they would make more RA1s, but only in smaller sizes for certain race series. No 245/305 18s planned for re-introduction.

multi21

I've run older production RA1s for years and they have always been great, getting faster and faster the more they wear. This has been on a E46 M3 and a GT3, not exactly momentum cars per se.

I had 1 set of 888s and swore them off forever. Perhaps the worst tire I've ever had on a car. NEVER AGAIN.

dew-e

I'm trying the R888 shaved this time around to see how they perform with less tread. I had this same exact issue in that I was over 55 heat cycles deep and there was plenty of tread left, but the pace had started to fall off and the tires were less consistent in braking. I was getting more lockups the last time I ran my last set.

However, the unshaved tires were there fastest at like 40 heat cycles in. Could also have been the very cold weather and chasing my friend and his pro coach around the track that weekend. No matter what, they were still performing great at 40 heat cycles.

I tried a set of NT01s this season, and found they didn't fit my driving style/car handling, and would usually get really slick after like 18-20 minutes. I have the same issue with full tread NT01, plenty of tread left, but the tire can't handle longer sessions at all without falling off, but is still plenty fast in the first 15 minutes of a session.

Hoping a set of shaved R888s will match the tread depth with the heat cycle life span better, and give the tire even better performance over the life of the tire.

mdrums

$800 was for unused RA1's with production dates of early 2007.

mdrums

Interesting because the guys with 996 based cars I track with love the Nitto NT01's.

Obviously this is all to each his own.

utkinpol

did you get more wear on your rear tires or your fronts?
i ran on v700 kumhos this season, 2007 production, and amazingly fronts got whole center section worn almost to the cord now with sides still having plenty of meat on them while rears are worn very evenly and still have 2/32th at least left. did 4 DEs on them and may be 8 or 10 auto-x days.

not sure why wear is so different. looks very odd to me. both were shaved but initially fronts had more tread left than rears.

mdrums

Correct Toyo has discontinued the RA1 in the sizes we need for 996-997 based cars. They did bring back some RA1's for the Spec Miata guys.

Ron, I am not putting down RA1's....they worked great for me...did not last that long though. However when we dismounted them and saw the cracking dry rot at the bead I am not useing 3+ year old tires ever again. Like LD in the post above I was told by tire guys that in r-comp tires to be used on the track...weather it's a DE or a race...we are hitting race speeds in a DE for sure...that the old tires are not safe. I am not taking a chance so I bought new 2010 manufacturing date R888's.

utkinpol

did you buy them locally or online? where is the best price for them?

mglobe

Most people would be very happy with 55 heat cycles from just about any tire. Personally, I don't care so much about how much rubber is left, just how many HC's I get.

Uneven tread wear with the center of the tire wearing more than the edges is typically caused by over-inflation.

Potomac-Greg

I have had a good experience with NT01s and to me they seem identical to RA1s. Full tread may be more squirmy than shaved, but as someone said, for a DE, a little squirm (in exchange for many more track days) may be worth the trade off.