How I bought my first Porsche 997.2 / My experience
02-02-2015, 02:37 PM
#1
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How I bought my first Porsche 997.2 / My experience
I had a Porsche poster on my wall when I was a kid. I thought of it often as I climbed into our family’s only vehicle – a mid 80’s Dodge minivan, beige with wood paneling on the side. Today I have finally realized the dream of owning a Porsche 911, a white 2009 Carrera CPO. In two works: f*** yes!
Buying the car required patience, and I’m not talking Guns N’ Roses. In total it took 20 days, 37 emails, 12 phone calls, 2 salesmen, 1 independent mechanic, 1 truck driver, and my even more patient girlfriend to get the deal done. There were times when I thought the deal wasn’t going to happen yet eventually I got the exact car I wanted.
Much like my real job, it all began with research. In the grand scheme of things I still know so little about Porsches, how they work, required maintenance, etc. I started researching recent Porsche models, reliability, and selling prices on the used market. While I initially flirted with a low mileage 997.1, I quickly focused my efforts to a 2009 997.2. Of course there are great 997.1 models out there. I didn’t want to risk dealing with IMS issues, and wanted the upgraded electronics on the 997.2. There’s a lot of value in these 997.2 cars - I couldn’t pass it up.
I began looking for a private party car, searching eBay, autotrader, rennlist, and every craigslist on the West Coast. My girlfriend was tired of the updates after the first Saturday. Despite my reservations with car dealerships she convinced me I should focus on a CPO car. I didn’t stop looking for other cars until my car was loaded onto the truck, but in the end I agreed. The certification has value. For a first time owner like me it just makes sense.
EBay was frustrating. The majority of the cars are overpriced, not certified, and seller contact was clumsy. How could I spend 50k+ and not know the service history of the car? That was too big of a risk for me.
I looked around at local dealerships. There was a 2010 available for a decent price at a Porsche dealer in Pasadena. It had more miles than I desired – 68,000 - I took it for a test drive anyway. The car drove well. The outside was a dark cherry. Just beautiful but the inside appeared somewhat faded. The car had spent a lot of time in the sun. Even though I knew I didn’t want the car anywhere near the price they wanted to sell it for I tried to negotiate with the dealer. If not for anything but to get a taste of the buying experience at Porsche.
Immediately I ran into issues. I am a professional though I have long hair, tattoos, and look about ten years younger than my age. They assumed I wasn’t serious and didn’t give me real attention. The salesman approach was silly. Since my dad sells cars for Lexus I know this type of service is lackluster but I didn’t protest. I left a number. They never tried to contact me. As of two days ago the car was still available. Moving on.
Autotrader was better. The search options seemed easier. In late December thru early January cars began to come and go. There were high mileage cars, cabriolets, and GTS models but I couldn’t find the car I wanted. Doubt began to creep in. Was I being too picky? Did I have unreasonable expectations on the price?
A close friend connected me with an independent dealer in Las Vegas. For 2k flat fee he would find me the car at wholesale, and buy it at an auction. He said he only found high quality cars that wouldn’t need a PPI – or so he said. Despite the fact that I could’ve saved money and potentially gotten a great car that process would’ve caused me more stress. Not getting a PPI on a used car is just too risky for me.
A week later a reasonably priced CPO popped up on Autotrader. The car was at a dealer in Chicago. It was the color I wanted and had most of the features I wanted. A quick phone call to the salesman got me the carfax and more detailed pics. There was a small scratch on the front bumper, and two of the rims had slight curb rash. None of it was a deal breaker. I saw it as a negotiating tool.
Over email I made an offer but the dealer didn’t budge. He said the car was fairly priced, even under the market. I knew this was partially true but I’ve been around the car business long enough to know posturing when I see it. I got a screen grab of the Kelly Blue book certified price, took screen grabs of lower priced cars, and emailed him back the curb rash pics. We went back and forth. I could tell the salesman was getting tired of dealing with me but the price began to slowly go down.
After two days I gave him my final offer. He was friendly but played the “I have to talk to the finance manager because we would be losing money on the car if we sold it to you at that price” card. He called me back and said they had two appointments on the car and it was likely going to sell that same day. Since I still have my Mercedes for two months I was under no pressure to buy. Hell, I hadn’t even seen the car in person or done a PPI. I told him good luck. Before I hung up he said if the car didn’t sell by the end of the day…it was mine.
The day came and went. I didn’t hear a thing. I assumed the car had sold but wanted to make sure. The next morning I called and left a nice message. Silence. The next day still nothing. Since I couldn’t get a reply from the salesman I left a respectful message with the dealership manager. He called back concerned – they still had the car! He was going to have the salesman call me back right away. Twenty minutes later I got a message saying the car was mine.
I knew this wasn’t really the end. We hadn’t finished negotiating. I was ready to close the deal. Thru rennlist I found a good place to do a PPI, emailed back, asked when we could send the car out for a PPI, asked for the CPO checklist, any outstanding service records, and requested an invoice breakdown. Again…nothing.
Now I was officially frustrated. The hard work was almost done but the salesman was MIA. My patience had run out though a bad attitude rarely helps any deal. I called the manager and remained friendly but let him know what was going on. Thirty minutes later another salesman called me back. Evidently the salesman I had been working with had now moved on to other ventures. Not sure if that meant he was fired or what - I wouldn’t wish that on anyone. The new salesman would be closing the deal.
There was definitely some concern I would have to negotiate the car again but he said he would be fedexing me the paperwork. Over email I got the CPO checklist, and eventually, got the car out for PPI. Finding out what was done during the CPO inspection – exactly – and what still needed to be done was annoying. The dealer kept saying the car didn’t need anything. Everything was done during the CPO inspection. The service manager essentially echoed this yet I knew it couldn’t be so simple. Where was the evidence of any service during the CPO process?
Midwest Eurosport handled the PPI. They said the car was very buyable. Overall great, but the back tires needed to be replaced, they were at 2/32. I did some quick research on the CPO, and saw 2/32 fell below the CPO requirements. I sent this back to the dealer who back peddled. Now they said the back tires just hadn’t been replaced yet but it would be done before the car was shipped. The process remained friendly but I of course got all this in writing.
The paperwork came and it all checked out. No hidden fees. Completely as anticipated. Once they received it I wired the money. Receipt was confirmed. 5 days later the car was unloaded off the truck.
It’s awesome. So glad I got the car. My experience is mine and mine alone. I'm not saying I did everything right, just wanted to share mine with others in case someone can benefit from it. It was a tiring process but truth be told I wouldn’t expect anything less from a dealer. They all suck. In the end I got a CPO car below market price, better than any deal you can find on eBay or auto trader. I’ll take it.
Buying the car required patience, and I’m not talking Guns N’ Roses. In total it took 20 days, 37 emails, 12 phone calls, 2 salesmen, 1 independent mechanic, 1 truck driver, and my even more patient girlfriend to get the deal done. There were times when I thought the deal wasn’t going to happen yet eventually I got the exact car I wanted.
Much like my real job, it all began with research. In the grand scheme of things I still know so little about Porsches, how they work, required maintenance, etc. I started researching recent Porsche models, reliability, and selling prices on the used market. While I initially flirted with a low mileage 997.1, I quickly focused my efforts to a 2009 997.2. Of course there are great 997.1 models out there. I didn’t want to risk dealing with IMS issues, and wanted the upgraded electronics on the 997.2. There’s a lot of value in these 997.2 cars - I couldn’t pass it up.
I began looking for a private party car, searching eBay, autotrader, rennlist, and every craigslist on the West Coast. My girlfriend was tired of the updates after the first Saturday. Despite my reservations with car dealerships she convinced me I should focus on a CPO car. I didn’t stop looking for other cars until my car was loaded onto the truck, but in the end I agreed. The certification has value. For a first time owner like me it just makes sense.
EBay was frustrating. The majority of the cars are overpriced, not certified, and seller contact was clumsy. How could I spend 50k+ and not know the service history of the car? That was too big of a risk for me.
I looked around at local dealerships. There was a 2010 available for a decent price at a Porsche dealer in Pasadena. It had more miles than I desired – 68,000 - I took it for a test drive anyway. The car drove well. The outside was a dark cherry. Just beautiful but the inside appeared somewhat faded. The car had spent a lot of time in the sun. Even though I knew I didn’t want the car anywhere near the price they wanted to sell it for I tried to negotiate with the dealer. If not for anything but to get a taste of the buying experience at Porsche.
Immediately I ran into issues. I am a professional though I have long hair, tattoos, and look about ten years younger than my age. They assumed I wasn’t serious and didn’t give me real attention. The salesman approach was silly. Since my dad sells cars for Lexus I know this type of service is lackluster but I didn’t protest. I left a number. They never tried to contact me. As of two days ago the car was still available. Moving on.
Autotrader was better. The search options seemed easier. In late December thru early January cars began to come and go. There were high mileage cars, cabriolets, and GTS models but I couldn’t find the car I wanted. Doubt began to creep in. Was I being too picky? Did I have unreasonable expectations on the price?
A close friend connected me with an independent dealer in Las Vegas. For 2k flat fee he would find me the car at wholesale, and buy it at an auction. He said he only found high quality cars that wouldn’t need a PPI – or so he said. Despite the fact that I could’ve saved money and potentially gotten a great car that process would’ve caused me more stress. Not getting a PPI on a used car is just too risky for me.
A week later a reasonably priced CPO popped up on Autotrader. The car was at a dealer in Chicago. It was the color I wanted and had most of the features I wanted. A quick phone call to the salesman got me the carfax and more detailed pics. There was a small scratch on the front bumper, and two of the rims had slight curb rash. None of it was a deal breaker. I saw it as a negotiating tool.
Over email I made an offer but the dealer didn’t budge. He said the car was fairly priced, even under the market. I knew this was partially true but I’ve been around the car business long enough to know posturing when I see it. I got a screen grab of the Kelly Blue book certified price, took screen grabs of lower priced cars, and emailed him back the curb rash pics. We went back and forth. I could tell the salesman was getting tired of dealing with me but the price began to slowly go down.
After two days I gave him my final offer. He was friendly but played the “I have to talk to the finance manager because we would be losing money on the car if we sold it to you at that price” card. He called me back and said they had two appointments on the car and it was likely going to sell that same day. Since I still have my Mercedes for two months I was under no pressure to buy. Hell, I hadn’t even seen the car in person or done a PPI. I told him good luck. Before I hung up he said if the car didn’t sell by the end of the day…it was mine.
The day came and went. I didn’t hear a thing. I assumed the car had sold but wanted to make sure. The next morning I called and left a nice message. Silence. The next day still nothing. Since I couldn’t get a reply from the salesman I left a respectful message with the dealership manager. He called back concerned – they still had the car! He was going to have the salesman call me back right away. Twenty minutes later I got a message saying the car was mine.
I knew this wasn’t really the end. We hadn’t finished negotiating. I was ready to close the deal. Thru rennlist I found a good place to do a PPI, emailed back, asked when we could send the car out for a PPI, asked for the CPO checklist, any outstanding service records, and requested an invoice breakdown. Again…nothing.
Now I was officially frustrated. The hard work was almost done but the salesman was MIA. My patience had run out though a bad attitude rarely helps any deal. I called the manager and remained friendly but let him know what was going on. Thirty minutes later another salesman called me back. Evidently the salesman I had been working with had now moved on to other ventures. Not sure if that meant he was fired or what - I wouldn’t wish that on anyone. The new salesman would be closing the deal.
There was definitely some concern I would have to negotiate the car again but he said he would be fedexing me the paperwork. Over email I got the CPO checklist, and eventually, got the car out for PPI. Finding out what was done during the CPO inspection – exactly – and what still needed to be done was annoying. The dealer kept saying the car didn’t need anything. Everything was done during the CPO inspection. The service manager essentially echoed this yet I knew it couldn’t be so simple. Where was the evidence of any service during the CPO process?
Midwest Eurosport handled the PPI. They said the car was very buyable. Overall great, but the back tires needed to be replaced, they were at 2/32. I did some quick research on the CPO, and saw 2/32 fell below the CPO requirements. I sent this back to the dealer who back peddled. Now they said the back tires just hadn’t been replaced yet but it would be done before the car was shipped. The process remained friendly but I of course got all this in writing.
The paperwork came and it all checked out. No hidden fees. Completely as anticipated. Once they received it I wired the money. Receipt was confirmed. 5 days later the car was unloaded off the truck.
It’s awesome. So glad I got the car. My experience is mine and mine alone. I'm not saying I did everything right, just wanted to share mine with others in case someone can benefit from it. It was a tiring process but truth be told I wouldn’t expect anything less from a dealer. They all suck. In the end I got a CPO car below market price, better than any deal you can find on eBay or auto trader. I’ll take it.
02-02-2015, 02:49 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
Great story of patience and perseverance! Glad to hear it all paid off. Hopefully you won't see this message for a while since hopefully you're off giving it a thorough test romp. I see some weekend time soon on the Crest, Ortega highway, or Palomar Mountain... I have certainly missed those since leaving CA.
Congrats!
Congrats!
02-02-2015, 03:19 PM
#3
AutoX
Thread Starter
Thank you. Actually I'm going to be heading out of town soon and won't be able to drive it much over the next two/three months. When I get back into town I look forward to all of the spots you mentioned. I may look into the LA PCA club though I don't know anyone over there yet.
Pics to come very soon.
Pics to come very soon.
02-02-2015, 05:54 PM
#4
I had a Porsche poster on my wall when I was a kid. I thought of it often as I climbed into our family’s only vehicle – a mid 80’s Dodge minivan, beige with wood paneling on the side. Today I have finally realized the dream of owning a Porsche 911, a white 2009 Carrera CPO. In two words: f*** yes!
And I use the same excuse with my wife why I got one
The big difference was my parent's had a Datsun that needed a hair dryer to start on rainy days.
Last edited by 911searcher; 02-02-2015 at 06:33 PM.
02-02-2015, 08:32 PM
#5
Racer
Join Date: Feb 2014
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Congratulations and best of luck with the new ride! Just don't drive it under the influence of your screen name. ;-) My wife's and my story were very different. Saw an ad on AutoTrader. Porsche of Livermore had, like, 5-6 CPOs to choose from in our price range. She test-drove a non-S and came back unimpressed; she drove an S and came back with a big grin on her face. Three hours and change later, we'd finished the paperwork, unloaded everything from her '05 Audi S4 cab trade-in, and were driving home in her new ride. 2011 Carrera S Cab, pearlescent black-on-black, 19K miles at the dealer and just turned 33 (it's her DD). She's doing a full-day driving course in Sonoma a week from Friday.
02-02-2015, 08:56 PM
#6
Instructor
Congrats on the purchase & welcome to the club!!
Great write up and nice negotiating job. I found mine here on rennlist and had the best and most simple buying experience yet.
However, the golden rule here is - pics or it didn't happen!
Great write up and nice negotiating job. I found mine here on rennlist and had the best and most simple buying experience yet.
However, the golden rule here is - pics or it didn't happen!
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02-02-2015, 10:24 PM
#8
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
You write better than most car mag staff. And 100x better the the entire European Car staff!
That said pics or it didn't happen
That said pics or it didn't happen
Last edited by Chaos; 02-07-2015 at 11:01 PM.
02-02-2015, 10:34 PM
#9
Rennlist Member
Great story of perseverance! Congrats...
02-02-2015, 11:52 PM
#10
I had a similar run with a dealer in the Chicago area on my 997. First visit, car is overpriced, no it's not, have a good day. 45 days later, still for sale, price has come down $5k. Email offer for $6,500 less than current. Salesman calls says he needs to move it, come on in. I specifically ask if he's good on the price I offered, as I'm spending time with my family and if I have to detour 2 hours out of my way I'm coming to sign papers and not negotiate. He tells me the paperwork will be ready when I get there.
I show up and he's nowhere to be found and a slick guy I've never met starts showing me comps proving that my price is too low and he can't sell it for that. As I'm walking out I tell the sales manager that I'm never returning. He pulls me into the GM's office where I recount the whole experience. He give's me my price, but of course emphasizes he's losing money but wants my business. Yeah, sure.
Dealers are dealers. Most car buyers think the dealer has the negotiating power, they do not. Stand firm like the OP, be willing to walk away, and you will get want you want, assuming it's fair.
Welcome to the passion Peyote, it's a great ride.
I show up and he's nowhere to be found and a slick guy I've never met starts showing me comps proving that my price is too low and he can't sell it for that. As I'm walking out I tell the sales manager that I'm never returning. He pulls me into the GM's office where I recount the whole experience. He give's me my price, but of course emphasizes he's losing money but wants my business. Yeah, sure.
Dealers are dealers. Most car buyers think the dealer has the negotiating power, they do not. Stand firm like the OP, be willing to walk away, and you will get want you want, assuming it's fair.
Welcome to the passion Peyote, it's a great ride.
02-03-2015, 11:05 PM
#11
Nordschleife Master
congrats peyote!!! awesome f@#king story as well.
time for photos!
OT - im surprised the rear tires were at 2/32. obviously well under CPO but im pretty sure that doenst pass basic safety.
time for photos!
OT - im surprised the rear tires were at 2/32. obviously well under CPO but im pretty sure that doenst pass basic safety.
02-03-2015, 11:31 PM
#12
I had a similar run with a dealer in the Chicago area on my 997. First visit, car is overpriced, no it's not, have a good day. 45 days later, still for sale, price has come down $5k. Email offer for $6,500 less than current. Salesman calls says he needs to move it, come on in. I specifically ask if he's good on the price I offered, as I'm spending time with my family and if I have to detour 2 hours out of my way I'm coming to sign papers and not negotiate. He tells me the paperwork will be ready when I get there.
I show up and he's nowhere to be found and a slick guy I've never met starts showing me comps proving that my price is too low and he can't sell it for that. As I'm walking out I tell the sales manager that I'm never returning. He pulls me into the GM's office where I recount the whole experience. He give's me my price, but of course emphasizes he's losing money but wants my business. Yeah, sure.
Dealers are dealers. Most car buyers think the dealer has the negotiating power, they do not. Stand firm like the OP, be willing to walk away, and you will get want you want, assuming it's fair.
Welcome to the passion Peyote, it's a great ride.
I show up and he's nowhere to be found and a slick guy I've never met starts showing me comps proving that my price is too low and he can't sell it for that. As I'm walking out I tell the sales manager that I'm never returning. He pulls me into the GM's office where I recount the whole experience. He give's me my price, but of course emphasizes he's losing money but wants my business. Yeah, sure.
Dealers are dealers. Most car buyers think the dealer has the negotiating power, they do not. Stand firm like the OP, be willing to walk away, and you will get want you want, assuming it's fair.
Welcome to the passion Peyote, it's a great ride.
02-04-2015, 01:14 AM
#13
Rennlist Member
Congrats and welcome! You had a very similar experience to mine though I am IN Chicago and my remote dealer was in PA. Enjoy!
