OT Anyone here using Windows Vista yet?
02-12-2007, 11:51 PM
#61
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Originally Posted by icruze
cdodkin,
Can you explain why the apple OS is more secure against malware? I've heard the same argument that people target windows PCs since they are the operating system of choice for most businesses. However, I would think hackers would try to show their skill against the more difficult target (apple) to impress their peers. Is there something inherent in the apple OS that prevents this?
Can you explain why the apple OS is more secure against malware? I've heard the same argument that people target windows PCs since they are the operating system of choice for most businesses. However, I would think hackers would try to show their skill against the more difficult target (apple) to impress their peers. Is there something inherent in the apple OS that prevents this?
http://www.esecurityplanet.com/artic...1162_3658121_1
The author is Kenneth van Wyk, a 20-year veteran of IT security.
He is the prinicpal consultant for KRvW Associates, LLC. The co-author of two security-related books, he has worked at CERT, as well as at the U.S. Department of Defense.
In short, he knows his ****
02-12-2007, 11:57 PM
#62
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by 1999Porsche911
I can't understand how any home computer gets a virus. Unless you like accepting every email send you and clicking on every link sent you and have no idea how to set up your operating system, router etc, getting a virus is because of your carelessness and nothing else.
I have been surfing the web since the day it became available and am on 24/7 and, maybe, have gotten a half a dozen viruses or other plants on my computers and each and every time, it was because of something I did wrong.
Nothing can get into your computer unless you invite it in. MAC or PC.
I have been surfing the web since the day it became available and am on 24/7 and, maybe, have gotten a half a dozen viruses or other plants on my computers and each and every time, it was because of something I did wrong.
Nothing can get into your computer unless you invite it in. MAC or PC.
In the computer world, the problem is that you cannot cover yourself 100% and it is only a matter of time. If the virus writers exploit and distribute the virus before the anti virus software or OS covers the patch, then the computer can easily become infected.
02-13-2007, 12:01 AM
#63
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Originally Posted by 1999Porsche911
That is because the average person has no knowledge of how a computer, associated software, the web, certificates, etc work so all these safegaurds are created to protect them from themslves. It is no different that all the "sissy" controls they put on the Porsche and other cars. Rather than demanding that people actually learn how to drive, they try to crate an enviormnent that will protect them.
So, you are right that the average person needs all the bells and wistles, but they are in fact, only protecting them from themselves. For those of us who are well versed in computers and the web, there is no need to slow down your system with more software controls.
So, you are right that the average person needs all the bells and wistles, but they are in fact, only protecting them from themselves. For those of us who are well versed in computers and the web, there is no need to slow down your system with more software controls.
Here's a great example of what we're talking about here - Westinghouse Electric Company
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/...8033ab2f.shtml
02-13-2007, 12:04 AM
#64
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by icruze
cdodkin,
Can you explain why the apple OS is more secure against malware? I've heard the same argument that people target windows PCs since they are the operating system of choice for most businesses. However, I would think hackers would try to show their skill against the more difficult target (apple) to impress their peers. Is there something inherent in the apple OS that prevents this?
Can you explain why the apple OS is more secure against malware? I've heard the same argument that people target windows PCs since they are the operating system of choice for most businesses. However, I would think hackers would try to show their skill against the more difficult target (apple) to impress their peers. Is there something inherent in the apple OS that prevents this?
02-13-2007, 12:08 AM
#65
Race Car
Originally Posted by murphyslaw1978
Getting a computer virus is akin to people catching the influenza virus. It's generally not if, but when you catch it. Of course, you also have some control over it. People can and wear proper winter clothing, eat healthy, do regular physical exercise and even maitain their mental health. But eventually, you still might get sick.
In the computer world, the problem is that you cannot cover yourself 100% and it is only a matter of time. If the virus writers exploit and distribute the virus before the anti virus software or OS covers the patch, then the computer can easily become infected.
In the computer world, the problem is that you cannot cover yourself 100% and it is only a matter of time. If the virus writers exploit and distribute the virus before the anti virus software or OS covers the patch, then the computer can easily become infected.
Obviously you can never be 100% sure of anything in life, but you make choices on what and who you want to trust. If you are betrayed, you can get hurt. However, NO VIRUS OR OTHER HARMFUL FILE can ever get onto a properly setup Windows XP computer unless the user allows it or a trusted site gets compromised.
Either way, the user is immediately notified and the files can be immediately removed and the computer restored to EXCACTLY how it was before the attack. No need for virus protection or other gimmicks if you know what you are doing.
However, if we all knew what we were doing, there would be no such thing as PSM.
02-13-2007, 12:20 AM
#66
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Originally Posted by 1999Porsche911
Obviously you can never be 100% sure of anything in life, but you make choices on what and who you want to trust. If you are betrayed, you can get hurt. However, NO VIRUS OR OTHER HARMFUL FILE can ever get onto a properly setup Windows XP computer unless the user allows it or a trusted site gets compromised.
Either way, the user is immediately notified and the files can be immediately removed and the computer restored to EXCACTLY how it was before the attack. No need for virus protection or other gimmicks if you know what you are doing.
However, if we all knew what we were doing, there would be no such thing as PSM.
Either way, the user is immediately notified and the files can be immediately removed and the computer restored to EXCACTLY how it was before the attack. No need for virus protection or other gimmicks if you know what you are doing.
However, if we all knew what we were doing, there would be no such thing as PSM.
At any one time, there's a list like this of unpatched XP exploits:
Microsoft Windows UPnP GetDeviceList Denial of Service
Microsoft Windows XP Wireless Zero Configuration Wireless Profile Disclosure (Microsoft promises a fix for Windows Vista, but what about Windows XP SP2? That’s still the most up to date environment the last time I checked.)
Windows Registry Editor Utility String Concealment Weakness
Microsoft Windows Unspecified USB Device Driver Vulnerability
Windows Remote Desktop Protocol Private Key Disclosure
Microsoft Windows Image Rendering Denial of Service Vulnerability
Microsoft Jet Database Engine Database File Parsing Vulnerability
Windows Registry Key Locking Denial of Service
Windows XP Internet Connection Firewall Bypass Weakness
Windows Packet Fragmentation Handling Denial of Service Vulnerability
Microsoft Java Virtual Machine Cross-Site Communication Vulnerability
Microsoft Windows "desktop.ini" Arbitrary File Execution Vulnerability
Windows Metafile Handling Vulnerability
Windows XP Malicious Folder Automatic Code Execution Vulnerability
Microsoft HTML Help Control Privilege Escalation Vulnerability
Windows RPC Race Condition Denial of Service Vulnerability
Microsoft Windows Unauthorised Thread Termination
Microsoft Windows TCP Packet Information Disclosure
Windows NTFS File System Information Disclosure
XP PostMessage Password Disclosure
Microsoft Windows Terminal Server Denial of Service
Microsoft Windows crashes on invalid font file
Microsoft Windows Certificate Chain vulnerability
Windows XP expose registered wireless access points
Windows XP admin downgrade problem
NT will let user execute any 16bit application
XP Remote Desktop DoS
So your software is not going to protect you.
02-13-2007, 12:25 AM
#67
Originally Posted by cdodkin
There's a great write-up on this subject at esecurityplanet.com
http://www.esecurityplanet.com/artic...1162_3658121_1
The author is Kenneth van Wyk, a 20-year veteran of IT security.
He is the prinicpal consultant for KRvW Associates, LLC. The co-author of two security-related books, he has worked at CERT, as well as at the U.S. Department of Defense.
In short, he knows his ****
http://www.esecurityplanet.com/artic...1162_3658121_1
The author is Kenneth van Wyk, a 20-year veteran of IT security.
He is the prinicpal consultant for KRvW Associates, LLC. The co-author of two security-related books, he has worked at CERT, as well as at the U.S. Department of Defense.
In short, he knows his ****
Based on the article it appears that OS X has a better/simpler structure than Windows and that this framework allows the user greater ease in controling security. However, he sill concludes that "both operating systems have significant security weaknesses as well as strengths. The fact is that a user who wants to be secure can be reasonably secure on either system......I’m comfortable in saying that I’m more secure on OS X than I ever was on Windows. When you also factor in the fact that nearly all the world’s existing malware is written for Windows systems, my comfort factor increases significantly.That all could change over night, of course, if the malware authors turn their attention to OS X, but even if they do, I for one am more comfortable with running a tight ship here on a UNIX-derived system than on Windows.
Based on this is seems that OS X is still vulnerable but its design makes it easier to address its security issues. The article does seem to lend some credence to the argument that hackers are just not trying to create malware to go after OS X like they do for windows.
02-13-2007, 12:30 AM
#68
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Originally Posted by icruze
Thanks for the link.
Based on the article it appears that OS X has a better/simpler structure than Windows and that this framework allows the user greater ease in controling security. However, he sill concludes that "both operating systems have significant security weaknesses as well as strengths. The fact is that a user who wants to be secure can be reasonably secure on either system......I’m comfortable in saying that I’m more secure on OS X than I ever was on Windows. When you also factor in the fact that nearly all the world’s existing malware is written for Windows systems, my comfort factor increases significantly.That all could change over night, of course, if the malware authors turn their attention to OS X, but even if they do, I for one am more comfortable with running a tight ship here on a UNIX-derived system than on Windows.
Based on this is seems that OS X is still vulnerable but its design makes it easier to address its security issues. The article does seem to lend some credence to the argument that hackers are just not trying to create malware to go after OS X like they do for windows.
Based on the article it appears that OS X has a better/simpler structure than Windows and that this framework allows the user greater ease in controling security. However, he sill concludes that "both operating systems have significant security weaknesses as well as strengths. The fact is that a user who wants to be secure can be reasonably secure on either system......I’m comfortable in saying that I’m more secure on OS X than I ever was on Windows. When you also factor in the fact that nearly all the world’s existing malware is written for Windows systems, my comfort factor increases significantly.That all could change over night, of course, if the malware authors turn their attention to OS X, but even if they do, I for one am more comfortable with running a tight ship here on a UNIX-derived system than on Windows.
Based on this is seems that OS X is still vulnerable but its design makes it easier to address its security issues. The article does seem to lend some credence to the argument that hackers are just not trying to create malware to go after OS X like they do for windows.
That's one of the key areas where MS falls down.
02-13-2007, 12:32 AM
#69
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Majority votes go to Bush, not once but Twice.....he's still a bad President
Majority users are Windows PC, not once, have always been.....it's still crap.
This must be one F#cked up country according to some of you.
Majority users are Windows PC, not once, have always been.....it's still crap.
This must be one F#cked up country according to some of you.
02-13-2007, 12:46 AM
#72
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That's funny - but not as funny as this video of Microsoft's CEO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nc4MzqBFxZE
Your business is safe in his hands - really!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nc4MzqBFxZE
Your business is safe in his hands - really!
02-13-2007, 12:51 AM
#73
Originally Posted by cdodkin
That's funny - but not as funny as this video of Microsoft's CEO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nc4MzqBFxZE
Your business is safe in his hands - really!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nc4MzqBFxZE
Your business is safe in his hands - really!
02-13-2007, 12:59 AM
#74
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This argument is as stupid as the corvette vs Porsche ones. Weekend Google warriers.
Im going out and wash my car, then
then go check my e-mail - whoops im not using the MS web browser Im using firefox, WAIT I can use that on both a PC and MAC,common ground 
Im going out and wash my car, then
then go check my e-mail - whoops im not using the MS web browser Im using firefox, WAIT I can use that on both a PC and MAC,common ground
02-13-2007, 01:35 AM
#75
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by cdodkin
Get educated - there are things called day zero viruses - your virus software will not save you as the signature has not yet been recognized.
By the time it is, it's too late for your PC - you're already infected.
Unless you run Cisco Security Agent desktop, you have no way of stopping any day zero attack.
CSA was written specifically to attempt to lock-down the Windows OS by looking at the processor tasks, and killing any that appear to be out of the norm.
If you have a PC, you should have CSA to have a chance.
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/...057/index.html
Unfortunately for PC users, Windows default settings leave you vulnerable, unlike the Mac, where OS X locks you down by default.
The devil is in the detail - and Mac has spent a lot of time with that detail to give you a more secure platform from switch-on.
There are millions of non-geek PC users that don't have the first clue what to do to secure their OS, and MS doesn't help them by having so many varied vulnerabilities, and a constantly changing threat landscape.
By the time it is, it's too late for your PC - you're already infected.
Unless you run Cisco Security Agent desktop, you have no way of stopping any day zero attack.
CSA was written specifically to attempt to lock-down the Windows OS by looking at the processor tasks, and killing any that appear to be out of the norm.
If you have a PC, you should have CSA to have a chance.
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/...057/index.html
Unfortunately for PC users, Windows default settings leave you vulnerable, unlike the Mac, where OS X locks you down by default.
The devil is in the detail - and Mac has spent a lot of time with that detail to give you a more secure platform from switch-on.
There are millions of non-geek PC users that don't have the first clue what to do to secure their OS, and MS doesn't help them by having so many varied vulnerabilities, and a constantly changing threat landscape.