petron5000

My 2001 came with a 1.2 bar tune. At full boost it will get that high.

Previous owner tells me that it's Softronic, but he didn't install it. The owner before him did.

Softronic is unhelpful looking it up.

So, is a 1.2 bar tune safe on my k16? I'd hate to spend money to remap the tune since there's already one there but it's cheaper than a new turbo.

911mhawk

My understanding from reading lots of posts here(get what you pay for in some cases) and talking to experienced tuners is, the only way to determine SAFE is to log data and have it evaluated by an EXPERT.

I purchased my car with a new motor because the previous owner had a mismatched combination of "speed parts" and it went boom. The receipts could be astounding if you make a mistake in this department.

There is another recent post here where someone is asking what their car has in it based on ad/sale information and others suggest the same, get the REAL info.

FPR, injectors, tune, waste gates, etc., do you really know what you have?
Not trying to be scary, just helpful. When I purchased my car I sent a copy of the ECU file to UMW and was provided a tune based on what he KNEW I had going on with the car. Since then I've learned more and appreciate the conservative direction Kevin has taken with my desire to have reliable power.

Kevinmacd

Was there anything else done other than a software tune, were the turbos updated, were the injectors and fuel pressure increased etc?

petron5000

Not as far as we know or can find.

petron5000

does anyone know what a dealer charges to remap back to stock?

911mhawk

Call one and ask.

Lucid Moment

Before you consider a stock tune, you would have to check to make sure you have stock parts installed, as mentioned above. Does the previous owner know if turbo's injectors are stock? I am going to guess if the previous owner did not know, then the parts are stock, but you never know. 1.2 bar boost is not uncommon on a stock car, it really depends on the tune itself. I had 1.2 with tune exhaust only, then went to 1.4 once I upgraded to larger turbos. Good luck.

white rock

Have you reached out to Scott at softronic? He has been more than helpful to me in the past.

wross996tt

So to the OP, when you say "it gets that high", is the boost a sustained 1.2 or just a spike? Do a third or 4th gear pull and see if it is sustained. As all others have mentioned, you need to know about your hardware first. If you are truly stock with K-16's, then 1.2 is too high. AFAIK, They can efficiently go to 1.0 before you no longer get more power from the boost.

dprantl

You have said this before, but it is still not true. Why spread misinformation? K16 turbochargers are efficient right up to 1.2 bar, then their efficiency drops off. Even beyond that, they will still get a little more power but it isn't worth it. https://rennlist.com/forums/996-turb...l#post12147245.

I agree though that you cannot gauge the safety of a tune by how much boost you are making. You can blow up an engine with 0.1 bar of boost, or even none for that matter.

Dan

wross996tt

Wow accusing me of spreading misinformation...really. The information I posted was provided to me by Kevin (UMW). Now, perhaps he uses this in his sales pitch to get folks to upgrade their turbos, perhaps he knows a thing or two...you be the judge. The power you get is a combination of factors, not just boost (oops spreading rumors again). The data sheet provided is theoretical...let me help you...whether it applies to your situation is unknown...since the data was not taken from your car (inference space issue).

I'm certainly not saying I KNOW the answer either, just passing along information I have gathered from the....internet. Here's some more.

Post #11

Another argument

Atrox

$130-$150

BauerR

I read that post, but isnt the map you provided of a K24 turbo? It says in the bottom corner "5324"

dprantl

I have the K14, K16 and K24 maps. The K14 and K16 both start with 5324 024 00 in the corner. The K24 map doesn't have that number visible, but it is a different map. At the top, K14 is 2464, K16 is 2467 and K24 is 2470.

K24:



Dan

dprantl

Sorry if I came on a bit strong, but things posted on the Internet are not exactly like live in-person conversations. First off, no one was talking about making power, we are strictly talking about how much boost a K16 can efficiently make. Unless you are 100% certain that K16's can only efficiently go to 1.0 bar, the following statement that you made is misinformation: "If you are truly stock with K-16's, then 1.2 is too high". There is no ambiguity there. When someone does an internet search and your post comes up, they may take your statement as fact. If you want to pass along what you have heard on the internet, you should say something like, "I have heard that K16's are not efficient past 1.0 bar".

I have heard very good things about Kevin@UMW and I have little doubt that he is a great tuner. He seems to be on the more conservative side tuning-wise, so maybe he would rather not push a set of K16's to their limit, or would rather run K16's at a higher efficiency level than ~65%. But saying that K16's are not efficient past 1.0 bar is simply not true when looking at the KKK graph. It is easy to see that very soon after 1.2 bar, the efficiency of the turbo drops like a stone, not 1.0 bar.

I have provided you a graph with all the information necessary to determine the efficiency of K16 turbochargers that comes directly from the turbo manufacturer. You know, the engineers that made the thing in the first place and made all the measurements and tests on it. And you say this is only theoretical and does not always apply in reality? Ok, so maybe the temp is not always ~68F outside and people can be at a different altitude... The only argument here would be to challenge the validity of the information, but to me it looks pretty legitimate.

As to differences between different cars, during such a discussion it is of course assumed that the car in question is in good working order. Thanks for the offer to help, but I don't think I need it. Variances between one 996TT and another (and between different K16 turbos) are very small, otherwise all cars would have custom tunes tailored to them from the factory. Using slight manufacturing variances between cars to go as far as to say that the answer to the question of whether or not 1.2 bar on a stock K16-equipped 996TT is "unknown" is hyperbole.

The first link you posted also uses the same K16 turbo map as a reference and comes to the same conclusion that 1.2 bar is the maximum efficient boost pressure, barring gross temperature/altitude variances. The second link you posted comes to the same conclusion except for supermono who doesn't sound like they know what they are talking about and 996TT_STEVO who posted a very similar brief statement to your initial one above with no supporting evidence, and that directly contradicts the KKK turbo graph information.

Dan