Awesome Cup Car Style Air Dam Group Buy.
09-02-2013, 08:52 PM
#20
Car aerodynamics is not as much as a black art as it used to be. Of course high end competition cars (DTM, F1, LMS) extensively use wind tunnel to improve their aero. However, they know how to make more downforce, they just are trying to make as much downforce as possible with the minimum drag possible within the confine of a rule book the size of phone book directory. So yes, extensive wind tunnel work is required.
For a street/track car with no rule book and no budget to test every part in a wind tunnel, there is a pretty simple recipe that will give great downforce.
1-Spoiler/splitter. You want as little air as possible going under the car. Especially on cars without totally flat bottom. You want the splitter low, so it splits the air and a minimum gets to go under the car. You also want it to protude so the air hitting the nose doesn't crawl under the car. This will reduce drag, improve downforce and even help with cooling as it helps air go through the radiators.
2-Canards. They help improve front downforce but with a rather deep drag cost. Not a big problem on our cars, but you need to keep that in mind when you decide to go that route. They can be stacked to increase DF. Some high end race cars use three levels of canards. This can be a bit tricky as they affect the rest of the air flow along the side and back of the car. For the street/track one canard on each side is enough. Low is usually better, they can be used in conjonction with splitter.
3-Diffuser. They help create downforce at the middle/rear of the car. It helps slowing the low pressure fast moving air from underneath the car get back with the slow moving air coming from the top of the car. A good diffuser can be really effective. However, there is very few diffuser available for the 911 that I know of. I don't think it's an area that's been focused on by the aftermarket so far.
4-Wings. They should be as large as possible and mounted as high (in the clean air) as possible. Real wing make real downforce, cute wing make barely more than nothing. Even the RS4.0 wing makes little downforce. End plates should be large enough to avoid splilling, the trailing edge thin as possible to lower drag. There's a bunch of other factors that affect how good a wing will be. There are whole books on the subject.
With all of this said, rule of thumb, if a splitter is stiff, long, low and protude over the nose of the car, it will make very good amount of downforce while cutting drag. They work. But now, if the splitter is big enough and works, one should start looking at a bigger more effective wing to balance the DF.
Another rule of thumb, DF balance front/rear should be about equal with static weight balance. That's the main problem with the big splitter. They are really effective, so the higher the speed, the more front downforce there is. At one point, it can unbalance the rear because it doesn't have as much DF. Our cars tend to understeer at high speed so it could just even things out. But could also be too much and make the car oversteer in high speed corners. People should be aware of that and make their choices accordingly.
I drove my previous car with a big splitter and no wing and it was really tail happy at speed 70mph and over, that was before I added the wing to be delivered. It was quite entertaining to say the least. With the wing, the car was planted and stucked to the road at speed.
So with all of that said, I'm convinced that the splitter works (assuming it is well built) but make sure there is some downforce at the back too...
09-17-2013, 02:37 PM
#21
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I'd really love to see this produced. I've recently been considering a GT-2 front conversion, and it is just way too expensive. A GT-2 conversion is at least $4000 with parts and labor (much more if OEM). If this splitter looks as good and works as good as expected, it would easily be worth much more than $500. I'll chip in a little extra myself just to get it rolling if need be!
This is such a nice option - I'm really hoping it happens.
I'll buy two if it helps! :-)
Justin
This is such a nice option - I'm really hoping it happens.
I'll buy two if it helps! :-)
Justin
Last edited by sd996tt; 09-17-2013 at 02:43 PM. Reason: addition
09-25-2013, 10:43 PM
#22
bump
Enrique,
are you still in? Adding up those interested. The first post in not inspiring, as it suggests only 1-2 people are interested, while the rest of the thread is getting us close. Can you update the first post with those interested?
are you still in? Adding up those interested. The first post in not inspiring, as it suggests only 1-2 people are interested, while the rest of the thread is getting us close. Can you update the first post with those interested?
09-27-2013, 05:36 PM
#23
Hi guys,
I haven't heard from Enrique in a while and wondering if there is still interest. I recently completed a new piece for the 996 GT3
https://rennlist.com/forums/996-gt2-...-splitter.html
I am still interested in this project if you folks are.
I can be contacted directly at tei@telus.net
Joe
I haven't heard from Enrique in a while and wondering if there is still interest. I recently completed a new piece for the 996 GT3
https://rennlist.com/forums/996-gt2-...-splitter.html
I am still interested in this project if you folks are.
I can be contacted directly at tei@telus.net
Joe
10-06-2013, 08:17 PM
#26
Let's do this!
I am updating the list as of 10/13/13
1.) F1crazydriver
2.) F1crazy driver (second)
3.) Heavychevy (1?)
4.) Mikeeyee (1)
5.) Joe731 (1)
6.) JBossolo (will it fit GT2 style bumper?)
7.) Cincysota (wants to see design)
8.) SD996TT
9.) SD996TT (second)
10.) Bill996
By my count of all of the above are still in, I think we hit the previously discussed magic number of 10.
Can those on this list please confirm whether they are still interested and if so, interested in how many. If we have at least 10 interested, I am happy to talk with Joe Toth and see if he can share a prototype design before we put our money down. If it looks anything like the Cayman one in the picture, I am in for sure, maybe even two.
1.) F1crazydriver
2.) F1crazy driver (second)
3.) Heavychevy (1?)
4.) Mikeeyee (1)
5.) Joe731 (1)
6.) JBossolo (will it fit GT2 style bumper?)
7.) Cincysota (wants to see design)
8.) SD996TT
9.) SD996TT (second)
10.) Bill996
By my count of all of the above are still in, I think we hit the previously discussed magic number of 10.
Can those on this list please confirm whether they are still interested and if so, interested in how many. If we have at least 10 interested, I am happy to talk with Joe Toth and see if he can share a prototype design before we put our money down. If it looks anything like the Cayman one in the picture, I am in for sure, maybe even two.
Last edited by Joe731; 10-12-2013 at 07:25 PM.
10-06-2013, 09:44 PM
#27
must just be me but the splitter setup you have in another thread doesnt look anything like the first picture shown. i was interested in something like that but the 2 piece looks to much like a homemade product so ill have to pass
10-07-2013, 01:00 AM
#30
Rennlist Member
Problem is if not designed correctly whether its a splitter, diffusser, or rear wing, the more you put in the path of moving air the more drag you get. There has to be a median a designer needs to shoot for.So a large wing or spliter may not be the overall answer!
