How to disable oil filter bypass
03-07-2017, 12:09 PM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
How to disable oil filter bypass
Hey gang
Im wondering if anyone has disabled the stick oil filter cartridge bypass and how they did it. I like the capacity if the cartridge over the LN SPin on conversion as well as the ease of looking for debris in the used filter. The bypass, however, I don't understand.
Im wondering if anyone has disabled the stick oil filter cartridge bypass and how they did it. I like the capacity if the cartridge over the LN SPin on conversion as well as the ease of looking for debris in the used filter. The bypass, however, I don't understand.
03-07-2017, 12:21 PM
#2
Race Director
Hey gang
Im wondering if anyone has disabled the stick oil filter cartridge bypass and how they did it. I like the capacity if the cartridge over the LN SPin on conversion as well as the ease of looking for debris in the used filter. The bypass, however, I don't understand.
Im wondering if anyone has disabled the stick oil filter cartridge bypass and how they did it. I like the capacity if the cartridge over the LN SPin on conversion as well as the ease of looking for debris in the used filter. The bypass, however, I don't understand.
My info is there is a pressure bypass at the oil pump or close to it which would be hard to disable. A WAG would be the pump removed and the bypass drilled out and plugged in some fashion. But I would not do this.
If the engine is generating any debris worth worrying about it will be present in the filter housing and filter element. If the engine is truly sick you'll know something's amiss even before you bother to check the oil filter.
03-07-2017, 12:35 PM
#3
Drifting
The LN filter is usually used on millions(literally) of 5 to 6 litre engines worldwide and you think it is too small because....? Some very smart people selected it fro the M96.Ask the Racers what they use? The Napa Gold version is popular.
The case splitter for the GM (LN) filter is reasonable and easy to use. Do (free) UOA if you have concerns? Or take the filter to your Indie to split for you?
Probably the biggest cause of M96 being severely damaged is a combo of engine problem+OEM filter.I am biased because I had such a failure but the engine had an LN filter.It caught the debris.There was no collateral damage.Engine was rebuildable.Many are not -particularly if the c/s is ruined. Just 1 anecdote but quite common.
I hope this helps you.
http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/148...ing-filtermag/
http://www.filtermag.com/
The case splitter for the GM (LN) filter is reasonable and easy to use. Do (free) UOA if you have concerns? Or take the filter to your Indie to split for you?
Probably the biggest cause of M96 being severely damaged is a combo of engine problem+OEM filter.I am biased because I had such a failure but the engine had an LN filter.It caught the debris.There was no collateral damage.Engine was rebuildable.Many are not -particularly if the c/s is ruined. Just 1 anecdote but quite common.
I hope this helps you.
http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/148...ing-filtermag/
Last edited by Schnell Gelb; 03-07-2017 at 01:14 PM.
03-07-2017, 12:40 PM
#4
Shameful Thread Killer
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I installed the LN no-bypass filter, and got the biggest element I can find screwed on there. As for blocking the stock bypass setup, I'm not going to go there.
Although it may indeed be voodoo, I'm also considering one of those magnet wraps for my filter housing. Even if it catches only a few particles should the engine start to go pear-shaped, it'll be worth the minimal investment.
Although it may indeed be voodoo, I'm also considering one of those magnet wraps for my filter housing. Even if it catches only a few particles should the engine start to go pear-shaped, it'll be worth the minimal investment.
03-07-2017, 03:36 PM
#6
Shameful Thread Killer
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Well, I'm not planning to remove and clean the scavenge pumps, but the oil filter gets changed every 3k miles. Unless I"ve missed something the scavenge pumps are not a common service item. I would rather the particles get scavenged by the mag drain plug in the sump(removed as well), or the filter, but not retained inside the engine.
YMMV
YMMV
03-07-2017, 05:03 PM
#7
Drifting
Well, I'm not planning to remove and clean the scavenge pumps, but the oil filter gets changed every 3k miles. Unless I"ve missed something the scavenge pumps are not a common service item. I would rather the particles get scavenged by the mag drain plug in the sump(removed as well), or the filter, but not retained inside the engine.
YMMV
YMMV
In the unlikely event of the engine releasing FOM, you need to stop the spread of it as close to the source as possible. That is the whole point of it. Fit and hopefully forget.Zero cost ,minimal time to fit,no downside,some protection .Not my original idea. Another smart Rennlister shared it and had dome similar on another engine also.
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03-07-2017, 05:31 PM
#8
Shameful Thread Killer
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Nobody said scavenge pumps are a common service item.
In the unlikely event of the engine releasing FOM, you need to stop the spread of it as close to the source as possible. That is the whole point of it. Fit and hopefully forget.Zero cost ,minimal time to fit,no downside,some protection .Not my original idea. Another smart Rennlister shared it and had dome similar on another engine also.
In the unlikely event of the engine releasing FOM, you need to stop the spread of it as close to the source as possible. That is the whole point of it. Fit and hopefully forget.Zero cost ,minimal time to fit,no downside,some protection .Not my original idea. Another smart Rennlister shared it and had dome similar on another engine also.
As its name implies, a scavenge pump draws up fluid from a distant location, and returns it to a well. In the oiling system of an engine, it would take the oil AFTER having gone through the circuit(including all the bearings), and delivering it to the sump, where the mag drain plug resides.
Second, presuming the failure mode is ferrous where a magnet would help, we're talking about scarf from the IMSB, IMS, crankshaft, rods, oil pump housing, or cams. I"m guessing there's more Fe in the engine, but these are the big things that release Fe into the circuit. I can presume that if one of the cylinders begins to come apart(D-chunk), we're done for the day, and even the largest magnet in the world will do no good.
Presumably, we're looking at detritus from the failure prone IMSB as it begins to disintegrate. As the IMS and bearings are below the crankshaft, the majority of the oil windage from the IMS and bearing are going to go right in the sump, not anywhere near the scavenge pumps, as they say - Elvis(oil) has left the pressure circuit. But - I will admit that I have no idea where they are in the engine, it would be strange to find them near, or below the IMS, where they might be suitable to put a magnet for protection. I'm willing to be advised otherwise of course.
Lastly, as I mentioned, a magnet presumes to retain the particles in the engine, where they live on forever until the engine is taken down. I want whatever is in there, to come out of there, and leave via the oil, filter, or mag outside the filter, or manual cleaning of the drain plug. I don't want it to stay in the engine where it's another little time bomb just waiting to be released into the oil circuit again.
03-07-2017, 07:44 PM
#9
Drifting
You clearly missed the original discussion of this issue.Nor are you accepting the distinction between maintenance and catastrophic failure. As I explained previously this is not my idea. Much smarter people came up with it for some of the reasons cited. And since I have rebuilt the M96 down to the last circlip, I completely respect their experience,knowledge.skill and kind advice.
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Ok, but I'm going to explain why this still doesn't make sense. I'm not adverse to intriguing solutions to failure, but not sure where this goes.
As its name implies, a scavenge pump draws up fluid from a distant location, and returns it to a well. In the oiling system of an engine, it would take the oil AFTER having gone through the circuit(including all the bearings), and delivering it to the sump, where the mag drain plug resides.
Second, presuming the failure mode is ferrous where a magnet would help, we're talking about scarf from the IMSB, IMS, crankshaft, rods, oil pump housing, or cams. I"m guessing there's more Fe in the engine, but these are the big things that release Fe into the circuit. I can presume that if one of the cylinders begins to come apart(D-chunk), we're done for the day, and even the largest magnet in the world will do no good.
Presumably, we're looking at detritus from the failure prone IMSB as it begins to disintegrate. As the IMS and bearings are below the crankshaft, the majority of the oil windage from the IMS and bearing are going to go right in the sump, not anywhere near the scavenge pumps, as they say - Elvis(oil) has left the pressure circuit. But - I will admit that I have no idea where they are in the engine, it would be strange to find them near, or below the IMS, where they might be suitable to put a magnet for protection. I'm willing to be advised otherwise of course.
Lastly, as I mentioned, a magnet presumes to retain the particles in the engine, where they live on forever until the engine is taken down. I want whatever is in there, to come out of there, and leave via the oil, filter, or mag outside the filter, or manual cleaning of the drain plug. I don't want it to stay in the engine where it's another little time bomb just waiting to be released into the oil circuit again.
As its name implies, a scavenge pump draws up fluid from a distant location, and returns it to a well. In the oiling system of an engine, it would take the oil AFTER having gone through the circuit(including all the bearings), and delivering it to the sump, where the mag drain plug resides.
Second, presuming the failure mode is ferrous where a magnet would help, we're talking about scarf from the IMSB, IMS, crankshaft, rods, oil pump housing, or cams. I"m guessing there's more Fe in the engine, but these are the big things that release Fe into the circuit. I can presume that if one of the cylinders begins to come apart(D-chunk), we're done for the day, and even the largest magnet in the world will do no good.
Presumably, we're looking at detritus from the failure prone IMSB as it begins to disintegrate. As the IMS and bearings are below the crankshaft, the majority of the oil windage from the IMS and bearing are going to go right in the sump, not anywhere near the scavenge pumps, as they say - Elvis(oil) has left the pressure circuit. But - I will admit that I have no idea where they are in the engine, it would be strange to find them near, or below the IMS, where they might be suitable to put a magnet for protection. I'm willing to be advised otherwise of course.
Lastly, as I mentioned, a magnet presumes to retain the particles in the engine, where they live on forever until the engine is taken down. I want whatever is in there, to come out of there, and leave via the oil, filter, or mag outside the filter, or manual cleaning of the drain plug. I don't want it to stay in the engine where it's another little time bomb just waiting to be released into the oil circuit again.
03-07-2017, 08:07 PM
#10
Shameful Thread Killer
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You clearly missed the original discussion of this issue.Nor are you accepting the distinction between maintenance and catastrophic failure. As I explained previously this is not my idea. Much smarter people came up with it for some of the reasons cited. And since I have rebuilt the M96 down to the last circlip, I completely respect their experience,knowledge.skill and kind advice.
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03-07-2017, 09:22 PM
#11
Racer
Thread Starter
Wow. So anyway...
the filter area of the stock cartridge is bigger than the Napa gold. My thinking was that was not the direction I wanted to head. Now that I have thought about it, even with additional filter area, what use is the stock element if it only filters a percentage of pumped oil? Plus, the original factory oil change intervals probably could use the additional filter capacity. Since we all know that the M96 should have its oil changed within 4-6k miles, the filter never sees a condition where it is so full of particulate that is bypasses ( except where catastrophic failure happens).
Thanks guys. I think I have answered my own question. Change to a spin on using the LN adapter and move on.
the filter area of the stock cartridge is bigger than the Napa gold. My thinking was that was not the direction I wanted to head. Now that I have thought about it, even with additional filter area, what use is the stock element if it only filters a percentage of pumped oil? Plus, the original factory oil change intervals probably could use the additional filter capacity. Since we all know that the M96 should have its oil changed within 4-6k miles, the filter never sees a condition where it is so full of particulate that is bypasses ( except where catastrophic failure happens).
Thanks guys. I think I have answered my own question. Change to a spin on using the LN adapter and move on.
03-08-2017, 12:18 PM
#12
Race Director
Wow. So anyway...
the filter area of the stock cartridge is bigger than the Napa gold. My thinking was that was not the direction I wanted to head. Now that I have thought about it, even with additional filter area, what use is the stock element if it only filters a percentage of pumped oil? Plus, the original factory oil change intervals probably could use the additional filter capacity. Since we all know that the M96 should have its oil changed within 4-6k miles, the filter never sees a condition where it is so full of particulate that is bypasses ( except where catastrophic failure happens).
Thanks guys. I think I have answered my own question. Change to a spin on using the LN adapter and move on.
the filter area of the stock cartridge is bigger than the Napa gold. My thinking was that was not the direction I wanted to head. Now that I have thought about it, even with additional filter area, what use is the stock element if it only filters a percentage of pumped oil? Plus, the original factory oil change intervals probably could use the additional filter capacity. Since we all know that the M96 should have its oil changed within 4-6k miles, the filter never sees a condition where it is so full of particulate that is bypasses ( except where catastrophic failure happens).
Thanks guys. I think I have answered my own question. Change to a spin on using the LN adapter and move on.
If the oil pressure is too high -- as might be the case at cold start and if one doesn't keep the RPMs low -- the bypass saves the filter from being subjected to over pressure.
There may be a bypass that is part of where the filter housing attaches that in the (very unlikely) event the filter becomes blocked the engine continues to receive oil.
The stock filter has a lot of filter area. So much so that at least for my 2002 Boxster while the factory service schedule called for 15K mile oil changes the filter wasn't scheduled to be changed for 30K miles.
The time a filter will be the dirtiest -- under normal conditions -- is in a new engine.
When I changed the oil in my new 2008 Cayman S at 750 miles the oil filter housing oil had a metallic sheen to it due to all of the very fine aluminum the engine had shed and the larger pieces being pulverized by going through the pump over and over again as the result of the oil pressure bypass.
The oil had considerable larger trash -- mostly sealant fragments -- and the element likewise had considerable trash. However, the filter had sufficient surface area -- unfold one and you'll be amazed at how much surface area there is -- that having the filter plugged and some other filter bypass then routing unfiltered oil to the engine was not a concern.
I'm sure had the unfiltered oil been routed to the engine the lifters would have acted to trap that fine stuff.
All you need to do is run a good filter and an approved oil with a multi-viscosity grade suitable for where you live and drive and change the filter and the oil at reasonable intervals. I've run the Porsche filter in my cars since day 1 -- I did buy an "OEM" filter but a side by side comparison of it to a "factory" filter gave me the ******* and I never used the "OEM" filter -- and change the filter and oil every 5K miles and both engines are just fine. The Boxser with almost 310K miles and the Turbo now with over 152K miles.
When I changed the oil in my Porsches (and before these other cars) I never bothered to cut the filter open or even capture the filter oil in a clean container -- other than the 2 times I changed the Cayman's oil.
I run no magnets, attach no rabbit feet to the keychain, utter no prayers to keep the evil spirits at bay. Just reasonable oil/filter servicing. Dull maybe. But it works.
03-08-2017, 02:10 PM
#13
Rennlist Member
the problem with the original filter on the engine is not the filtering capabilities, it weakness is that the filter bypass is built into the filter housing itself, and over time the spring becomes weaker and bypass is open longer if not stays open allowing unfiltered oil thru the system. so if staying with factory set up, replace the filter housing every so often. oil press regulator is doing its job, without it on cold climates and cold starts, we could be blowing the filter housing (plastic) right off the motor. I remember back in the early 2000 we had some new engine designs coming out for eztreme heavy equipment 30 liters engine that the engine engineer decided to have a oil press regulator dump return to the inlet of the oil pump and winter came, they were blowing 4 oil filters gallon size off the motor along with about 60 gallons of oil on the ground, and these engine had aux oil pump built on to the starter to pre oil the engine for 30 second before cold start, so back to the drawing board and find a way to dump to the sump. just like our engines do. so press regulator plays a important part in the the factory are trying to achieve with mileage, so we see drops in oil viscosity and lower oil pressure to increase mileage.
05-12-2018, 04:37 PM
#15
I took apart my stock oil filter canister. The bypass in the bottom of the canister will pop out if you pull on it with plyers. The spring bypass mechanism seemed fully intack and still pretty strong. Meaning, I don't think the spring weakened compared to the new canister I purchased. I really wonder how much bypassing really happens if you don't push the car during cold start. I am saying that old spring still seemed to be seating very firmly.