Fister III ceramic coating
12-11-2014, 11:01 AM
#31
Rennlist Member
Stage III's in Velvet Black with black tips. Still looking like I'd just installed them. Can attest to CCPcoatings remarks. Wasted money by having my track MINI's header bright ceramic-coated. A couple of sessions on track and the high exhaust temp of a supercharged engine turned the coating to chalk.
12-11-2014, 11:52 AM
#32
Typically only the exterior of a muffler is going to be coated. It will certainly reduce radiated temps and will also cool much quicker than the raw substrate. This is VERY beneficial in any SS pipes / components in that they radiate so much heat. Scavenging / flow benefits will be seen in header and turbo components but this inst really applicable in multi-layer muffler applications.
Although most commonly used SS's will not rust away like a mild or aluminized steel, they WILL oxidize and corrode. Case in point, the $10K, fully polished 304SS Ferrari F-430 system below. That said, despite the functional benefits of the ceramic, most coat the components for aesthetic purposes.
Although most commonly used SS's will not rust away like a mild or aluminized steel, they WILL oxidize and corrode. Case in point, the $10K, fully polished 304SS Ferrari F-430 system below. That said, despite the functional benefits of the ceramic, most coat the components for aesthetic purposes.
Shouldn't we all have heat discoloration in the lower rear fender locations, from the extreme amounts of radiated heat from our current, non-ceramic coated SS cans?
Especially considering the age of these vehicles and repeated heat cycles they've gone through!With regards to the cost/benefit factor, my Fisters will NOT be ceramic coated, and because of their hidden location, it is doubtful I would take the time to apply heat resistant paint...
Function before fluff
But please don't let me dissuade anyone from the $195.00 ceramic coating appearance pkg., on their hidden muffler cans...Doesn't the cost almost pay for the goldenrod upgrade?Now there's money well spent!
Last edited by nine9six; 12-11-2014 at 08:49 PM.
12-16-2014, 07:40 PM
#36
Pardon me for saying so, but those are some of the poorest weld beads I've seen in a long time! 
Perhaps it's the fact that the cans are hidden, which is why such little care is employed?
The $200 ceramic coating doesn't do much for those ugly welds
Perhaps it's the fact that the cans are hidden, which is why such little care is employed?
The $200 ceramic coating doesn't do much for those ugly welds
Last edited by nine9six; 12-18-2014 at 01:45 PM.
12-16-2014, 07:57 PM
#37
Rennlist Member
I have II's with Mag Silver ... went with Black Velvet Wide ovals. It seems like there is less radiated heat ... no proof only my biased observation. I have run them just short of 4 years and they still clean up nicely ... sorry no recent pics.
12-17-2014, 01:23 AM
#39
12-17-2014, 03:20 PM
#40
For the record those are not FD welds you are referring to. These are a second set of mufflers I sent in which had some work done on them by a previous owner and Darin converted to Stage II's. Was a great opportunity to get Stage II's and retain my original set...Point was to show the coating... But I know what you're sayin'
Most likely I am tainted having examined welds to contractual weld requirements in the aircraft/aerospace industry; of which, ASW/ANSI auto standards may seem to pale in comparison? Of course this would only be applicable if the Fister modifications are welded, inspected and accepted to any stated standard. The welds in the photo appear to a significant degree, less than professional.
As for the finish, I can achieve the same "look" with a rattle can of shiny aluminum silver paint for $5 bux.
Truth be told, I am actually more of a, "functional appearance" kind of guy. This being said, a wire wheel "brushed look" would probably be more to my liking if I had to have a "look" applied to my set of Fisters.
For those of you that like shiny. 300 series stainless can be polished to a chrome like shine! Imagine how that would look all hidden and tucked up into the haunches of your 993 rear fenders!
WoooHooo!!!
Last edited by nine9six; 12-18-2014 at 01:47 PM.
12-17-2014, 08:36 PM
#41
Rennlist Member
Yes, those welds on the bottom of those mufflers were there already. Someone before me tried to modify them.
I think we do a quality TIG weld over the existing factory weld. Better than the factory MIG welds. The material we have to deal with is sometimes not the best. 19 year old mufflers that have been exposed to exhaust and exterior elements that are tough to clean and not always easy to weld. To say our welds are somehow subpar or not held to any standard is incorrect. I hold the quality of work we put out to a very high standard.
As for the ceramic coating, it is optional. If you don't want it please DO NOT order it. You will get no high pressure sales from me.
That being said, I think the ceramic is a great product. It is all about function and not form. It just happens to look cool. It reduces the radiant heat that the mufflers produce, which is good since the mufflers are tucked up tight next to the engine. It also has good corrosion resistance. If you don't think our mufflers corrode, think again. I have seen thousands of sets, and depending on climate and usage, they can corrode beyond use. The ceramic will make the mufflers exterior last longer. As for the price of ceramic, it is not BBQ heat paint. It costs over $400 a gallon for the good stuff
Here is some testing info from one of the coatings websites: http://www.cerakoteguncoatings.com/r...-HEAT-TEST.pdf
I think we do a quality TIG weld over the existing factory weld. Better than the factory MIG welds. The material we have to deal with is sometimes not the best. 19 year old mufflers that have been exposed to exhaust and exterior elements that are tough to clean and not always easy to weld. To say our welds are somehow subpar or not held to any standard is incorrect. I hold the quality of work we put out to a very high standard.
As for the ceramic coating, it is optional. If you don't want it please DO NOT order it. You will get no high pressure sales from me.
That being said, I think the ceramic is a great product. It is all about function and not form. It just happens to look cool. It reduces the radiant heat that the mufflers produce, which is good since the mufflers are tucked up tight next to the engine. It also has good corrosion resistance. If you don't think our mufflers corrode, think again. I have seen thousands of sets, and depending on climate and usage, they can corrode beyond use. The ceramic will make the mufflers exterior last longer. As for the price of ceramic, it is not BBQ heat paint. It costs over $400 a gallon for the good stuff
Here is some testing info from one of the coatings websites: http://www.cerakoteguncoatings.com/r...-HEAT-TEST.pdf
12-17-2014, 10:36 PM
#42
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
My Cans arrived today for a good old Fistering. I have decided to go Black. My thoughts and reasoning is with the bonnets (hoods, for most of you guys) of Lotus Cortinas, it was all about heat dissipation in them days too.
For sure the Ceramic will protect the original Stainless as it can be subjected to a rough environment up in those rear fenders.
I work in Aerospace also and nothing looks wrong with those welds above.
The sound of it all is just something I will have to wait for. Hope it's not another long winter.
For sure the Ceramic will protect the original Stainless as it can be subjected to a rough environment up in those rear fenders.
I work in Aerospace also and nothing looks wrong with those welds above.
The sound of it all is just something I will have to wait for. Hope it's not another long winter.
12-18-2014, 02:22 PM
#43
Yes, those welds on the bottom of those mufflers were there already. Someone before me tried to modify them.
I think we do a quality TIG weld over the existing factory weld. Better than the factory MIG welds. The material we have to deal with is sometimes not the best. 19 year old mufflers that have been exposed to exhaust and exterior elements that are tough to clean and not always easy to weld. To say our welds are somehow subpar or not held to any standard is incorrect. I hold the quality of work we put out to a very high standard.
As for the ceramic coating, it is optional. If you don't want it please DO NOT order it. You will get no high pressure sales from me.
That being said, I think the ceramic is a great product. It is all about function and not form. It just happens to look cool. It reduces the radiant heat that the mufflers produce, which is good since the mufflers are tucked up tight next to the engine. It also has good corrosion resistance. If you don't think our mufflers corrode, think again. I have seen thousands of sets, and depending on climate and usage, they can corrode beyond use. The ceramic will make the mufflers exterior last longer. As for the price of ceramic, it is not BBQ heat paint. It costs over $400 a gallon for the good stuff
Here is some testing info from one of the coatings websites: http://www.cerakoteguncoatings.com/r...-HEAT-TEST.pdf
I think we do a quality TIG weld over the existing factory weld. Better than the factory MIG welds. The material we have to deal with is sometimes not the best. 19 year old mufflers that have been exposed to exhaust and exterior elements that are tough to clean and not always easy to weld. To say our welds are somehow subpar or not held to any standard is incorrect. I hold the quality of work we put out to a very high standard.
As for the ceramic coating, it is optional. If you don't want it please DO NOT order it. You will get no high pressure sales from me.
That being said, I think the ceramic is a great product. It is all about function and not form. It just happens to look cool. It reduces the radiant heat that the mufflers produce, which is good since the mufflers are tucked up tight next to the engine. It also has good corrosion resistance. If you don't think our mufflers corrode, think again. I have seen thousands of sets, and depending on climate and usage, they can corrode beyond use. The ceramic will make the mufflers exterior last longer. As for the price of ceramic, it is not BBQ heat paint. It costs over $400 a gallon for the good stuff
Here is some testing info from one of the coatings websites: http://www.cerakoteguncoatings.com/r...-HEAT-TEST.pdf
I would be curious as to the external temps on a side by side test panel; one coated, and one without coating, using the same parent material. Test results, without a baseline are somewhat meaningless. In other words, as compared to what?
If the coated panel radiated 220-250 degrees F; and an uncoated panel radiated 350-380'ish F, then I would say this is a wonderfully effective product as a heat inhibitor/barrier. As for parent metal protection; panels would have to have been put through a myriad of salt spray, environmental, and temp testing in order to be proven as an effective protective coating.
Test data tells the tale.
P.S. My comments are not intended to bash the product or processes, but rather to get people thinking before shelling out hard earned $$$, with nothing more than words from marketing.
I applaud Darin for chiming in and providing a glimpse of some of the coating data. And for the record, I do shop at FD Motorsports!
Despite not being from Missouri, I'm still a "show me" kinda guy...Comes from years of QA & Engineering requirements review on behalf of John Q Taxpayer, prior to acceptance of product for our men and women on the battlefield. Yeah, I know its an ugly job, but somebody has to do it...
12-18-2014, 02:44 PM
#44
Rennlist Member
Sidenote to the ceramic coating discussion, (my III's and tips are black and I love them) I took a flight out of maryland to wisconsin yesterday with my girlfriend and bought myself the latest European Car magazine. Low and behold there is an article on Darin's famous mufflers in the back. Way cool! I'd put a link here but can't find one online, I should just take a pic
...
Here we go..
...Here we go..
