Gary JR

OP your setup seems really close to a "pure" one.

bucklesandrings

I had the 991.1 GTS with PDK and hated that box. Reason was that the car hunted 7th gear and I was forever chugging along in 7th. I believe the manual has the same ratios.

So please tell us how the 7 speed manual feels, as I too am contemplating manual on next car.

chuckbdc

My PDK C2S when in either Sport or Sport Plus in manual mode (where I spend much of the time) does not hunt for 7th gear. I have to purposely shift up to it. Actually, it generally does not get to 7th gear even when it is in automatic mode. Mostly I like the Sport Chrono mappings for what they do to the shocks and engine mounts. Having a choice of stiffer or softer settings make it worth while to me. That is independent of what I like about manual or PDK transmissions.

crossroads

Regarding 7th gear, I've used it more than I thought I would. I throw it in 7th when I'm cruising on the expressway and its not too tall. I don't use 7th except on the expressway.

911boy

Was going to mention this to dealer next time I'm in. Tough to get smooth and a little notchy. The rest is perfect.
I love rev matching myself, thats 90% of the MT experience for me.

AG911

Please share the results after you talk with the dealer.

BlackBeauty

I've heard that if you heel-toe you can override or defeat the rev marching feature.

I went from a .1 manual to a .2 PDK.

I agree if you want a manual, you're going to want to heel-toe, so ordering without the SC may be the way to go. You'll still have a "Sport button" which will Justine for enhanced throttle mapping.

I'm surprised people like the rev matching so much in the manual - yes it's cool but it also takes some of the skill out of keeping the car balanced, which I think is what you'd be looking for in manual.

Manuals are awesome, it's sad they're hard to come by and the popularity of the 911R, GT4 and Boxster Spyder kind of says it all - given a choice that's what a lot of us would want.

That being said, I'm trying to embrace the new technology and like everything it has it's pros and cons. Trust me - if you're a skilled driver you're connected to the car - at leisure or at speed, it's up to you as the driver to exploit the positives and minimize the negatives. Driving a car that does 0-60 in around 3 seconds while in "manual" mode in sport+ is a lot of fun -the feeling of the transmission banging into the engine with its mounts on the firmest setting is like hearing and feeling Thor bang his hammer against an anvil.

Rambler_13

Count me as one who appreciates the rev matching feature. If it takes out some of the skill, where does that leave PDK on the necessary skills spectrum? One of the often praised features of PDK is its perfectly executed rev matching. But program the same function in a manual and it's blasphemy! For me, the primary enjoyment of driving a manual vs. pdk does not come from practicing and optimizing my rev matching skills, there are other factors that make it enjoyable too. However, if I want to have some fun rev matching here and there, I can take it out of sport plus and go at it.

NoGaBiker

While I agree with this in theory, BlackBeauty, in practice it doesn't seem true. We ARE given a choice -- every Carrera made can be had with a 7M, yet apparently only a small number of people spec them. Sure, dealerships order a bunch of PDKs for the lot. But I don't think that's because they are trying to force people to buy what people don't want. If they were doing that just to make us pay the extra 4k for PDK, why not spec all the lot cars with PDCC, which costs 4k also?

Seems like a small number of people -- maybe mostly people who will be buying used -- are adamant about wanting manuals but when it's time to buy a new 911, people keep buying PDKs.

By the way, I'm not a PDK defender, or whatever. I have one right now -- my first Porsche with a DCT -- but have had all 6Ms up to this point in my life. If I were buying another tomorrow I honestly don't know which I'd get. My desire for each is that close; it would be a hard decision. Which surprises me -- like you I ordered this PDK because I wanted to live with the new tech for awhile. Thought it would be a one-and-done for me and I'd go back to manual. But it's not that simple.

Anyway, notwithstanding what's on dealer lots, I can't believe that anyone who is buying a new 911 and wants a manual would accept a PDK car because that's all he can find on the lot, when waiting 12 weeks would solve that problem and get you exactly what you want. Sure, I might settle for a color or some interior options I didn't want in order to avoid the wait. But the type of gearbox? That's hard to believe.

Penn4S

I agree with NoGa. I have never owned a PDK 911 after owning over 8 911's. I did have a PDK Panamera 4 while in between 911 cars and even though I really appreciated the technology I did not enjoy my lack of involvement with the car. This by no means says that those that like PDK feel the same. This was just my experience.

So when it came to finding a new 911 I searched till I found an MT car I really liked. I would not have settled for a PDK car no matter how difficult the search.

That said to each his own on what choice they make. Many PDK owners are former MT owners who appreciate the new technology. For me shifting .3 seconds faster is not a priority at this time. I'm just into enjoying the car and and after 40 years of driving MT still trying to get better at it. I appreciate the rev matching even though I can heel/toe, I think the new tech is more efficient than I doing the same thing. Does not diminish the value of the ride for me at all.

Gary JR

Good idea putting that qualifier in there.

NoGaBiker

If I understand your point correctly, you're saying, "Hey, everybody's not like you. Some/Many people want a manual but take what's on the lot, which is PDK."

If I've understood you correctly, I'd point you back to the context of my writing; I was replying to Blackbeauty's assertion that the popularity of GT4, 911R, B-Spyder indicates that a manual is what "the people really want." And my point is that if the people really want that, it's easily had. The definition of "not really wanting it, but maybe having it as a mild preference" is foregoing a manual gearbox for a PDK because one would have to spec it himself and wait 2-3 months for it to come in.

R_Rated

It's much harder to get on the used market for those of us that can't afford(me) or can't justify a new car. My hypothesis is that manual buyers tend to hold on a lot longer also. When I was looking, I waiting for some time to get a deal and did not find a manual even close to what I was looking for.

NoGaBiker

So there's that big of a statistical delta between buyers of $85,000 used 991s and buyers of $110,000 new 991s to where there's a much bigger demand for manuals in used 991s than in new ones? I would think those numbers are close enough that there wouldn't be a meaningful divergence. In fact, for the hardcore manualista, I'd think you would stretch a little and order a new stripped Carrera 7M, or even a loaded Cayman S 7M, rather than settle for a PDK used Carrera S at about the same price.

Look, all I'm saying is this: there's a lot of pissing and moaning about "no manuals" on RList, but when it comes time to make some sacrifices to get our beloved manuals, not many people seem to do it.

Until the PDK came out I was in that camp; I would, quite literally, have driven a Miata for the rest of my life if Porsches only came with Tiptronics. That is not hyperbole. If I can't choose the gears myself with precision and without a torque converter lurking between me and the drive wheels, I'd just as soon not have a sports car. No way I'd spend 991 money -- used or new -- and settle for a transmission I didn't want.

And speaking of Miatas: back in 2002, after years of listening to Miata boards rail about how "we just want a simple, autocross or club track day-ready Miata, stripped of luxury but with the good parts installed, as light as possible," Mazda brought out the 2002 Miata Club Sport. A special edition limited to -- are you ready for this? -- 50 copies. Many languished on lots and sold at a discount nearly a year later. "But... but... but... it doesn't have air conditioning, or tunes!!!"

Manufacturers generally build what their dealers order, and dealers order what they can sell. Nobody on this board ought to complain about availability of manuals; Porsche leads the way in offering cars with manuals. Hell, till very recently the Cayenne GTS could be had in manual. So if you want manuals, order one if you can't buy one off the lot. Take one for the team. Create that perfect used car for the next guy.

R_Rated

I wouldn't own a pre PDK non manual Porsche regardless of any other variables. I was also on the fence since I have knee issues from jumping out of too many planes in the army. When I was shopping(for 6 months hunting), I couldn't find a manual that had the majority of options I wanted and an S/Cab.

For me it was learning that you can pull both paddles on concert and put the car in N, rev and back in gear at the end of a turn that made me compromise. The PDK is more than marketing.